I have a 14″ Powermatic Bandsaw and I would like to do some resawing. I have followed the suggested bs setup on thewoodwhisper.com. I have reviewed the article on FWW about setting up the bandsaw and adjusting the guides. I have built a new auxiliary fence that is tall and square to the table which is also square to my blade which is a nice new Timberwolf 3tpi blade that I have tensioned and adjusted the fence for blade drift so I’m set for resawing right…..WRONG!!!!!!
When i start the cut I find myself starting on my cut line then a few seconds later it starts to drifting in towards the fence making the cut thinner. To adjust this I try to reduce the amount of pressure I put on the side of the board as I’m pushing it and when this is done I find that the entire piece that I’m trying to resaw stands away from the fence.
Is there something that I can do to fix this problem. If needed, I can post some pictures of my not so good attempts at resawing. Thanks!
Bio
Replies
I have the same set up. The harder the wood and the wider the board, the more you need to allow for some flexing or wandering that the planer can take care of later. If you are having this problem with a 4" wide peice of poplar, something is wrong. If you are having it with an 11" tall piece of maple, it sounds like par for the course.
Mine is more on the 4" side.
These can help on the infeed side:
http://www.grip-tite.com/
You may want to check your tracking.
Did you follow the timberwold tightening instructions? They're differnt from many that have the balde much tighter.
I did the tensioning as described by Timberwolf and it doesn't seem to make much difference. I'll check the product out that you are talking about.
Bio
Have you tried adjusting the angle of the fence relative to the blade? I don't mean square to the table surface, which should be perpandicular to the blade, but relative to the plane defined by the body of the blade fore and aft. Sometimes, a little adjustment will make a significant difference, although it is pretty common to have a touch of wander if you're cutting wide, hard stock. It may also be helpful to slow your feed rate a bit.
Verne
If a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to cut it up and make something with it . . . what a waste!
I'm not sure I understand why I would want to adjust the angle of the fence. If the table is perpendicular to the blade and then the fence is perpendicular to the table then one would assume that the fence and the blade are perpendicular so angling the fence (assuming you mean vertically) would not do much would it?
I'm wondering how much tension and guide settings play into this overall dilemma?
Bio
I'm suggesting that the blade has a tendency to cut in a direction not necessarily perpendicular to the plane that the wheels turn in. Your fence may be perfectly square to the table, which may be perfectly square to the vertical line of the blade, but there is another axis. Consider a hand saw that is set a tad more to one side than the other; if you give it its head, it will tend to wander to one side of the line you're trying to cut. I've had the same experience with band saws. If your saw wants to cut toward the fence, try changing the fence angle by moving the outfeed end just a tad to the right, or the infeed end to the left. Other way around if it wanders consistently away from the fence. This is the same issue that you have to deal with if the fence on your table saw isn't parallel to the blade. Verne
If a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to cut it up and make something with it . . . what a waste!<!----><!----><!---->
Verne, you are correct , the fence must be set for the drift of the blade under load.
Tom
I have set the drift angle but you must remember that this drift angle was simply a 2x4 laid flat that had a jointed edge and a line struck down the center. I have no problem cutting through anything that is laying horizontal. It is the vertical that gives the HUGE problem.
Bio
Ok, I'll give it a try.
you hit the nail on the head. had this problem and solved it by resetting the fence angle. done
A very interesting thread. Of course there is another way, one I saw demonstrated a few years a go at the Williamsburg conference. Mack Headley, the Master at the Hay Shop, picked up a panel saw, and commenced to cut a 1/16+ veneer slice from a 12" or so wide piece of mahogany. I expect that saw was in very good condition. It probably also helps to be superbly coordinated and very experienced.
Edited 2/7/2009 12:48 pm ET by SteveSchoene
Steve,That's a good trick - one that I haven't heard of before. Kind of reminiscent of the story that kind of goes like this (can't remember who it was): Woodworkers cuts half of a dovetail joint and passes it around to his audience. They study the piece while he cuts the second half. When the first half makes it back to him, he puts the joint together and it fits!Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
> panel saw, and commenced to cut a 1/16+ veneer slice from a 12" or so wide piece of mahogany.<Impressive demonstration.However doing that on some bubinga or similarly very hard wood is a whole different world. I have hand resawed plenty on that kind of stuff and makes a bandsaw seem like I have died and gone to heaven.roc
I've had the same problems with my 14" Delta. A while back, I went on a buying spree at Iturra Design. I got their improved tension spring, a tension gauge, polyurethane tires and carbide blades. I can't really say which of these, or the combination of them did the trick, but the saw resaws better now. The tension gauge is an interesting gadget. If you believe what Iturrra says (I do), getting proper tension for a given blade is significantly important.
I'll look this device up.
Bio,
B4 you start throwing money at your problem take a 4" board and mark a straight line on one edge, actually both edged if you can make them both exactly in the center of each side. Take the board to your BS (BandSaw) and without the fence interfering (Did I say freehand?), cut the board on the line part way through and shut the BS off, leaving the board in place.
Did you have to cant the board to stay on the line?
Bear in mind that noone in here can see what you're doing or anything with regard to your BS - there are WAY many variables and most likely no one answer will solve the problem. Either that or this discussion may well top the long one in hand tools.
You'll get it, just hang in there. Besides it's prolly that dang wood anyway. :-)
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Ha, I would be more than happy to post a group of pictures or even a video to show my "user error" :)
bio
Bio,
Ummmmm, I sure didn't mean to imply user error but ye kin post the pics if ya like!
:-)
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
No problem, but as we say in the computer world....95% of all computer errors are user errors :)
Bio
I had a similar issue a year or so back, I have a cheep General International (I think it is international, but I know it is one of the generals) Band saw. A little 14". I do not tend to do much with a band saw, but I had an old one and when I had to replace all the tools, I had to buy a replacement or let the insurance company eat 25% of the value of the saw, so I picked up the General. Anyway it worked ok for most things but I tried to resaw some clear pine about 4" thick, and it did not work worth a hoot. So I was pretty down on the saw. Then I was at a wood show in Michigan at a local lumber mill/tool store, and a guy from on of the wood worker TV shows was at the show doing tips and tricks. I miss remember his name, and do not have any way to look it up right now, but He and his wife did a show a while back on building their own house. Mostly he does standard wood worker TV shows, and he loves to use band saws.
Anyhow, he was talking that most of the issues people have with band saws comes from one of two things. The first is, if the blade teeth hit one of the guides, will will most likely knock the set out of the teeth on that side, and you will never get the blade to track right again. In that case buy a new blade. The other thing he pointed out was that a LOT of band saws are not adjusted correctly for parallel wheels.
So I took those ideas, and went home. One new blade, and I took the whole saw apart and put it back together (not a fun task and took most of a afternoon) fixed the wheels to be parallel to each other, and put the new blade on. Made sure the guides did not hit the teeth, and adjusted tension. Tried out the saw and it worked like a charm. Tried out some 6" or so Cherry and it worked for that. Now many BF of pine (and cherry) latter and it still cuts pretty much right on the line. No drift. A little movement but one pass with the planer and that is taken care of.
I could not belive how well a cheep saw like this one worked, just by fixing the wheels, and setting the guides to leave the teeth alone
Doug M
Sounds good, I really think a lot of my problem is blade size.
