Thoughts re sharpening with Scary Sharp
I was inspired the other day! I was tired of dealing with the 3M spay contact cement – the stink, the stick, the globs, having to peal and scrub it off the glass excetera. Then I remembered, tucked away in the attic where I’d hidden it from SWMTMH who was determined to toss the relic into the dustbin of history, was a “waxer” I’d used some years ago for work. These were used to stick copy onto sheets (the origin of “paste-up”), which eventually would be photo’d and turned into negative for photo-offset printing. This all, of course predated today’s technology, and of what possible use could it be now, she said. It is fabulous for sticking down sandpaper! Works a treat, and the old paper peels off neat as a pin and, should there ever be any residue, it cleans up quickly, and odor free, with a gummy art eraser. My only suggestion is don’t store yours in a HOT attic, LOL.
http://www.artsuppliesonline.com/catalog.cfm?cata_id=4478
Here’s a write up.
Replies
EdHarrow,
I like your idea about using the art wax. My sharpening sessions tend to be spontaneous, so the only drawback I see (according to the link) is that the wax applicator needs 20 minutes to warm up before it can dispense wax. What's your experience with it?
I've used 3M Super 77 adhesive to stick sandpaper to a glass plate, and I agree that its sticky nature has its drawbacks, though nothing so bad that some orange peel cleaner and a "paint can chisel" can't fix. I also spritz blue glass cleaner when the glue starts to build up, and since the glue hasn't cured too well, usually cleans up quick.
I bought some 3M 45 adhesive, but for some reason, it's not easily found on 3M's website, even with using their search engine. I bought this type because the directions indicate that spraying one surface and letting it dry for 60 seconds will create a bond that leaves very little residue when debonded. We'll see!
Cheers,
Seth
LOL, well, once the sandpaper is stuck down, you can use it for a while before it needs to be replaced. In my case I sharpened drill bits while waiting for the wax to melt. ;-) I can't believe it took me so long to think of using the waxer.
One other question; do you know of any wax based art product equivalent to Glue Stic? I'll go hunting myself for something equivalent, but I think the wax thing is a great alternative to spray adhesive. I guess the only requirements is to keep the paper flat and provide enough friction to keep it from movin' around.
Cheers,Seth
If wet-dry paper is being used then a spritzing of water on the back of the paper holds ii down pretty well. Certainly well enough given the simplicity of no glue, wax, wax warmers, and all that.
Keep it simple and you'll accomplish more woodworking.
LOL, it's all about multi-tasking, an ability limited to women. ;-)
Water works, but as dad used to say about pants, "I can wear a 32, but a 34 feels so good I really ought to wear a 36."
When I tried water, the paper curled up.
Pisser.
Haven't tried this, but how about sandwiching a piece of kitchen wax paper between the glass and the sandpaper and using a shop dedicated clothes iron to to create the bond. Don't use the family clothes iron if you value your life.
John W.
Another possibility: all the woodworking tool catalogs offer adhesive backed sandpaper in rolls. The ones I've noticed only go up to 320 or 400 grit, maybe 440. Even if you still had to fool with sheets for the higher grits, this might simplify things for the lower grits. Of course I don't have any idea how much production you'd get out of a roll. It might end up costing a lot more than sheets and spray adhesive.
Uncle Dunc,
I used Porter Cable's rolled sandpaper product, and it stuck like crazy, due to being pressed firmly into the glass plate as a sharpening action would do. I'd literally have to chisel/scrape it off. That's when I moved to the 3M spray. Klingspor has some roll products that goes into the higher grits, but since I can get silicon carbide grits from 150 to 1500 at the local hardware store and spritz them with 3M adhesive, it's not been a desire of mine to go get the Klingspor.
By the way, I have 2000 and 2500 grit (3M brand), and while you can stop at 1500 and have a beaut of a cutting edge, I go the extra grit, just for arrogance.
Cheers,
Seth
Have you tried finishing up with chrome oxide? Leonard Lee recommends it and Lee Valley sells it. Probably not a coincidence.
If you use the 3M spray and only put a light coat on the paper, it will peel right off and not leave a residue.Max
Texas Sharpologist
All that hassle Ed with scads of abrasive paper and dods of glass makes an old woodworker like me wonder what's so bloody magical about the 'scary sharp' system.
I think I'll stick to a simple bench stone-- ceramic nowadays in my case. That'll get your tools scary sharp, and far faster and simpler too.
We used to know scary sharp as, "Left my bleeding stone in the workshop-- better use what's to hand here on site to sharpen up to get me out of this frickin' hole," ha, ha. Slainte.
Sgian Dubh,
For me, the magic of the system is about how easy and repeatable my sharpening results are. Several grits of sandpaper and a flat plate are all that's needed to get consistently sharp edges that cut neat and clean. I've not been able to get that using stones alone, but only because my technique is admittedly awful.
