I’m doing an estimate on a couple of tall walnut cabinets and have run into a question about what kind of glass to use in the doors.
The cabinet doors will be about four feet tall and 26 inches wide, so the panes of glass will be of considerable size. Plus, there is to be glass on the sides of the cabinets; same height but about 16 inches wide.
My concern is that someone slamming the door or running something into the side of the cabinet could cause the glass to shatter. Glazing in entry doors and on sidelights is required to be tempered. Should I consider going with tempered for this project? I’d hate to have someone lose a foot or hand – or their life – to a sharp shard of broken glass falling out of a cabinet I built…
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It’s not a pet. – Jackie Moon
Replies
Zolton , I think you have already answered the question.
Tom
Edited 1/6/2009 9:13 pm ET by gofigure57
Tempered glass is a good idea wherever glass is used. Yes it is more expensive but far less cost than a trip to the ER or a funeral.
Will,
In further investigating this, that seems to be the consensus opinion. Tempered seems like the way to go..
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Zolton,
Uh, hold on just a minute.
If I'm not mistaken tempered glass will shatter as opposed to crumbling like an auto windshield. Not to mention the weight I'd be concerned about that, especially if yer gonna store metal thangs in them cabinets.
Might be a bit more pricey but have you considered plexiglas or acrylic? Much less weight and won't shatter in your application.
Please don't shoot me if I'm wrong, not bein a possum and all,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Zolton,
OK, go ahead and shoot me I'm wrong - just did a Google on tempered glass shatter. It's the float glass that shatters.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 1/7/2009 7:39 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
I had 6 pieces of tempered glass for a recent bookcase I made. Did not want my 3 year old grandson to get hurt by breaking glass. When the glass came each piece had a small white triangle in the corner with the word tempered and some codes embossed in the glass. The glass shop said that it was required to be on all tempered glass. Defiantly noticeable and detracts from the appearance. Not sure if the requirement is the same everywhere but it is here.
Zolton,
Personally, I would go the safe route and use tempered. It would seem to shield you from any liability issues should there be an accident. I would, however, explain to the customer that you are using tempered glass for their own safety, and explain to them that the cost is significantly higher (you may want to price plate vs. tempered so you have all of the facts - customers love to say "how much more is X than Y?")
You will also need to know that usually tempered glass has to be made a specifc size and there are very few instances where tempered glass can be cut. Therefore, you will need your doors built before measuring (or build to a specific size to fit the glass you order). You will also need to realize that there will be a wait on the tempered glass since it has to be made custom for your size. You won't likely get the glass in a couple of days like at the local glass shop.
Good luck,
Lee
Bear in mind while you are handling and installing it, that while tempered is quite strong and resistant to breakage on the face the slightest ding on an edge can leave you with a pile of glass mcnuggets.
I've seen 110 lb. go go dancers dancing on the top of a pinball machine with no problem and it's only 3/16.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
go go dancers
Man, how old are you enneways!? Heven't heard that one since the 80s, uh mebbe 70s? Minds a blurr since the 60s.......................
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 1/7/2009 9:37 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
I've seen 110 lb. go go dancers dancing on the top of a pinball machine with no problem and it's only 3/16.
View Image
Mind sharing with us exactly how you came by this knowledge?
kreuzie
In the 70's I worked for the largest coin op company in southern Cal. Many of our jukeboxes,cigarette and pinball machines were in strip clubs.
Company policy was that if you fixed a jukebox in a strip club you stayed and played every song on the machine to test it. The girls income and the clubs depended on the music and in most clubs at the time the jukebox was the only music source.
I have seen my share of go go girls.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
Tough job, but somebody had to do it, eh....?
kreuzie
Two degrees in electronics, worked on traveling wave tubes and other exotic gear for the Navy and there I was fixing Seeburg jukes and pinball machines and watching naked girls dance.
Oddly enough I felt well compensated.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
Yes....
Yes, I think I understand why.
kreuzie
Company policy was that if you fixed a jukebox in a strip club you stayed and played every song on the machine to test it. The girls income and the clubs depended on the music and in most clubs at the time the jukebox was the only music source.