Bio
Doug,About four months ago, I was fed up with my General Int. 14" BS and was seriously looking at the likes of Laguna. Were it not for the Canadian dollar and the soggy ground I would have to get the bandsaw I would have pulled the trigger. So I was stuck with my General. I had pretty much given up on it for resawing and I don't scroll, so it was near useless to me. I had no faith in it. But recently, I have been using the saw and have taken to liking it. Maybe I had too high of expectations out of the 1HP motor at first. Maybe I was used to using the 20" saw at school. Anyways, I am completely happy with how it works now. I made zero modifications since. All I did was give it a second chance. A heartwarming story on a Monday.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Bio, back off on the thrust bearing and adjust side guides back to compensate . Try not to ride on the thrust bearing under load. Once the beam side of the blade is forced on the thrust bearing it can only go left or right . All blades will drift under load either left or right relevant to the amount of tension obtainable and how well the side guides are adjusted. IMO the thrust bearing is meant to keep the blade from being pushed off the wheel, not control from the rear the direction of the cut. I purchased a 18" laguna resaw master 9 years ago at a show and had the exact problems you have posted . A year later I went back to the show and watched the rep demo the saw, I explained my issues and was given a quick hands on tutorial on set up . hopefully this info and what others here will post will help.
Tom.
Edited 1/24/2009 11:55 pm ET by gofigure57
Sounds good. I'm wondering how much of it has to do with the blade tension because it plus the guides should keep it relatively straight wouldn't you think?
Bio
Just get any one of these
http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaws.aspx
The Resaw King Blade (it comes with the saw)
http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaw.resawking1.aspx
A major part of why it works so easily is the Ceramic Laguna Guide System
http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaw.guides.aspx
Save your PM for cutting curvy stuff. The PM can be made to cut I supose if you want to monkey with it all night. With the Laguna you just set it up square with a medium tension, turn on the saw and resaw all to heck no problem.
No kidding
roc
Edited 1/25/2009 1:07 am by roc
Edited 1/25/2009 1:08 am by roc
Roc,
While all of those sound great, I think I'll stick with the PM and try to get it right. I resaw very infrequently and I also would rather not rebuy something that I already have. I think the PM is a good machine, but where I'm a novice on the BS I think I just need to tweak it a bit. I'll be in the shop all day trying these different little suggestions, but one I won't try is spending much money, especially for a new BS. This one isn't a year old :)
Bio.
Bio
Before you make any investments, try tilting the top wheel to compensate for the blade drift. You should start with the blade centered on the crown of the upper wheel. A little variation in tilt one way or the other will make the blade drift. For instance, if the cut drifts to the right, try tilting the upper wheel a bit to the right. Try it, you'll like it.
I was all set to buy a bandsaw until I saw this thread.I believe I'll stick with my tablesaw for re-sawing.It doesn't wander. I've been dealing with it for twenty years, I guess I don't need to buy a whole new set of problems...
How likely is kickback in this situation? I normally use the TS to sort of resaw when I build a small box and I'll put it all together and then cut it apart. Even then I leave a small bit of wood that I then cut away with a razor.
Bio.
I went without a BS for years and once I got one, went through the same problems discussed in this thread. I still struggle with them sometimes. However, resawing cuts thicker wood than TS blade height will allow. It sounds like you are really just ripping wood on the TS, not resawing it. Even though I got a BS to cut veneer, I quickly discovered it is great for rough ripping. First it has a very narrow saw kerf so it saves wood. Second, you don't need to worry about straightening an edge or flattening a board to safely rip. As I expect you know, ripping a rough piece of wood on a TS without a good edge and reasonably flat board is not safe and is very hard on the equipment. I think you would eventually love a BS, although it can be frustrating to get it working right.
All that and I'm a new old dog; I'm experiencing my very first problems learning new things..."...that's not the way I was taught Back In The DAY!"
I, too, use my TS an awful lot for resawing. The only limitation is the width of board you can resaw. Also, it take a lot of passes, gradually raising the blade and can be taxing on the motor. I feel pretty safe doing this but don't know if I'd recommend it to others (especially beginners).Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
I was under the impression that you adjust the fence for blade drift. Am I wrong?
Bio
Bio, since this thread is pretty much a crapshoot, I'm going to throw out the possibility that your blade isn't travelling on the crown of the wheel (assuming the tires are crowned on the Powermatic. [I totally did not get the post above about "tilt the wheel to the right (or left)" to help with blade drift. Huh?]
I was in the middle of a project awhile back when all of a sudden, stuff wasn't cutting right. I mucked around for a long time before I realized the blade was running behind the crown and so when it went through the stock it was slightly twisted. Since I was using a sled to make the cuts, I had to make the blade absolutely parallel to the R/L edges of the table. That taught me something.
Forestgirl,
Well, I will tell you that the blade is traveling perfectly centered on the top wheel (yes they are crowned), but it runs towards the front on the bottom wheel. No matter what adjustments I make it always does this with this blade. I asked in the forums last week if this meant the wheels where not coplanar and everyone said just leave it be.
Bio.
I appreciate your predicament. As far as info on wheels and bandsaw tweaking be sure to search past entries here on Knots there is allot of great info.roc
Bio,
When I got my Delta 14" I set up just like you with the Timberwolf just past flutter, and everything square. The next thing I knew the blade was stuck in the stock, smoke and the tire destroyed along with a twist in the blade.
Long story short, I put on a cheaper Olson skip tooth blade and cranked up the pressure, made a couple of push paddles so keeping pressure on the stock against the fence would be easier, set everything square. It cuts like a charm for the past three years. I do not resaw over 6.5" but I do maple, ash, oak, etc.
You know this has me thinking about how much of this MAY be the tensioning with the Timberwolf. I was watching a video last night and a guy was showing how he tensions his blade and it normally only deflects about 1/8". When I measure this Timberwolf I'm getting a 1/4" or more in defleciton.
Bio
You can throw money, time and frustration at this or do like I did and just bypass the problem with a point fence. All work the same; here's mine.
View Image
Knuts,
You got any plans for your point fence?
Bio
Sorry, I don't have any plans but it was in a mag years ago. Before this one, I used a piece of wood clamped to the table. Rich is correct in what he says and I have many blades that cut true without any lead. Also, I have mounted new blades that run true but lead under load. If stoning the sides and back edges don't fix the lead, I don't throw them away, but simply adjust for it. I have some sander belts that 'lead' under load, but track true otherwise, and I know that occasional bias is simply a by product of the way belt type things are manufactured.
Ok, I'm looking for a project to do this morning and your point fence may be just the one.
I had an elaborate table and fence set up on my Bandsaw, and was never satisfied. Went to the point fence concept. and just guide the wood through carefully. No problems.Joe
Got a picture? I got a resaw post that came with my fence but never really saw how this would help because it goes against every other article you read that says build a tall fence to support your work. I'm going to start sketching on a point fence like the one that another poster put up and would like to see yours too so I can have some different options to choose from. Thanks!
Bio
Knuts,
Your design seems to be pretty straightforward, but I can't see clearly what the wing nut on the back is used for, can you snap a picture from that way or would you explain what the purpose is?
Bio
You can see the upper 3 pieces of wood sandwiched together to create cheater mortises for the top 2 wingnuts. They allow the fence to be adjustable and locked into place. They are connected to counter bored RH screws which are epoxied to the bottom piece. The slide moves in the bottom piece in a dado created by sandwiching 3 other pieces.
