… on the side of all rebate planes, especially skew rebate planes. I cannot recall a time that I have finished a planing session without cutting all my fingers. This is near the end of today … View Image The problem is that I prefer to push the fence against the edge of the board rather than hold the knob (which is safely out of harm’s way). My fingers are close to the blade. When it comes to skew blades, I forget that they extend further back (than in line with where I think they end), and so I inevitably slice a finger tip! This is not confined to skew rebates, however. I do it on all rebate planes! Here are a few illustrations. I was making rebates and raised panels. No, I am not left handed – the grain just went that way … View Image See here .. View Image So how do you hold a rebate plane? Here is an update of the wardrobe I am building. The doors are a dry fit. Tomorrow I will drawbore the mortice and tenons, fit the hinges, set the inlay, and fix the face frame. Then it’s the drawer, top and base. It’s good to have a week’s grace before my wife’s family descend on us. This piece is needed for a guest room. View Image Regards from Perth Derek
Discussion Forum
Get It All!
UNLIMITED Membership is like taking a master class in woodworking for less than $10 a month.
Start Your Free TrialCategories
Discussion Forum
Digital Plans Library
Member exclusive! – Plans for everyone – from beginners to experts – right at your fingertips.
Highlights
-
Shape Your Skills
when you sign up for our emails
This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply. -
Shop Talk Live Podcast -
Our favorite articles and videos -
E-Learning Courses from Fine Woodworking
-
-
Replies
Blimey Derek, looks like youll need help fastening your trousers, speaking of which thats a bit much showing pictures of you working away in shorts while its freezing here in England.
I once heard that the zeal of a woodworker is measured by the number of bandages on the fingers.
Would you be interested in a nice pair of chainmail gloves? ;-)
Don't be silly Ralph - steel
Don't be silly Ralph - steel chainmail would damage the blade edge!
Yes, how silly of me. We need special woodworkers chainmail made from plastic scrubbies.
Derek,
I have the right-hand Veritas Skew Rabbet plane and have yet to cut myself with it. I put my thumb around the base of the knob and apply pressure on the fence with my fingers. I guess that puts my left hand forward of the blade. If you hold the plane this way, you do need to be a little more careful at the end of the cut.
Have you got the extra-long fence rods on your plane? I wonder if that has any bearing on how you hold the plane...
Hi Chris
I have a couple of methods of holding this plane ... but I end up cutting myself anyway!
Yes, I have the long rods. I will be putting together an article on how to use this plane - tips and mods.... minus the blood!
Regards from Perth
Derek
Nice wardrobe !
( is this the same as what we in USA (or France ?) call an armoire? This looks a bit smaller but not sure.
I have the same nicks problem from my LN miter plane. Blade is further back and if I am just holding it, not using it , my finger tips support the under side right where the blade is. I have a skin cracking problem in the winter that makes all my fingers split so it is a little hard to tell what with all the NATURAL splits that are there. I pretty much got that one solved by staying away from cheep oils in cheep foods, hydrogenated transfats and believe it or not whole grain foods during the winter including beans. Hardly any problem this year and less head aches too !
But I digress . . .
Interesting phenomenon; the more time I spend on Knots the less cuts I get on my finger tips. Does that mean I am finally becoming a better wood worker ? Nah probably the result of less exposure to sharp cutting edges.
Queenmasteroftheuniverseandbabybunnytrainer has been asking me with increasing emphasis to "sharpen the kitchen knives" so no danger of being nicked there. She used more words than that but I can't post most of them here. Sweet gal ! Not sure I want to hand her a sharp knife at this stage (what with factoring in the perimenopause ) but a sweet gal.
Come on . . . you're left handed . . . you can admit it . . . we won't be mean to you . . . too much.
: )
Looking forward to your article on how to use this plane.
( is this the same as what we in USA (or France ?) call an armoire? This looks a bit smaller but not sure.
Hi Roc
This is to be an armoire. It is smaller looking, but that is the design as it is intended for a small guest bedroom. The focus wasto reduce depth, and to do this I have arranged that the hanging space is facing you, rather than side-on (you sight down the rail when you open the doors).
I too suffer terrible cracking in my fingers (how we suffer for our art!). The best moisteriser that I have found is made in the USA, called "Renew". Fantastic stuff!
Best wishes for 2010!
Regards from Perth
Derek
This new Knots is a hell of a way to TRY to carry on a conversation.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr . . . gasp . . . grrrrrrrrrrrrrr
and yes I check the "Notify me when new comments are posted" box. I have yet to be notified once.