OK, so that's number 2 on my list of worlds greatest jobs. I think #1 is the traveling wax-man, going from strip club to strip club straightening the runways ;-)
Lee
Back then there was no such thing as a bikini wax let alone a Brazilian, and the only runway was the one on the stage!
By the way I liked your post ont the clock plans!
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
My day job is airport planning, and somehow runways and strips just aren't as exciting as you suggest they ought to be.Verne
If a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to cut it up and make something with it . . . what a waste!<!----><!----><!---->
I think it depends greatly upon where the landing strip is.
I think possibly you lead a sheltered life!
The landing strip on American strippers and many other American women is located approximately midway between the chest and the knees.
Nowadays the landing strip is often mowed, however I do not believe this causes any hazard or difficulty in placing the plane in the hangar.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
Ya, sure. But what's this bit about puting planes in a hangar? I keep mine on the shelf. Verne
If a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to cut it up and make something with it . . . what a waste!<!----><!----><!---->
Dgreen,
Yes, I'm aware of the hazards of handling tempered glass. It's tough, but fragile if compromised.
As to your old job... I wish I could have been there for that..
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Your prices on the glass sound pretty darn good. I just had a friend in the biz quote me for two 24x72 tempered pieces for my stereo cabinet and with my screaming (do a lot for him)deal it was $75 per door.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
And here I thought the prices I got for the tempered glass were astronomical! It helps though when you're a contractor and can ask for a contractor's discount...
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Lee,
All good points. I knew that the glass cannot be cut after it has been tempered, and that I'd have to have the door and side frames built before I ordered the glazing. But I hadn't taken into account the wait time for fabrication. When I asked my glass company about that yesterday, they said to expect 4-5 weeks. So that was a good thing to find out!
Thanks for your help,
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Zol,
No problem. I ran into that problem before with turnaround time so I thought it was worth mentioning. Since most tempered glass needs to be ordered, it's usually not a quick turnaround item.
Best of luck with the quote,
Lee
Hi Zolton ,
Sounds like some wide doors for sure , can you use a center stile and have 2 pieces of glass or a horizontal rail 1/2 way up to cut down the sheer size of each piece ?
What type of doors will you make ? what type of hinge system ? Butt hinges Euro hinges ?
I've made many China cabinets with show case by- pass sliding glass no frame doors .
regards dusty
Dusty,
The wide door (about 24 inches) is what my client wants, so that's the way I'm estimating it. I don't know that dividing it up would make using non-tempered glass any safer - though it's possible that a smaller piece might be less prone to breakage.
I'm not far enough along in the design process to determine what the hinges will be (I have to get an approval on the ballpark price estimate first). The glass will be in a frame though; it's not bare glass hanging on hinges. The weight of the glass and the frame and the sheer size of the door does concern me...
Given the prices I'm getting for the glazing, my suspicion is that this project will prove too expensive for my client, so I'm not investing a lot of time in it up front. The 24 x 48 1/8 inch tempered glass panel for the door alone is $81.00. The two side panels are $54.00 each. Add a mirror for the back, at $46.00, and we're well over 200 bucks just for glass alone - and then I have to build the thing!
Anyway, I'll let you know what happens.
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
If price is an issue, couldn't you use glass that's a real dog - distempered glass? ;-)Actually, the prices you were quoted sound fairly reasonable.FWIW, I had a tempered glass door on an entertainment center shatter on me a while back. It sent a bazillion little glass bits all over the room. Not good if you're standing there in bare feet.If your customers have kids, you might want to suggest they at least think about plexi. Tempered glass is strong, but not invincible.
Ralph,
I've had mixed results in my experience with plexiglass. For one thing, it seems almost to scratch itself. And once it does get scratched it doesn't look very good. That's why I'm exploring the tempered route. This is a knottier problem than I had first thought it would be.
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
How about AR Acrylic?http://www.tapplastics.com/shop/product.php?pid=455&There's also the S.C. Fields solution - sell the kids. ;-)
Ralph,
That stuff is slightly more expensive than tempered glass. I wonder if it's as optically clear?
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
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