The piece at right angles to the fence itself is the miter track runner. The wingnut in that piece pulls up a FH screw to expand and lock the miter track runner. If you don't have a miter track parallel to the blade, simply glue the lower part of the fence to a 1/2" clamping platform.
Having said all that, fifty years ago my uncle used a piece of pipe bolted to some scrap to get the same result!
Bio,
re:
"I have reviewed the article on FWW about setting up the bandsaw and adjusting the guides. "
I assume you are referring to Michael Fortune's article, "Five Tips For Better Bandsawing"?
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/ToolGuide/ToolGuidePDF.aspx?id=24093
If yes, there are some subtle tips in there that are possible to "miss." If no, please read it.
The subtle tips I'm referring to have to do with:
1. being sure your blade is sharp AND in excellent condition otherwise
2. having the "freedom" to swap blades, or throw blades away, (when problems occur) because you aren't laboring with the anxiety that your blade is an expensive thing and discarding it simply isn't an option.
Been there. Done that. Got the shop apron.
In all of this discussion, it sounds like you are trying to get your saw to perform with the same Timberwolf blade you referred to in your initial post. Yes?
I think there is something wrong with your blade. That's all.
It happens ALL THE TIME. It happens with new blades ALL THE TIME.
Timberwolf blades are high quality stuff. I don't mean to disparage them one bit. I would use them regularly if I hadn't found equivalent blades at a much lower price.
I don't want to turn this into an endorsement for a particular brand. I just want to emphasize that I think your problem is the particular blade you now have mounted. Yes, even new, "high end" blades can be faulty, or can get damaged during mounting or handling. A single tooth "out of set" or nicked, or dull will cause the problem you're having. More likely there are several teeth in a row with some problem. It's an impossible thing to measure, other than to have another blade (or several) on hand to use.
I've experienced the problem you're going through, big time. I think anyone who has used a band saw for resawing has.
I PROMISE YOU, getting it set up properly is no big thing. Michael's advice is just a collection of little, logical steps. No magic revelations. A band saw does NOT have inherent drift. The "common knowledge" that it does is the result of people experiencing problems.
A good blade, riding true on the crown of the upper wheel, so that the front-to-back plane of the blade is truly parallel to the direction of cut, will cut straight and true all day long. It's also good to have the guides adjusted carefully, but their contribution is surprisingly small compared to making sure the blade is running properly on the tire. I don't mean that you should not adjust them critically, you should, I just want to emphasize the importance of the blade on the tire adjustment to the machine's performance.
(BTW, a band saw's lower guides seem to contribute just about nothing to the equation. I adjust mine as carefully as I can, but I've also run my machines with them backed way off the blade and haven't noticed any change in performance. I've seen postings here to the effect that some European machines don't have lower guides at all and that they are fitted with such only when prepared for sale in the US. I don't know if that is really true.)
I wish I could come to your shop and help you get your machine adjusted. A band saw is really such a simple thing to get set up when everything falls in place, and such a joy to use when that happens.
Rich
Edited 1/25/2009 10:03 am ET by Rich14
Rich,
Of all things I didn't even think about maybe the blade being bad becaue I was under the impression that the Timberwolf was such top quality that it couldn't be the culprit. I will tell you where the weld is it isn't completely flat and I have tried to round the back so that it will work better. You can tell that it isn't flat because overtime that point comes around you hear it rub.
Ever been to wild and wonderful West Virginia. I hear it is almost heaven so stop on by and in the process we'll setup the bs too while you enjoy the beauty of the country roads :)
Bio
Bio,I think the most wonderful experience a wood worker can have is to learn to quickly and properly sharpen tools.There is nothing as frustrating as trying to work with a chisel or plane in which the blade has become even a little dull. The difference in performance (and results) between a REALLY sharp, true blade and one that has just lost its edge is HUGE.Learning to QUICKLY and accurately get the blade back to sharp is a turning point in craftsmanship and "talent."There is no way to do that with a band saw other than to replace the blade. Poor welds, thick welds, mis-aligned welds, dull teeth, poor set, a blade that has over heated just for an instant and is now distorted and warped (not enough to see, but enough to mis-behave). It goes on and on. The blade MUST BE PERFECT to work.When I had a 14" saw, blades from BC saw cost about $9 per. Now with my 17" saw they are $15. I buy 10 at a time, re-order when I'm down to 2-3 blades. I swap in a new blade without hesitation at the slightest indication the old one is getting dull, just like I would with a utility knife. It's the only way.Rich
Well I think I'll give a little call to Timberwolf on Monday and at a minimum mention the thick weld. I've tried to stone it down and it hasn't gotten rid of it yet.
Bio
Never thought of the blade as the problem either and yet the minute I see an irregularity in a blade I start having trouble sawing every time. Good one, you only have to hit me with a brick 10 or 12 times before I start catching on LOLOL. One thing that I wanted to add is that my confidence with resawing wider stuff has gone up since I made a high featherboard (6 inches) out of scrap and a piece of 3/16th plywood. All things being equal, having consistent pressure just in front of the blade and across a fair height seems to have improved my results. I don't have any hesitation about making thin cuts now, either. Maybe with the higher featherboard I can just concentrate more on getting a nice, slow, even feed...not sure.
My reason for never thinking it was the blade is because it was brand new and supposed to be top of the line. Please excuse me for not looking at this first. I have made multiple featherboards to use also.
Bio
"My reason for never thinking it was the blade is because it was brand new and supposed to be top of the line........"I just opened a brand new Timberwolf yesterday, 1/2", 3 TPI, 142" for my Rikon. It was twisted so bad that I had to throw it away. Nothing I did could "fix" it, and this ain't my first boat ride. I happened to have a new 1" Timberwolf as well, put that on and it's OK, but still not as good as the Woodslicers (I let myself run out!). New ones on the way, but I didn't know how bad I was spoiled! BTW, you can also make a TALL point fence that keeps the board from canting............. To me, a point fence is so much easier than having to readjust everything every time you change a blade. Just my $.02.............Rich
Got a picture of one. I'm staring to draft up a sketch to build one today. Mine currently is only about 3 inches or so tall.
Bio
I have used point fences for years but... about two years ago I decided to try using a fence and a spring-board mounted to the right in the miter track. I purchased a Timberwolf as BG and set the saw up properly. I used their method to tension it. I ended up with an arc in the piece of 10" oak. Lowered tension.. raised tension.. same thing.
I purchased a Lennox 3/4" Bi-metal 3 tpi blade for my 18" BS which is too wide for your 14" and 1/2" is plenty there. After being absolutely sure the fence was square to blade and blade to table... I cranked up the tension and got excellent cuts. I backed off the lower side guides and got perfect cuts. I backed off the top guides and got pretty close to excellent re-saws. The blade never touches the rear thrust bearing (which I set back a bit farther than recommended) and if it does it is because I am forcing the feed.
I believe in beam strength and low tension blades are not my cup of tea personally. But.. whatever works for you and your saw is the way to ride. Sharp blades.. good wells and proper teeth count are very important as mentioned. You should never use more than 3 tpi for re-saw as higher tooth count doesn't have enough gullet to remove the waste.
Sarge..
