Replies

1. 
   user-5880422 | Jan 09, 2005 06:11pm | #1

   the Breaktime forum might get you some good responses on this topic.

2. 
   frenchy | Jan 09, 2005 08:24pm | #2

   I'm building a timberframe home with SIP's

     the system is great!  to give you an idea of how great,  I took the tempurature of my walls today with a digital thermometer.. Traditional stick built varied from 58 to 61(58 was when I hit a stud)   That was in a portion of the house that had 14 floor vents.. the heat coming out of the floor vents was 84 degrees..

     The part of my house that is built with SIP's doesn't have any floor vent and has only one 4 inch heat duct dumped in the middle of the  basement.. (same 84 degees!) the new part of the house is approximately 3000 sq.ft. while the the old part is about 1200 sq.ft.

     In spite of dramatically more area with only one heat duct the SIP walls are 66 degrees. everyplace.

         What I really like is the fact that the ceiling is exactly the same 28 feet in the air as the floor tempurature..  that means very little heat is escaping, whereas the stick built portion of the house has a 7 degree varitation from the floor to the ceiling with the ceiling 7 degrees warmer.. (cold feet, warm head) 

     It's super easy to put up a SIP house!  just stack up the walls, set  the roof panels on top and errect trusses for the roof..  once everything is dry you cut out the panels where you want windows!  no special frame work required..  about as simple as possible!

     Cost?  I pay about $3.50 a sq.ft. for 6 inch panels and about $3.90 a sq.ft. for 10 inch panels (those I use on the roof) 

3. 
   SawdustSteve | Jan 09, 2005 09:26pm | #3

   The newest series of 'This Old House' is using SIPs. One thing they point out is a problem with running electric lines. You can make a cut VERTICALLY to bring a wire down to (through) the floor but you can NOT cut HORIZONTALLY to run from outlet to outlet. Every cut in the inside 'skin' weakens the structure. If you plan to surface mount all your electric lines and boxes, there should be no problem.
   Their electrician cuts an outlet box into the wall where it is needed, cuts a small opening (box size) at the base of the wall and then forces a
   snake through the foam to meet the hole at the base, drills down into the 'basement' and connects or runs there. Sounds like a lot of work and practice before he really learns this technique.
   SawdustSteve

1. 
   JonE | Jan 10, 2005 04:32am | #4

   If you get your planning done properly, you can ask the manufacturer to place a wire chase, or better yet, a conduit, in the wall at a specified height above the floor elevation.  This allows you to run box to box without going back down below floor level for each outlet.   

   I'm building a TF house with SIPs right now, and this is one thing that is VERY important to me.  I want to cut down on labor costs as much as possible.

   Another interesting discovery I've made is that with EPS foam SIPs and ICFs (the white coffee cup stuff), you can make a very effective, albeit somewhat slow, hot knife out of a cheap soldering gun and some solid copper wire.

1. 
   budreaux | Jan 10, 2005 06:13am | #5

   It would be great if you could post some pics.  I live around Fort Worth, Texas and can't find anything going on besides stick building.  How much are you getting the SIPs for?  Are you using them for the roof as well?  Can you side the SIPs with metal or Hardi siding?  Sorry for the quizzes but this seems so much better than traditional construction.  SIPs seem perfect for a workshop where you really wouldn't have to run electrical inside the walls.  Cut out for windows and doors and that's it.

1. 
   bobJackson | Jan 10, 2005 06:24am | #7

   Hello  My friend is a agent/dealer for Premier panel. contact him at  [email protected]     He will be glad to  help you with whatever you need. Tell him I sent you. Thanks  Bob

1. 
   budreaux | Jan 10, 2005 06:47am | #8

   Will do.  Thanks.

2. 
   frenchy | Jan 10, 2005 06:20am | #6

   running wires is only slightly more difficult if you don't preplan and order wire chases where you want them.  The trick is to use spade drill bits with a lot of extensions.. then a piece of fitch wire to pull cable thru..

     I go down into the basement and drill up thru the the floor.  As you can imagine drilling thru foam isn't terribly hard nor do you need the sharpest drill bits. 

     I would say that after 1/2 of a house I can run wires anyplace I want as fast in  a SIP panel as in regular stick construction..

     

1. 
   Stuart | Jan 10, 2005 06:52am | #9

   My neighbor here in south Minneapolis put up a nice big garage this year and built it with SIPs.  It's about 26x36, with a full second story for his wife's studio.  There's a bathroom up there and everything, it's really nice.  I don't remember the SIP manufacturer's name, he got them from a company in Wisconsin, I believe. 

   Anyway, the panels came with electrical chases built in; there were knockouts cut out for the outlet boxes, and from each box there was both a horizontal and a vertical channel cut through the foam inside the panel, so he could run the wire wherever he needed to - out the top, out the bottom, or to either side.  It looked like a real good system to me.

   It was fun watching that thing go up.  They'd assemble several panels on the ground and fly them into position with a crane, it went together really fast.  He used Hardi plank for the siding, along with a composite board for the trim.

1. 
   frenchy | Jan 11, 2005 01:01am | #10

   I ordered my panels without wire chases.. it's very easy to put them in and I really don't understand the whining everybody does about it.. That allows me to design on the fly (something that I like to do) 

          Since I'm getting old and feeble when I put the panels in place in the front of the house where I can't get my forklift to, I'll just order smaller sized panels.  Sure there will be a few more joints, but even fat old out of shape guys like me can handle a 10 foot panel by myself. but It would take a couple of guys to handle the 20 or 30 foot panels..

     I've got a little cart I can set them on.   Roll them into the front and toss them up into place..  If I had access to the front with a forklift I'd be tempted to take panels that are 8'x30' and put them into place without all the joints.. As it is I've got things down to where without breaking into a sweat I could get the whole front enclosed/insulated and windows installed in two weeks.  That's about 2500 sq.ft. and if I didn't insist on a bowed front could be done in a week!   

     There's a plant right in Lester Prairie Minnesota where I get mine from.  I order them a couple of weeks ahead and drive by with the company truck to carry them home. 

4. 
   jonweis59923 | Jan 11, 2005 08:40pm | #11

   You'll never regret using SIPs for your new construction.  I built a 30x30 shop a few years back using 6" panels and a scissors truss rafter system.  I insulated the slab and now heat the shop to 65 deg. all winter using a gas radiant over head tube style lp gas heater.  Total heating costs average about 20 gal. of lp / mo.

    

   Electrical runs are no problem as there are vertical runs every 4' o.c. and horizontal runs @ 4' and again at about 14" for floor outlets.  The walls went up in a matter of half a day and then set the trusses.  Comparable to stick and frame with half the labor costs make it a no brainer....

   Jon