Replies

1. 
   SteveSchoene | Nov 14, 2009 05:30pm | #1

   That's quite a bit more movement than you will actually see, particularly if you apply a finish to the table.  (Both sides equally.)  Remember that rift sawn will move a lot less than flat sawn, and that a finish will moderate the peaks and values of wood moisture. 

   Still you need to allow for wood movement.   What kind of apron do you have on the pedestal table?  How does it attach to the pedestal?   

2. 
   JeffHeath | Nov 14, 2009 05:33pm | #2

   One of the tables I build frequently is similar in size to yours. It has a radius of 54", and sometimes I build it with a removable leaf system to extend the length of the table. I typically sell it in either maple of cherry. I attach the laminated apron with figure 8's to allow for wood movement. None have ever moved as much as you've mentioned. If you allow for movement across the width using proper fasteners, you will be just fine.

   As far as tabletop attachment goes, I attach the table tops to the leaf extensions through elongated holes. If you aren't using a leaf system, then you can simply attach cross braces to your pedestal, and use elongated holes and screws to allow for movement.

   Jeff

   
   

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   Edited 11/14/2009 9:36 am ET by JeffHeath

1. 
   totallyretired | Nov 14, 2009 06:54pm | #3

   Hello Jeff,
   It sounds as if you are just the one I am looking for. Excuse my ignorance but what are figure 8’s? What kind of wood do you use for your cross braces? What is the width and thinness of your cross braces?

1. 
   JeffHeath | Nov 15, 2009 11:00pm | #6

   TR
   Follow this to find out what a "figure 8" table top fastener is:http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=786When I am attaching a table top to a pedestal, several factors can determine whether or not bracing is necessary, and what size to use. I always use the same species I am working in, as it is too easy to see the underside of a table, simply by just bending over. I finish the underside of my work to the same extent as the show side.......always! For my business, it's the details that count.I'll choose a thickness of bracing that would not interfere with the functionality of the piece. For a table top with a 2 3/4" apron, I would use 1 1/2" thick stock approx. 1 3/4" wide for the two support braces, but only if the table called for it. Sometimes, I use a smaller diameter section of wood of the same species attached to the pedestal that would fit inside the apron. I would then drill elongated holes through it at various points, and attach the table top with screws through these holes to allow for movement.For you, understanding wood movement and allowing for it is critical for properly constructing a piece that will last a lifetime.Jeff

3. 
   robkress | Nov 15, 2009 02:33am | #4

   TR,

   On my 6' round beech table (flat sawn), I have never seen that much expansion / contraction. And beech is notorious for moving a lot (and I will agree). Anyway, I used 8's as well to attach my top. Didn't think about it after I did it and I have experience no ill effects.

   Don't worry too much about your top. Just don't fix it hard to the apron and you should be fine.

   Rob Kress

4. 
   DonStephan | Nov 15, 2009 04:12am | #5

   If you have access to back issues, there was an article sometime in the last few years I think in FWW on various ways to attach tabletops to aprons.  Figure 8's was one method.  Another was wooden L-shaped buttons.  The tenon at the end of the button fits into a mortise in the inside of the apron, and the button screwed to the underside of the top.  If the mortise is slightly wider than the tenon, and the button not seated tightly against the apron, there is some allowance in both horizontal directions for movement.

   Buttons are simply an equivalent option to figure 8's, neither better or worse than the other if they are used properly.

5. 
   totallyretired | Nov 16, 2009 05:37pm | #7

   Jeff. You have been so much help I cannot thank you enough. Thank you. Now I just have to figure out how to get the right finish on it. The owner (our daughter) would like the table to be stained the color of her stained cherry cabinets and also wants a sprayed lacquer finish. And I used to think wives were demanding.

   George

1. 
   JeffHeath | Nov 17, 2009 12:33am | #8

   George,I think that you will find that most of the folks here at the Knots are as helpful as they can be. It's a community of like minded individuals who are here to discuss, among many other topics, woodworking.....Ask all of your questions, and I assure you, you get mostly good answers. Some of us get a bit cranky from time to time, but most of us mean well in the end.If you have questions regarding finishing, just post that question in the finishing section. I try very hard to not get involved in commissions which require a certain finish color to be matched. It is a daunting proposition, to say the least.Better yet, tell your daughter that cherry is beautiful all by itself, and a contrasting color in the kitchen will give it more pizazzzzzz!Good luck,Jeff

1. 
   KiddervilleAcres | Nov 17, 2009 12:45am | #9

   Hey Jeff,

   Question:  Are figure 8's limited to table size/weight in any way?  I've used them in the past but mostly on small tables.  Everyone yanks on the tabletop when moving and am wondering how rugged they are to handle this kind of handling.

   I remember reading the srticle but don't recall any specifics with regard to table size/weight.

   Regards,

   Bob @ Kidderville Acres

   A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!

   Edited 11/16/2009 4:46 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres

1. 
   JeffHeath | Nov 17, 2009 01:08am | #10

   BobThe figure 8's have been working out very well for me, and I've not had a single callback. On my own dining table, they allow a solid cherry table that is 4 feet wide to expand and contract without incident, and I haven't even had to tighten up the screws, and it's been 9 years. It's all I use these days. I bought a box in bulk, and all my tables, desks, etc....are fastened with them. I would tell you to use them on any size project you have, including conference tables.Jeff

1. 
   KiddervilleAcres | Nov 17, 2009 01:22am | #11

   Jeff,

   Good to know, thanks.

   Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres

   A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!