Edited 1/25/2009 11:34 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,
My bs will allow up to a 3/4" blade but one thing I just realized is that the 3/4" helps a bit with the winding I think. becaue there is a lot of lag between where the teeth are cutting and the back of the blade. I'm about to back down to a 1/2" blade which should help with that. In terms of tension, currently I have the 3/4" Timberwolf BS blade set at a tension of 3/8" which is running pretty good. I have backed off the rear thrust bearings as others have suggested and it seems to be a great suggestion because they aren't playing a factor.
In trying to experiment with some of the other suggestions I took a small 6" long piece of wood that was about 3" high and struck a line down the center and cut it by freehand....worked GREAT. I then used the factory fence and put the little resaw post on it and once again struck a straight ling one it and it cut like a charm again. I think it works a bit better because I have more control of the wood and I can make minor adjustments to the feed using the post as a pivot point. I'm going to move up in wood widths trying this method to see if my problems or solved or if I or just found a temporary fix for it but it is working a LOT better.
Thanks to EVERYONE for all the advice...keep it coming, I'm here in the shop now playing listening for the ding that someone else has a suggestion :)
Bio
Before I head down to the shop.. I will comment about your BS being able to take a 3/4" blade. 14" will but.... My 18" BS will take a 1 1/4" blade but there is absolutely no reason to use one that wide IMO. Blade width maximum is just what you "can" put on a wheel.. not necessarily what you "should" put on a wheel.
14" BS's will take a 3/4" blade but.. most don't have large enough spring to tension it so... you can max it and under-tension or you can go at least one size smaller and have enough tension strength. My Steel City 18" has TWO large springs which makes it unusual. But.. even though I can run 1 1/4" blades I have never found or thought of any reason I should.
3/4" re-saw great and I re-sawed with a 1/2" blade for many years on a 14" BS and it is what I would run in your scenario.
Good luck...
Sarge..
Edited 1/25/2009 12:00 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Thanks sarge, and you, the man with all the gadgets don't have a puter in the woodshop...how dare you :) I guess that is one pro of being a computer engineer...a computer everywhere.
Bio
I can barely use one in the house but.. my wife is up here to assist. :>)
Now... here is a couple of pictures. The first is my current set-up with the stock fence and a piece of true phenolic mounted to it. That has been shimmed to be square to the blade. I use it because when you start doing some veneers under 1/16".. it is difficult to draw lines on top of a piece of stock unless you draw.. cut.. re-draw.. cut.. etc.
But again I used and still do for rips.. point fences and the various heights are necessary as stated. Here are the pictures of my point fences. They attach to my stock fence with a pair of Rockler universal clamps. I would have to take my phenolic off to attach and I'm not going to so.. I just took a picture with them sitting on the table to show how I build em. You simply attach the clamp over the stock fence and tighten the clamp screws.
My phenolic is too tall to allow that and has to be taken off. And I do need to get down to the shop and take care of business. So.. here you go and hopefully you will get an idea if you do indeed decide to go strictly point fence. You can build mine in about 30 minutes.. The more you use one the better you get.. kind of like a scroll saw. But... it's good to have more than one attack weapon in your bag of tricks.
Sarge..
I like your resaw fence and I think I'll go with the same idea but make a provision for it to be taller. I wonder how much the vertical support plays into it. I'm about to resaw some 7/8" Cherry to see how well I can get it with the adjustments i just made.
Bio
I use a phenolic face plate and have several different heights as I do the point fences. But... you are going free-hand with a point fence and it only matters the face point of the point fence be square to the blade. When using the re-saw fence the entire fence must be square. I use shims which can be playing cards.. slick tape.. etc. etc. to get it there.
I really prefer the slick tape adhered to the back of the phenolic once you get it shimmed square and take it off to add a taller or lower.. the slick tape stays on the phenolic so you don't have to stop and shim each and every time you change fence faces. Just slide it up to the blade to make sure nothiing has moved since the last shot..
Sarge..
I'm really going to the shop... well..... eventually it appears.. ha.. ha...
Bio,I agree with Sarge about 1/2" being the maximum blade width on your 14" saw. The machine does not have the mass and beam strength for larger blades, and once you exceed the capability of the machine, things start going south.Eventually you'll get things to work and the issues that are now eluding you will seem to just take care of themselves. For instance, if it seems that you need to find that "perfect" blade tension now, later you'll notice that there is quite a wide range of tension in which the saw is perfectly happy. With small machines, I think lower tension is MUCH better and I run all blades on the 14" saw about as low in tension as Timberwolf recommends for their special "Swedish steel" bands. There is no need for higher tension, certainly not as high as some would have you believe, especially the after-market suppliers (Iturra) with their special springs. But there is quite a range between the "just above flutter" tension of the Timberwolf recommendation and cranking the tension wheel that the machine will tolerate.On larger machines, higher tension seems to be a little better than lower. It must have to do with machine mass and strength, harmonic resonance of all the parts, etc. But I still run mine at the lowest tension that works.Also, things like the settings of the guides will take on less importance (but don't get sloppy when that happens). It takes a while before the machine believes that you know what you're doing. Once it knows that you know, it's smooth sailing.I really think you have a (slightly) "defective" blade, and once you get some decent ones, all this "tuning" you're now learning will allow you to easily get things running very well. Stay with a 1/2" blade as the maximum size for your saw. It will do 95% of everything you need, except very tight curves.Rich
Thanks Rich, I'm in the process of switching blades as we speak.
Bio.
""Stay with a 1/2" blade as the maximum size for your saw. It will do 95% of everything you need, except very tight curves.""I'll second that. Even when cutting out small bowl blanks, I just whack the corners off and true them up on the lathe. A lot quicker than changing to a 1/4" blade. I've heard/read that you can cut down to a 2-3" radius with a 1/2" blade, but darned if I can do it..........Maybe if I use the circle jig?Let us know what happens after the blade change..........Rich in VA
1/2" seems to work pretty well, but I have realized a new problem. My bottom rear thrust bearing was stuck and the blades wound up carving a grove in it so that will need to be replaced. Warranty may cover that, and then the next issue will be what the heck will I do with this new 3/4" blade. Anyone want to trade :)
The only issue I'm having now is the fact that I can strike a straight line on the stock and go to cutting it, with or without a fence and it appears to be cutting crooked. It will be dead on center at the top and then at the bottom it will be coming out of the wood. Before anyone asks, yes the table and blade are perpendicular to eachother. I also can confirm that the edge that was flat against the table was jointed and flat If I can get by this last dilema all my resawing worries will be fixed right :)
Thanks once again to all for all the suggestions. This has grown into a pretty big thread.
Bio
If that bottom thrust is grooved from the back of that 3/4" blade digging in.. the 3/4" blade is probably been over-heated and dulled. In other words... it is now "toast" and you can do what you wish with it other than use it on a BS. :>)
Good luck and BTW... I think what you referred to earlier about vertical was on the spring-board. Yes.. a taller one would be better to help sand-wich and I have been meaning to do just that for a long time. And since I just finished a project and don't start another until tomorrow.. this afternoon is as good a time as any. Thanks for the reminder to do it. ha.. ha...
Off.. off and away again...
Sarge..