I would have never found out that you replied to my "is this the same as an armoire? " question if I had not already came to this thread and was looking up and down it for the new post by AZMO.
When I found it there was no "New" label in red on yours so I would have still missed your answer if I had not remembered that I asked the question and went looking up and down for an answer from some one.
>moisteriser cupboard and looks like it will safely hold at least two naughty children,<
When we moved into this place we are in we noticed that the push thumb locks for the door knobs were on the coat closets and the doors for the bed rooms on the opposite side of the hall had none. Naughty kid attitude adjustment was the first thing that came to mind. Do people really do that ? This is why I/we don't have kids. Too much imagination and not enough patience to stay out of jail. Just best that we two don't have kids. That's all I 'm say'in.
Best wishes for 2010! Back at yah Derek.
Thanks for responding. (If you ever read this)
Roc,
Cast out the need to progress in linear fashion! This semi-random wandering hither and thither aboot a thread is exciting and also adventurous. I mean, would you walk up and doon the fells in a straight line? Why no, man. The sheep would laugh as you tipped over the cliff edge instead of taking the much safer albeit circuitous route down by the bog.
Mind, a bog has it's own trials and tribulations. I once lost a boot; and it was only good luck that saw a handy passer-by ready to extract the dawg by it's nethers, after it had done a full headlong dive into a particularly sucky hole.
But I digress.
I love children; I have two roast for supper nearly every day! (No I don't, as long as they are well-behaved and agree with all my pontifications, sage advice and directions to do this not that).
The fact is, one needs to be young and vigorous to deal with the energetic rascals. I have friends who commence breeding at age 40+ or even 50! Are they mad!!!! Even Daughter One, who is 39, is about to have Grandchild Four (her second) in a few days time. Just think, you are 55 and there are two teens screaming aboot the hoose........ Aieeeee! Retreat to the shed!!
Lataxe, who bred early and so got the second half of his life back at least.
Derek, You have defined truly hand made, just add blood. Your blades might be to sharp :) Nice work.
Tom
Your photos were a BIG letdown -- I wanted to actually SEE you cutting yourself -- a video would be great.
In the meantime, if it were me, the FIRST time I ended the day with a mess of cut fingers, I'd start to wonder if I should be using that funny round wood part to .. wait for it ... HOLD ON TO. Then live with the results!
Why would I want to see your article on how to use the plane? It's like going to the movies, but instead of briging popcorn, bring bandaids.
Or you could take up knitting.
Derek,
I know you Aussies are leary of grasping knobs but this is just a cultural hangup. You must grit yer teef and gerrahold of it. Be firm!
That is a nice cupboard and looks like it will safely hold at least two naughty children, even should they kick and scream. Alternatively, you could buy and try some trouser, as there is enough depth for full-length strides in there.
Which reminds me.....
STREWTH! THAT BLOKE'S GOT NO STRIDES".
Lataxe, fully dressed from bonnet to goatywool stocking. (It's about to snow).
Derek,
Anthony Giudice describes how to hold planes in "Four Squaring with Hand Tools" which you can find on the FWW website. He says:
"And don't hold the plane so that you can guide it with your fingers underneath. Hold the plane by the handles. Your eyehand coordination is better than any gimmick or
trick grip."
That answers your question. Glad to help.
Now I have a question for you. In Four Squaring with hand tools, some recommend starting with a scrub plane, while others recommend starting with a Jack Plane with a highly cambered Iron. Is each better under some circumstances, or do you recommend one approach over the other? Why?
This is not a trick question. I really would like your ideas on this. I don't have a scrub plane yet and so I have not been able to compare it to using the Jack. My guess is that you have tried both approaches.
Looking forward to your response. THank you.
Happy New Year.
Mel
Hi Mel
Scrub or jack? It depends on the wood.
If there is a lot of waste to remove, I grab the scrub (there is a comparison of different scrub planes on my website). For example, I have a 10" x 4" roofing beam that will make a great bench. It requires serious dressing. The Veritas scrub is the go-to plane here. I prefer a longer, heavier plane as a scrub.
Otherwise I go for my jack. Actually I have two jacks set up - one with a camber that is just short of the scrub (Stanley #5 1/2), and another that is more moderate (that is a 15 1/2" long woodie I built). I tend to use the latter the most since this is enough to remove moderate warps, etc.
All the best for 2010!
Regards from Perth
Derek
Mel,
You know I can't resist
Mel,
You know I can't resist jumping in when I would be better off to keep quiet.