Even though David Charlesworth had an excellent article in FWW 169 about sharpening with waterstones, I'm sold on paper 'n glass. (The techniques in his article transfer completely to 'scary sharp', not unexpectedly.) It's a method of work that assembles quickly, knocks down fast, and needs very little maintenance in between- leaves more time for cuttin' wood!
Cheers,Seth
Seth, whatever works for you is what I say. It's the same thing I tell my students. Sharp is sharp however you get there.
It's just that whenever I see anyone using the method it seems to be such a long winded routine and seems to end up being a slow process.
Since I've started teaching the subject I think I've used every system known to man whilst demonstrating sharpening techniques to an individual student (or group) on his/her choice of sharpening tools.
I like, in order, ceramic bench stones (what I use on my own tools nowadays) japanese water stones and oil stones in equal second, followed by diamond stones, sandpaper on glass fouth, a convenient smooth concrete step comes in fifth (sic) and lastly a strange system using buffing wheels and rouge which I can't get on with at all, ha, ha.
By the time most people have found their piece of glass and rooted around for the lost sandpaper, hunted for the spray mount, and put their blade in a wee guide, I've already sharpened up, reassembled the plane and I'm back to work with a bench stone. For most work there's seldom any need to get a super bright bevel and a medium stone works very well once you get the knack-- that's about the same as somewhat worn 400 or 320 grit wet and dry paper.
You can certainly freehand the sharpening of chisels and plane irons, etc., on sandpaper, and BossCrunk is correct in saying that you have to be careful not to rip the paper, but I do find the edge of the paper curling up inconvenient because it rounds off the edges, and I don't like the way the paper often ridges up right in front of the cutting edge, which can also round the metal off a bit. Slainte.RJFurniture
For a while I was working as a plastic fabricator, polypro and pvc. I sharpened my chisels to 15 degrees, without jigs. I used PSA paper (320 grit up to 0.5 micron(9000 grit)) from Lee Valley and mounted it on 3/4" thermofused melamine boards 3.625" X 8.5" which is 1/3 of a sheet. I mist the paper with a spay bottle before using. My chisels are extremely sharp and very easy to touch up. Now that I am back to wood working I love the 15 degree angle. This angle works well for me on hardwoods, and unless they hit the concrete floor, I don't have to grind them. By the way I have the usual collection of water stones and honing guides. Use the guides for plane blades and the stones for kitchen knives.
I would rather be mountain biking.
Interesting there, Sgian,
I use a 1200# diamond stone and then plop a piece of 2000# wet & dry onto the stone for a final polish - about the grit equivalent of a 6000# waterstone.
You're exactly right about the paper ridging ahead of the blade and dubbing the corners/back over - to avoid this I move the blade I'm sharpening so that the cutting edge is trailing, not leading into the paper. This stops me from doing figure eights.
Final step is stropping, either the palm of my hand or a piece of paper/cereal cardboard with a scribble of green crayon on it, plopped down on top of the wet & dry (this is the chromium oxide crayon used to add grit onto buffing wheels, not the kiddie variety.)
As you said, it's like a game of golf - doesn't matter how you got there, all that matters is the final result.
Cheers,
eddie
Edited 6/21/2004 3:32 pm ET by eddie (aust)
Grandad used to have this old cobblers knife he used to cut his steak with.It was a disreputable wavy edged thing with a lime green wooden handle. It was the sharpest knife I've ever seen outside of the operating room. Dad told me once that he saw Grandad sharpening it with a rock out of the garden.
"All that hassle Ed with scads of abrasive paper and dods of glass makes an old woodworker like me wonder what's so bloody magical about the 'scary sharp' system. "
And 'scary sharp' costs a lot more in the long run.
Bustos
Scary Sharp is almost a jig only method. It's very hard to free hand without making lots of small tears in the paper.
There is an outfit called "Tools for Working Wood" that has 3M abrasive film that works very well for me. Their URL is http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com. They have a sample pack so you can try it before you buy the individual sheets.
Ron H
The "sand-paper" system works very well, but I do not like at all the glass plate and glue-things. My solution: build a small vacuum box. A piece of aluminium or even a MDF-plate of the size of your sanding paper should be perforated with small holes of 3 mm (f.e. each 15 mm distance). This perforated plate is fixed on the top of a wooden box with a hole of the size of your workshop vacuum-cleaner. If you don't have one in your shop take the one from your house. Only a small vacuum cleaner will hold the sandpaper exactly and very steady in place. If you want a change: just pull off the old sheet and lay down a new one. The vacuum box is a very handy tool for many occasions in your shop. It takes you maybe one hour to build such a vacuum-box and it is so easy that a plan or drawing is not necessary !(I hope !)
Succes !
Nic
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