Edited 1/25/2009 2:38 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
"The only issue I'm having now is the fact that I can strike a straight line on the stock and go to cutting it, with or without a fence and it appears to be cutting crooked. It will be dead on center at the top and then at the bottom it will be coming out of the wood."Bio, I know that this horse has been beaten to a pulp, but it really sounds like you don't have the blade centered on the upper tire. My saw does just as you describe if I don't have the wheel tilted properly. It also will drift. You might try tilting the wheel just a bit each way, then make a cut on each setting. Might clear it up.David B
Bio,The lower thrust bearing on my General 14" froze months ago and I haven't been able to get a response from them and have forgotten about it until just now. I don't miss it.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
The trick in my case Richard, was to keep the small BS in lieu of selling when I got an 18". I dropped a 1/4" standard carbon 6 tip hook on it and use it for curves on templates.. plastic.. etc. etc.. So.. I never make a blade change.
And BTW... I used 1/2" blades for many years with a WoodSlicer from down the street at Highland. I still would but discovered I could get about 6-7 times the blade life before it dulls by going to the Lennox bi-metal for about $10 more. The bi-metal will give not quite as smooth a cut compared to the WS but.. I have never seen any cut including the very high $$ carbides that I would use off the saw without clean-up.
Sarge..
Sarge,Would love to try one of those, but can't ever figure out from their web page just EXACTLY which one it is. Can you lend a hand?Thanks.RichPS Heard yesterday that my folks are going into a retirement-type home, so looks as if I will be getting that second bandsaw soon. Mixed feelings/emotions about that............
Edited 1/25/2009 3:43 pm ET by Richard Jones
Try http://www.toolcenter.com in lieu of the Lennox site as the Lennox site does not list a 3 TPI in the Classic bi-meta for whatever reason? It can get confusing on those web-sites. The best thing to do is call Toolcenter toll-free and talk to one of the 3 guys that take orders. That phone $ is 1-888-778-9663. That takes the trying to interpret the charts out of play and all the guys are knowledgeable from my experience. I ordered a back up blade about 3-4 days ago.
Good luck..
Sarge..
Edited 1/25/2009 8:24 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
I get good results with re-sawing with a common three tooth Lenox blade. I use to use a 1 inch blade but found that the 1/2 inch was better.
Just me but I think if the blade is 'tracking' well. Feed rate is the key to success!
No power feed here but if I could duplicate it I could do as good if I practiced a few more years.
I would say practice on any old scrap you can find. Do NOT practice on good 'sticks'.
I CAN Re-Saw.. However not that good at 'following' a curve at 1/8 inch from a line!
Ha, I can follow he 1/8" line no problem. My first tool was a scroll saw so I can cut the heck out of small things.
Bio.
As Rich... I don't have drift as the saw is set up well. And the curves are rather easy on my smaller BS with a 1/4" 6 tpi blade. I do a ton of templates and you just get the feel for it just as using a point fence. Unlike Bio.. I did not get experience on a scroll-saw doing curves which requires even a slower feed rate.
I have had a DW 788 scroll saw for two years just sitting in my back shop in hope some day I would have time to learn to use it. That day arrived just a few days ago as I wanted to add some names to the lid of two small boxes I just posted in the Gallery. I took about an hour and learned to install.. remove.. and re-install blades. Then another 30 minutes to mock cuts in maple which I used for the lids.
At that point I made my first serious scroll saw cuts and it was really quite easy as I feel the experience from the BS rolled over to the scroll saw. Not great I suppose but.. not bad for my first try. It got easy after about the 3rd letter.
You can have a look for yourself as I will post one picture of one of the boxes I did that are in the Gallery.
Sarge..
Suffolk Machinery owns the trademark to Timber-wolf and has the product made in Sweden and then delivered to them in bulk roll. They do their own welding in-house for individual orders as the bulk of what they do is for commercial. They do not pre-package blades at Suffolk... they are made and sent in a plain brown wrapper so to speak.
PS Wood Machines is an affiliate in the respect they are Suffolk's Show and Packaging distributor so to speak. All packaged Timber-wolf you see at Woodcraft.. Ace Hardware.. Joe Blow's hardware.. etc. come from PS wood who does purchase by the bulk roll and welding is done at their Pittsburgh facility.
PS Wood does not purchase or package over 1" blades. If you call PS Wood and ask for over 1" you will be directed directly to Suffolk or PS Wood will order the blade for long time customers from Suffolk... get it and then send to them.
The welds are basically done in the same manner according to both sources. Pricing is similar but could be slightly more or less at either source at a given time. Prices at local packaged sources will naturally be a bit higher to accommodate a profit margin after purchasing from PS Woods which is their distributor.
Sources........
Suffolk Machinery in a 5 minute phone call.
Mrs. Barbara Petes who is owner of PS Wood machines in a 30 minute chat with her. Barbara is very personable and welcomes all calls if you have any questions.
And now... you know!
Regards...
Sarge..
Edited 1/27/2009 2:47 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
This could start a whole new thread, but imo the scroll saw is one of the safest tools for a newbie to start on. Unless it is an extremely aggressive blade that is being used, a misunderstanding between a blade and finger would not result in missing digits. You learn a lot about feeding wood, controling the work piece, but more imporatantly PATIENCE....
Bio
p.s. I have plenty of GOOD experience with the scroll saw, if only that way with the BS :)
Sarge,
I looked at your fence and thought it would be a good addition to my well tuned BS :) I built a simple one with the same principle. I know you used a long contact point that was rounded, but I wondered why a simple featherboard wouldn't work? I decided to mill up a runner and then cut a 1/2" piece of MDF that was about half the size of my table that was to the right of my blade. Drilled a hole and mounted a screw that would allow me to snug up the featherboards. I used an extra long screw so that I could put multiple featherboards in to support taller boards. Check out the photos below.
Bio
That will work fine as a spring-board is not necessary. I have several spring boards laying around and I just happened to use one. Feathers.. a straight piece of stock.. etc. will work as the trick is just keeping it square to the fence which needs to be square to the blade.
All you are doing is basically cresting a "sandwiching" of the stock to be cut between two square references to keep it square to blade. It really doesn't matter if you use white bread.. whole wheat.. rye.. etc...... it's still a "sandwich"... ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Post back how it works for you... and BTW.. clever set-up.
Sarge..
Edited 2/4/2009 11:40 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,
I've already tried it and it works GREAT. I should have posted the results of the other BS cuts after I rounded the blade and lubed it up too. The blade is cutting so good that I can push Maple through using only the pressure of my index finger. The cuts are consistent from top to bottom and the blade doesn't wonder from left to right.
I'm so excited that the BS is actually working that I may go ahead and put together a circle cutting jig for it just so I can use it more. I stayed away from it for the longest because I was unhappy with its performance. I will say that the Timberwolf seems to be worth its money.
Bio
It appears you have reached a point where difference's with your band-saw have been remedied and pushed aside and you have formed a positive working relation-ship that will enhance versatility around your shop.
I have no idea what that means but... it sounded appropriate for your personal triumph. Now I should go cut something as it is more in my league of "I have an idea". ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Off to cut something... Good luck and happy sawing
Sarge..
Edited 2/5/2009 9:21 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
Ok guys and gals with all of the help given I feel it is appropriate to give an update. My first call this morning went to Powermatic and they are sending out new rear thrust bearings since the bottom one was stuck and there is now a groove in it. The BS is less than a year old so they happily replaced it under that nice 5 yr warranty.