About the scrub thing :
The very light scrub is just that. Much lighter; and when flailing back and forth taking off a half inch of thickness on the corner of a large plank that has a high corner, for example, then one saves energy by using a lighter plane and the length isn't important because you can go with the jack once you get that corner down to a reasonable degree. Something I learned by doing is when scrubbing one doesn't push and lift but just push and drag the scrub in quite a fast cycle. Push and lift or as some recommend push and then pull the plane back with it riding on its sole's side edge just is too slow. A scrub blade doesn't need to stay all that sharp because one is usually planing diagonal or even perpendicular right across the plank and the fibers take the edge nicely even if not shave sharp.
I say buy a nice new scrub. They are cheep, as planes go, and all the scratches from grit in the wood will end up on the inexpensive plane and not on the sole of your better, longer, more expensive planes.
And here is a Christmas present, all but a bit late:
The length of the scrub and the way the blade is held in ( no screw/slot ) is key to sharpening the extreme radius of the scrub blade using the plane as the sharpening jig. It is so simple it is stupid. Works great !
The length of the scrub and the way the blade is held in ( no screw/slot ) is key to sharpening the extreme radius of the scrub blade using the plane as the sharpening jig. It is so simple it is stupid. Works great
OK, I am on the Shtupid side of this. How does this work?
Thanks Morgan
So how do you hold a rebate plane?
Hmmmm, in a router table? Sorry could not resist....
I am knee deep in some bedside tables, and I have sanded the ends of my finger tips off on my thumb and forefinger. I see you prefer the flexible fabric strips as well. Nice to have a box around the shop, as trying to stain the entire project a blood red color could be a bit more than I can spare.
Serious side of the matter, use the handles and train the brain. Funny but sometimes if you don't look, you do it by sense of smell.
Morgan, a connoisseur of Band-Aids....
Sir ..
How about Kevlar gloves?
http://www.vestguard.co.uk/gloves/sand-kevlar-defender-gloves.htm
And I wonder. Is it the edge of the wood and not the plane blade. The edge of Panga-panga and Jatoba can be like a razor! AND Lacewood!
Lee Valley's High Friction
Lee Valley's High Friction Guard Tape. $4.95 for 90 feet.
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=1&p=31213&cat=1,42207
Don
Roc,
Everything you said sounds reasonable to me. I have been acquiring new skills and some new tools. I generally think far ahead of current projects. The scrub idea is not for this week. Generally the boards I find are not horrendous. I believe most could easily be handled with a Jack. BUT, that doesn't mean that I won't be looking for some beautiful but scraggly pieces of wood just so that I can learn four-squaring the hard way.
I love to get advice from everyone. It always re-proves to me, that in woodwork, anything can be done by anyone successfully in their own way. Nothing is wrong if you have the skills to do it. Then I usually try a number of different ways to find out what I like. Some say to pick a way and just use it. I have more fun exploring. Like in my early days of sharpening. I had to try them all, AND I AM GLAD I DID. I still use all of them when I feel like. I use oilstones for getting new gouges in shape, but when carving, I just hone with ceramics. I use waterstones for plane irons. I use oilstones for narrow chisels. I use scary sharp to flatten the backs of plane blades and chisels, ...... I believe that when all is said and done, I will figure out what circumstances call for a scrub and which for a Jack.
I may not be fast, but I have fun.
Thanks for your advice. I will probably bring this up again. It just popped into my mind when I read Derek's message, so I asked him. I read his article, which was mostly about the Lee Valley scrub, although he covered other stuff. He likes the Lee Valley. :-) While I rarely come to the same conclusions that Derek does, I love to get his opinions and read his stuff, because he really tries out a lot of different planes.
Happy New Year, Roc. Let's have another great year. They keep getting better. At least I think so. I cant remember. :-)
Have fun.
Mel
I've also found that blood on
I've also found that blood on the piece makes finishing a bit difficult :-)
It depends on the finish you seek ..!
Regards from Perth
Derek
Depends on the level of sacrafice!
I did the same thing last year at a Lee Valley Plane event. I was happily planing away, and the blade was happily giving me a bunch of shallow cuts. When I stopped that when it really started to bleed... I was expecting a much deeper cut, but when I washed up, you couldn't even tell.
Derek,
When I was into pottery, the best skin moisturizer we could find was udder balm. From wedging clay and washing up potters end up with rashes all the way up their arms, not just the finger tips. It smells,used on cows but it worked better than anything.
Peter
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled