Replies

1. 
   BenM | May 06, 2004 03:36pm | #1

   I have set it back up to cut full width thin shavings and it seems to do fine. 

   If it can do that and it leaves a nice surface finish then your plane is doing everything it's supposed to do.

2. 
   jackiechan | May 06, 2004 08:31pm | #2

   Dale,

   I concur with the thought that if it works for you, and you're happy with the performance, it is tuned properly.

   Almost any plane, if well tuned, can give excellent performance (to a point).  You are correct, that the Lie Nielsen and Veritas planes are almost 100% ready to go out of the box - but it can be looked at from another point.  Your plane took some time to set up and tune.  In doing this, you've gained a greater understanding of the mechanical and structural aspects of the tool.  Secondly, your plane may take a certain amount of finesse and practice to achieve the ultimate wood surface - but both of these can be regarded as good things.  A greater understanding of any tool is a benefit on many different levels.  Becoming proficient at a tool that might need a little extra finesse is invaluable, because after learning these skills, any other tool you may use in the future will be almost easy (relatively speaking) to use.

   If you have any questions, please feel free to ask!

   Dan Kornfeld, Owner/President - Odyssey Wood Design, Inc.

1. 
   Dalewood | May 07, 2004 04:31am | #5

   Thanks Dan for the advice and the encouragement.   Dale

3. 
   Alan | May 07, 2004 02:37am | #3

   Dale,

   I agree with what's already been said:  if your plane takes off thin shavings, doesn't chatter or tear out, and leaves a nice surface, it's performing pretty well.  I would like to make a couple points, though.

   I've heard stories of planes ready to go right out of the box, but I've never seen one.  I have two Lie-Nielsen planes and one Lee Valley, and all three were not ready to go when I got them.  All required minimal fettling, but all definitely needed some, and all the irons certainly needed sharpening.  Perhaps I could have made a shaving or two with them right out of the box, but with a bit of fussing all three now give me excellent results, much better than they could "out of the box."  So with that in mind:

   Sharpening and setting up a plane are necessary skills for anyone who wants to use them.  Many subtle things can affect performance way out of proportion to the amount of change.  For example, setting the mouth finer, moving the back iron closer to the edge, putting a crown on the iron (or the reverse of these) and much more are small alterations in the plane's set-up; but each one can dramatically affect the quality of the plane's performance.  So even though you're getting good results, it's undoubtedly possible to get even better results by fine tuning your plane.

   One last thing.  Sharpening an iron so it will shave the hair on your arm isn't the best test of sharpness.  An iron can be rather dull--for working wood--and still shave hair.  It took me a good long time to learn this sad fact (DAMHIKT) and longer to learn how to get my cutting tools really sharp.  But once you've used a truly sharp iron in a well-tuned plane, you'll find it's worth the effort.

   Alan

1. 
   Dalewood | May 07, 2004 04:29am | #4

   Alan,  So what is the difference from shave the hair on your arm sharp and really sharp?

1. 
   Alan | May 08, 2004 03:06am | #6

   Dalewood,

   Really sharp is sharper (sorry, I couldn't resist).

   Try this experiment.

   With your newly sharpened iron--not in the plane--and a piece of poplar, pine or other softwood that's prone to mash down instead of cutting cleanly, shave the end grain.  A truly sharp iron will take an actual shaving and will leave the end grain smooth, almost burnished, without mashing the wood anywhere; all the end grain will be cut, not torn or mashed.  If your iron can do that, it's really sharp.

   Then try this:  when sharpening a dull iron, stop just when it will shave arm hair, and then try to shave some mushy-wood end grain as above.  This is a pretty good way of seeing what I meant by really sharp.

   When my eyes still served for such things, I used the "Newton" test.  To use that test, with the edge pointing at you, look carefully at the edge (I always used a 10X magnifying glass).  If you see even a hint of a white line, or a dark line with white spots or short white lines mixed in, the iron isn't sharp.  On a really sharp edge the bevel and back are flat planes, and where they meet they narrow down to nothing at all.  So a really sharp edge will reflect no light--there's nothing there to reflect it, and the back and bevel reflect off somewhere else; looking through a magnifying glass, or even a microscope, the edge will be a single, very very thin black line.  Any "white" means the edge is rounded, and not as sharp as it can be.

   Alan (going on way too long again)

1. 
   MarkRoderick | May 10, 2004 08:36pm | #7

   I must have tougher hair. If a blade will shave my arm it will easily pass the end-grain test. In fact, when the blade will shave my arm it will almost shave pine end-grain just of its own weight, without my using any pressure. I've never tried a magnifying glass.

   My question, which I've never bothered experimenting to answer, is how long a plane blade retains that initial super-sharpness. I bet that on something like red oak it retains it for about 3/4 of an inch of planing.

1. 
   Alan | May 11, 2004 03:10am | #9

   I stand corrected:  a blade is super-sharp if it will shave the hair on Mark's arm.

   As to how long it will last, it does depend on what you're planing, but IME it depends more on how the iron is sharpened, the type of steel, the effective cutting angle, how the plane is being used...  I've not noticed that red oak dulls an iron particularly quickly.

   Alan

2. 
   GHR | May 10, 2004 09:41pm | #8

   Perhaps it is important to note that just because you can perform any of these tests it does not mean that the edge is suitable or properly sharpened for the intended use.

   A dull axe leaves a very good finish on wood. But the same edge will not work well in a plane.