The second call went to PS-Wood the maker/distributor of Timberwolf blades. I spoke with a lady by the name of Beth and she immediately said it may be a bad weld also, but I went on to let her know that in talking to the experts (you guys) that I think my blade was a bit to much for my saw and asked could I downsize to the 1/2" version and she said sure. I asked what the difference would be and she said nothing. Before I go into my next statements I want to make sure all of you know that I offered my American Express to cover all shipping, restocking and replacement cost, but she still said no.
I'm assuming that they can resharpen and reweld the blade that I'm sending back, but I thought it was a noble gesture on her part in these tough economic times. I don't want to cheat any company because it was me that ordered the 3/4" blade, not them sending it to me, but I appreciate the company willing to work with me. I have told her if I can just get this darn thing working right I'll be buying 4-5 so I can take Rich's advice and when the thing acts funny toss it in the trash.
Thanks once again for all your help and I'll post again soon to tell you how it all worked out.
Bio
Just a small correction here: the maker of Timberwolf blades is Suffolk Machinery. Their customer service is very good, people answering the phones generally know what's what, and the have more technical people standing in the wings.
Not to say that PS Wood might not be related, I have no idea one way or the other.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Please check them out at http://www.pswood.com/home.php?cat=47 I ordered directly from Woodcraft here in WV, the one where all the calls come into for product distribution.
Bio
That's a good page, BH. It summarizes the info available at Suffolk in an easier-to-digest form. I have bought Timberwolf blades from PS Wood at the Woodworking Shows (when they've had the one I need). Usually, though, I order directly from the maker, Suffolk Machinery. PS Wood is a retailer/distributor and a "welding center."
Based on this thread, it appears that blades are generally less expensive when you order direct from Suffolk and then there's the oft-available Suffolk special of "buy 3, get 1 free".
One poster in the same thread comments on how the rep at Suffolk saved him from a mistake of ordering the wrong size: "Last order I placed, I asked for 93" and the tech/sales guy told me I had an older version of my bandsaw and only needed a 92". They had kept the info from my first order a couple years prior."
This little bit of research I've done leads me to wonder if there's a potential quality difference between blades bought direct, and blades marketed by PS Wood, the weld being the aspect in question.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Now I too am confused. The blade was purchased directly from Woodcraft. It is sold on the site as a Timberwolf blade but when it arrived it was the PS-Wood but said directly the makers of the Timberwolf. I didn't know that the actual Timberwolf blades came from Sulfolk or does it matter?
Bio
PS Wood may buy bulk quantity of rolls of Timberwold blade as it comes in rolls and weld themselves. I really don't know either but I will do some calling tomorrow as I am curious. I don't use the TW but it is as question that I would like to know the answer too.
Sarge..
Bio, what I am guessing is that PS Wood buys rolls of Timberwolf stock and cuts and welds them to the sizes they sell the most. Obviously, they distribute to Woodcraft, maybe other outfits as well. If you order directly from Suffolk Machinery, you will get the blades direct from the manufacturer. Have you looked at their web site yet?
I'm not saying it's bad to buy from Woodcraft or PS Wood. But I do think you get a better deal from Suffolk, and it's quite possible that their quality control is better also, as they are very focused on their blade production and a few other items directly related to bandsawing.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Checking them out now.
Bio.
Ok, the answer is right before our eyes. If you visit http://www.suffolkmachinery.com/distributors.asp you will find that PS Wood is a blade welding center. Seems odd to me that Timberwolf wouldn't want to weld their own blades, but maybe there is some sort of benefit to outsourcing it.
Also, I did a lil price comparisson and the blades directly from PS are only 24.80 and the Woodcraft ones are 34.00 which is a 27% markup. I now need to go see how much the blades are directly from Sulfolk because the once expensive Timberwolf is getting cheaper and cheaper. Soon I'll be able to afford 3-5 blades at one time as Rich suggested.
Bio
Edited 1/27/2009 12:07 am ET by BioHaz1906
"Seems odd to me that Timberwolf wouldn't want to weld their own blades...." I don't think it's a given that they outsource all of their welding. I'm holding to my guess that PS Wood is simply another retail source (doubling as a distributor), and they accomplish their missions by buying bulk blade stock and welding to suit their needs. Perhaps someone out there in KnotsLand has first-hand knowledge.
I don't have any old shipping boxes laying around, but I can tell you that the blades that come direct from Suffolk are not pre-packaged. And I'm pretty sure (but not positive) that the shipping tag doesn't show a PA "From" designation (PS Wood is in PA; Suffolk Machinery is in NY).
"Soon I'll be able to afford 3-5 blades at one time as Rich suggested." Yep, that's the way to go! Shipping doesn't cost any more, so it brings the per-blade price down significantly.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Interesting question as I also wonder about the connection (if any) between Suffolk.. PS Wood and Timberwolf? I do know that Steel City BS blades come from PS Wood and are Timberwolf. What I don't know is if PS Wood is a distributor or manufacturer or vice versa on Suffolk. I will make phone call when I get a chance and check it out.
Regards...
Sarge..
I have a 14" Jet that I resaw on all of the time. The Timberwolf is OK, but I prefer the Woodslicer blade from Highland Hardware in Atlanta. Follow their instructions for the set up of the bandsaw for their blade, and be sure to adequately allow for drift. Once I determined what the drift was for my saw, I set up up a t bevel sliding square and keep it set to that angle and set my homemade resaw fence with it. Once you learn to set up your saw for drift, and adjust all the guides right, you can resaw just about any wood reasonably well for a 14" bandsaw
Woodbum,I disagree with that advice. Drift in a band saw indicates improper adjustment. Yes, you can compensate for it as you have done, and as many others do, and, unfortunately as some books advise. But if the saw is drifting, the compensating technique just allows the misadjustment to create more problems.Please read the article at the link I posted above. Getting the saw to cut true is easy to do. Easier than the awkward setups such as you describe. Then all you have to do is saw.Rich
Rich,Maybe a stupid question, but if the "drift" is slight, how do you tell if it's not the table alignment? Blade drift is usually measured in relation to the table.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
flair,Well, the adjustment of the table is certainly part of the equation. Everything needs to be "squared up." Fortune's article discusses that.Rich
Rich,
In response to your previous post, i.e. eliminating the drift issue; wouldn't/couldn't changing blades require one to have to make additional adjustments so as to be able avoid the drift issue.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that blades can and do require adjustments to a BS.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob,YES!Adjusting the blade to the saw is the whole issue. The band saw is more like a musical instrument than a piece of equipment. Everything has to be "in tune." Drift in a band saw is like an instrument being out of tune. A lot of people think that's as good as it can be adjusted and go to a lot of effort to compensate for the problem.But it's far easier (and satisfying) to get it right ("fine tune") than it is to compensate for drift. And, yes, of course I "tweak" the saw with the tracking adjustment when I change a blade. It doesn't take much, and for all I know I'm simply getting it right back to where it was as I make sure the blade is riding on the tire's crown. (For that matter, I check adjustment occasionally, during the life of a blade.)Rich
Rich,
Does your blade run on center on the top and bottom tire crowns? That 3/4" blade I had would run perfect on center on the top tire, but the bottom it would run towards the front.
Bio
Bio,"Does your blade run on center on the top and bottom tire crowns?"No.That will only happen if the wheels are perfectly coplanar. All the books, articles (except Fortune's) and band saw web sites are very high on getting the wheels coplanar. (When you don't know what to control, control everything, I guess.)Getting them close is possible. Getting them so close that the blade tracks both wheels identically is impractical if not impossible.Getting the wheels coplanar is way over-rated. If they're close, don't bother to improve on the situation. I guess if they're way out, it pays to adjust them. But I don't know if any saws come from their maker with the wheels out of line enough to cause problems.Rich
amen.
Ok, on a side note, I put a 1/8" blade on just because we started talking about scroll saws and i wanted to see what I could do with a thin blade on a bs. Well, in terms of tracking, it tracks perfectly on center on both the top and bottom wheels which leads me to think even more that the 3/4" blade was just a bit to much for the 14" BS tires.
In terms of the cut....I still have it :) Spot on curves Sarge. Look out, I have my mojo back :)
Bio
Yeah,With the 3/4" blade at tension, the forces may have been distorting the frame enough to pull everything out of line.Rich
Mojo's can be dangerous.. especially if they wear skirts with stiletto heels. ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Sarge..
P.S. did you catch the post explaining P S Wood and Suffolk after I called them both to find out what's what?
Edited 1/27/2009 8:06 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Oh yeah, very informative. When I called I talked to a lady by the name of Beth and she was very helpful. I think we are getting down to the bottom of all of this. We are almost at 100 on this thread and I haven't even gotten my new blade back yet.
Bio.
It is probably hardly necessary at this point, but here's another strong endorsement of what Rich14 advocates and Michael Fortune teaches. I have a 14-inch Grizzly that I bought a couple of months ago as my first bs, and I set it up with a 3-tpi Timberwolf blade just as Fortune advises. As a result, I have been resawing with zero drift. It really is not difficult. Once you've got it set up, the only real tuning is to check to make sure the blade is still centered on the crest of the top wheel when you retension the blade in the morning and to give the guides a quick look to make sure they're still where they should be in relation to the blade.Rich, the musical instrument analogy is spot on. NormanEdited 1/27/2009 8:33 pm ET by nboucher
Edited 1/27/2009 8:34 pm ET by nboucher
AmenDavid B
Edited 1/27/2009 9:37 pm ET by davidbrum
A second amen.
Once I set the tracking the blade holds true through many tensioning/detensioning cycles.
I recently put in the riser and went to 3/4" X 3TPI Viking Blades on my 1 HP King 14". It cuts just fine, although once I up the HP by 2 or 4 it will really be happy.
Prior to installing the riser, I had resawn enough Kentucky Coffeetree, Jatoba, Teak, Padauk, Tigerwood and Osage Orange to know that the species of wood has little effect on the quality of the cut - the rate of feed yes, but not the quality.Don
Sounds like you have more experience resawing than I do. I will say my experience resawing very hard wood at max depth on my 14" I find my 2hp Baldore motor never bogs and hardly gets warm on 7 or 8 ft planks. Never felt the need for 4hp on 14" BS.Am using 220 volts of course.roc
roc,
What make 14" BS do you have and is it a finely tuned as your planes? Curious minds at work......
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
P.S. Oh yeah, almost forgot. The wife just made a batch of homeade chocolate chip cookies, with walnuts too.
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 1/29/2009 5:32 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Bob,>Curious minds at work......What make 14" BS do you have <You may have missed my early entry where I suggested OP to "Just get any one of these : "http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaws.aspx>and is it a finely tuned as your planes? <Ooooohhhhh yaaaaa baaabbbyyy !Every little screw has just a tinny dab of grease on the threads during assembly, little wooden slider at lower wheel shroud fettled for smooth operation; table, guide arm and fence set up all square, fence drilled and tapped for high resaw fence attachment.If Queenmasteroftheuniverse knew how much I like this little bandsaw we would have a fight on our hands. : )And yourself ? Are you a bandsaw fettler or a guide pin get'er done person ?( I admit to staying out of the fray here for a while )
roc
Edited 1/29/2009 5:56 pm by roc
roc,
Ima git 'er done I guess. Keep my fettlin pretty nuch to handtools I guess.
Bansaw cuts 1/256" veneer and never looks back right outa the box.
Bought it in China from a little old lady for $25 'bout 49 years ago. Don't make 'em like they useta.
Believe that!? Didn't think so.
It's a lowlife Delta 28-206. Funny thing is that I haven't experienced hardly any problems with it except when I got it set up the motor kinda growled, shook like a dog gittin the water off after coming out on shut down. Fettled that out of it though.
Now she purrs like a kitten, no vibrations and blades tracks well and no growling/shakin on shutdown. Life is good.
Regards, Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
What is it with Delta bandsaws shaking ? ? ?I have a horizontal/vertical metal cutting BS that would shake so much it would walk across the floor on its sheet metal stand.I replaced the belt and straightened the pulley shaft ( neither one by its self would fix it ). Nice little saw now.Growling and shaking now that is something else entirely. It means it likes ya. Which can be a good thing or a bad thing. : )Hey what is the number of that little chinese lady ? Sounds like she has some good buys on machinery.
I think the shaking thing is related to the stand, not the mobile mine is on, or at least that was my experience. It vibrated B4 the mobile stand was added. Tightened up all the bolts and put plywood inside on the bottom, two layers of 3/4" lammed & screwed together.
Growling turned out to be my fault - sort of. The motor mount was loose. And the adjustment bolt wasn't properly engaged to the stop. Methinks it was a combination of the two but solved that one.
Last time I saw/contacted the Chinese lady she was lookin for some dude in Colorado that fettles a lot............ Know any fettlers in CO? :-)
By the by, got any more fettlin tips for bandsaw owners? Specially resawing?
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
>got any more fettlin tips for bandsaw owners? Specially resawing?<It has been years. I had to think about that. About all I can say is paint takes up space and runny paint can throw things off so where parts are machined then painted it may need to be carefully scraped off. For instance where the fence mates to the fence rail clamp casting or where the blade guide bar slides in the frame of the band saw.Correct for out of square on high fence by shimming with paper, masking tape, post it notes etc. between original fence and axillary high fence.Use the correct allen wrenches, most are metric these days.If one is lucky enough to have a decent owner's manual; read and reread and set up saw accordingly.Prepare the stock well and expect it to change as you take off slabs and correct the main plank before the next cut.I suppose that is all obvious or not fettling but is all I could remember.roc
Edited 2/1/2009 1:30 am by roc
" have a horizontal/vertical metal cutting BS that would shake so much it would walk across the floor on its sheet metal stand."That gives a whole new meaning to mobility.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
roc,
I just got an LT 14SE a couple of weeks ago and I agree with your assessment that this is one SWEET saw. The OP could certainly solve his problems by getting one of these and a resaw king blade. Now that is certainly not the cheapest solution and he got a lot of other good advice but buying one of these is probably the most time efficient way to get to work. After watching the very good setup CD it took me 2-3 hours to get the machine set up and adjusted. I was able to immediately start slicing off 8" wide 0.05" thick sheets of bloodwood, walnut and maple to use as veneer. The cut was so smooth I did not feel the need to join or plane the face of the blank after each cut. The 2hp motor is more than enough for everything I have tried to do with this little saw.BTW, have you had the resaw king blade resharpened? It took me about a half hour to get all the oily residue from the bloodwood off the blade and it got me wondering about blade life.Chris
Chris,Glad to hear you are having a good ( great ) experience with your Laguna !>It took me about a half hour to get all the oily residue from the bloodwood off the blade<
I can relate. To a lesser degree purple heart resins up my blade and I lovingly clean it off. What a fine thing is this blade !>resaw king blade resharpened? . . . wondering about blade life.<No I have not resharpened. It is still nicely sharp. I try to be meticulous with preparing the planks. By that I mean I cut the ends off that will have grit from standing on end at the lumber supplier, if the plank is dirty otherwise at all I take a wire brush to it and a shop vac to get the grit off.This has paid off. I am not above touching the teeth with a small, fine diamond hone at least once before I send the blade back to Laguna. So far this is not needed. I don't recommend this if you don't understand how the sides of the teeth are very precisely ground and should not be honed by hand. Just the lightest pass on the remaining two faces.If I was a cool guy I would have two or more blades but I don't try to make a living from this so not in a hurry for blade sharpening turn around.roc
Roc,
I Now that I have the capacity to resaw 10-12 inch boards I need to increase my HP. The cost of going to 3HP or 5HP is not significant so I am thinking to go high and be done with it. The motors I am looking at are 3450 RPM so I will have to I will have to change the pulleys.
I am OK with this as I think the driven pulley could be larger to increase the belt contact. I have yet to stall the motor, but have had belt slippage. I changed the OEM belts out to the Power Twist belts. They should be OK, but maybe on these tight radius pulleys they can't get enough grip. Regardless, the saw does lug before slipping so I know the HP needs help.Don
Thanks for the advice Rich.
Rich: Can you post that link again, I can't find where it was posted. Thanks
Sure,http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/ToolGuide/ToolGuidePDF.aspx?id=24093
Guys and Gals,
Today I received my new 1/2" Timberwolf (PS Wood version) BS blade in the mail as a replacement for the 3/4" one I originally purchased. Let me say once again that it was a real nice gesture by Beth at PS Wood for replacing it, and I will be placing a call to them directly (much cheaper than getting it at Woodcraft) tomorrow to order 3 or 4 more blades so I can do as Rich has said on here when one seems to no work to my liking.
As for an update to the problem, I have obviously changed the blade and installed a new lower rear thrust bearing since the other was stuck and had a groove in it. I cleaned the blade, and mounted it on the saw. I was so excited I forgot to round over the back of the blade but I set the tension and adjusted the guides and fired her up.
One thing I noticed is the fact that the blade seems to run from front to back on the tires so it gives a small thump from time-to-time, but the blade runs on center on the upper tire but still runs a little forward on the bottom. This little fluke made me think my problem wasn't solved, but I went ahead and slapped a little piece of pine on the table and cut a thin piece off and it worked fine. I then took at piece of Spanish Cedar and turned it on edge and once again it cut fine. Lastly, I then I cut a 4"-5" tall piece of Oak and you can see the results posted below. It worked GREAT!!! The blade still moves from front to back but the cut was GREAT! One run on the planer and a little sanding and it will look good.
I want to take this time to thank everyone for all the help. I'm still wondering about the front to back movement of the blade, but other than that everything is working great. Thanks once again and I'll be doing more resawing :)
Bio
Looking good... just got though running qty. 16 of 4 x 36" QSWO through my BS. It worked fine also... :>)
As for the thumping... feel of your blade at the weld and see if it is smooth.. If not file it down slightly. If it is... check the tires on the wheels to make sure they are clean. Generally a ticking sound is a weld that wasn't filed down or could be a tooth mis-aligned. Grit or saw-dust build-up on the tire can cause it to wander.
Good luck and congratulation on making progress...
Sarge..
Thanks, I do say too the Timberwolf (PS Wood version) is a NICE blade. I have a 1/2" blade and I have it tensioned down to almost 1/4" and I think I could detension it even more. My problem of it not running straight from top to bottom in the cut is fixed too. I think one huge thing that I have realized is that you were correct, 3/4" is NOT the bade for resawing on this saw.
Bio
In some cases.. larger is not necessarily better. As I mentioned, I ran 16 pieces of 4" x 36" QSWO that was 15/16" before the re-saw using my stock fence with phenolic face added and a spring-board right. 32 pieces of 7/16" with little variance as all got measured after the sawing was done.
It got done with a 3/4" bi-metal on a 18" saw but I have no doubt 1/2" would yield the same results even though 3/4" is not over-taxing my saw. Basically the stock was sand-wiched between the fence left and spring-board right. No lines drawn on top as I would have to do with a point fence which I do use ripping.
You cannot trust a tension gauge on any BS I have seen. You set it where the gauge says you want it and then find what is correct from there. Could be up as with bi-metal which requires more tension.. could be down as with TW which is low tension. A cut in scrap will tell you what is best.
But... watching carefully through those 16 cuts.. not once did the blade spin the bearing on the right or left. Not once did my blade touch the rear thrust bearing. What does that tell me? It tells me that the blade was tensioned properly.. my wheels are co-planular.. my fence is square to blade and I applied the correct feed rate for that 3 tpi blade.
Either that....... or I got lucky... ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Good luck and happy sawing...
Sarge..
Edited 2/3/2009 9:24 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
I think I have just a slight issue with the wheels being non-coplanar because my blade travels from front to back as it rotates. The cut was great though. I think I may try my hand at shimming out the bottom wheel just to see the difference, but before I do that I think I will tension my blade just a little more to see what it does before I actually go through the shimming process.
Bio.
I would tension the blade more also just to see. If you have a one tail-light on your vehicle not working... you start looking for the problem at the bulb in lieu of changing the wiring harness. Good chance it could be the wheels not co-planular but... tensioning will tell you to go to the next step or not. :>)
Good luck...
Sarge..
Great!Rich
If your blade is not staying put and giving you a cut with little to no drift, you either have a blade that has had the set of the teeth knocked out, or you do not have co-plainer wheels on the band saw.
I have what is in reality a pretty cheep band saw (a General International 14") that drifted badly. I reset the wheels to be co-plainer and put on a new blade and the blade now stays in where it belongs and I get basically no drift using the standard clamping fence that came with the saw. It was not fun to adjust the wheels but it was not hard either. Just took some time. Mostly because I had to take the table off the saw to get at everything.
Doug M
on the tires so it gives a small thump from time-to-time..
Without exception.. on the tires so it gives a small thump from time-to-time.. At least for me has been the back of the blade at the weld that caused it. I rarely have the problem. I use Lenox blades but not always. My Lenox blade welder does a good job for me and I do not purchase that many blades. I am treated like a commercial customer I think...
My 'not always' gets me in trouble sometimes... If I cannot correct by rubbing the old Arkansas stone on the back of the blade (yes, I do it while the blade is set and moving).. I 'toss' the blade.
Yeah, I will be truing the blade today. I didn't do it the other day because I cleaned the blade and figured a flammable material + sparks could equal BOOM!!!!
Bio
Try a single point 'fence'. Mine is a 6' post that screws on to the regular fence. Set it 1/8" in front of the teeth. Using this method you can instantly, even instictively adjust for any variables.
Brian
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