I want to buy a new bandsaw soon. My 10″ Inca won’t resaw wide enough for me and parts are becoming increasingly unavailable.
That said, reading and researching has given me the distinct impression that some saws simply can’t be tuned-wheels can’t be shimmed to “co-planer”?, wheels out of round, etc. I know what a pain my Inca can be when the bearings and guides aren’t adjusted correctly, tension needs adjusting, etc.
I would appreciate all comments about what brand and model to buy. I want 12″ resaw capacity, changing blades is fairly easy (I will probably stick with a 1/2″, 3tpi blade), bearing, guide adjustments not difficult (the Inca lower guides and bearing can be tedious), a solid table (ripping and resawing will be the main uses) that can hold fairly large pieces of lumber.
Delta is not in the running. What about Steel City, Jet, is Laguna worth the price, General, all the others?
And of course, price. My top price is probably $1500.
Thank you all in advance!!
Pete
Replies
Pete,
You have invited a feeding frenzy. You're going to get as many opinions as brands and models of saws.
The brands you've mentioned will all do excellent work when set up and adjusted correctly. Add Grizzly and General to your list. Pick any price between about $900 and your top limit and throw a dart. Frankly, in that price range the decision could be made on which color paint job you like best.
Whatever you get, be sure to read Michael Fortune's article in FWW 173 (download from this site) on setting up and tuning.
Rich
Thank you!
I have Fortunes article, have read and will use on whatever I buy.
A well tuned bandsaw is a shop jewel, one that isn't (or can't be) is a horror story.
Pete
"-----shop jewel------horror story---"
No truer words were ever posted!! I had a POS 18" BS that would take 12" under the guide. However, it shook and vibrated like a dog poopin' razor blades! I messed around with it for a LONG time and it never got better than a POS.
I now have a MM16 that is powerful, smooth, precise and quiet.
Yep--horror story----shop jewel!
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
i bought a powermatic 14" w/ riser block and couldn't get the wheels co-planar, even with shims. exchanged the RB and saw for another powermatic unit. same result.I was quite frustrated and took it back to the store. while there, i happened across the Rikon 14", i believe called the Deluxe model 325. the capacity is the same as the PM, and in my opinion the design, fit and finish are all superior. the Rikon has plenty of power to resaw 12" lumber, and slices veneers with ease. Blade changes are easier then the PM. I am quite happy with the RIkon and would buy it again, irrespective of price between the PM and Rikon.some have said that the RIkon is a piece of junk, but that has not been my experience at all. regardless of which manufacturer you settle on, i would encourage you to look for a modern european / aluminum design as opposed to the cast iron models w/ riser blocks.
Edited 11/10/2008 10:36 pm ET by TWM
Mack,
I think I can figure out what a POS brand is, not to be spelled out here on the Family Channel!
But what brand was it actually? Your experience is my greatest concern about buying a bandsaw-some, no matter what brand, seem to be "un-alignable".
Thank you.
Pete
PCM,
Don't worry; I don't think you could find a saw as bad as that one if you sent out a posse! It was a '70's vintage Taiwan import of questionable parentage distributed by a company out of Tallahassee, Fl. I don't think any self respecting company would even put their name on it!
I bought it used from a guy that only used it to resaw cedar for smoked salmon boxes and I noted that it vibrated a bit when I bought it. I figured I was mechanic enough to smooth it out considerably. I was not! First thing I did was build a wooden stand for it out of seriously big dimentioned lumber that I scrounged from a construction site. I then bolted said stand to the concrete floor. I then tried alignment of the pulleys, new belts, adjusting and tuning, balancing the wheels, etc., etc. I got it to the point where it would run tolerably well with a 1/4" blade but when I went up to 1/2" or anything larger it would really get to shakin'. If you put a glass of water on the table and started it up you were luck if the glass stayed on the table! It was really bad!
I finally traded it for a box blade for my tractor after I got the MM set up and running.
The MM cost me about $1800.00 back some years ago. It is not a thing of beauty. The table is ground but not polished and stuff like that but it IS smooth and powerful and precise. I ran a 1 1/2" blade on it to make some boards out of some apple logs as one of it's first actual uses. It performed flawlessly!! I only use the big blade for really big, green stuff and for regular resawing, I use the 1/2" 3tpi "Woodslicer" from Highland Hardware. Can't be beat IMHO. I love that machine!!
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
Mack,
Sounds you got the better end of the deal by trading it for a tractor boxblade!
Thanks
Pete
Howdy,
While probably out of the price range, I'll mention Agazzani. I was in a similar boat and spent waaay too much time hemming and hawing about what bandsaw to get. I ended up with a Ag B-18 (18"). I have had it wired up for about a week and have yet to really put it through the paces, but can say that it is an amazing machine. It came crated in 300 lbs of ply that i'm going recycle into a planer stand and had been cleaned up and checked out by the Eagle tools folks.
I've put a $15 1/2 " 3 tpi blade on it, turned it on and was cutting 1/16" veneers with no adjustments what so ever. It came with a lennox 1" carbide as well and I can wait to try it out.
I nearly bought the new triangular Jet. The Jet is a nice saw, though I didn't really like the fence. I am glad that I held out for the Ag for the following reasons:
This is a lifetime investment. Perhaps multiple lifetimes (I have two young sons).
I like that Agazzani is a relatively small company that doesn't spend lots on advertising and marketing. The service at Eagle tools was great, no pressure and felt very honest. They called a couple of times with shipping details to make sure all was well.
The saw and components are european made. I'd prefer to buy american, of course, so this feels like the next best thing. Actually I prefer to buy local and used, but was unable to find an acceptable saw after a couple month's looking...
For me, quality tools inspire me to strive a bit for quality work.
It was a stretch on the budget, but right now I have a bit more money than time and wanted a saw that I knew I would enjoy and wouldn't spend a bunch of time setting up and adjusting at every turn. I'm also a bit of a perfectionist about these things and knew that I'd always have niggling doubts and feel annoyed when something wasn't just right or felt cheap.
FYI to all, the B-18 has been improved in recent years in several ways with a new trunnion, a second dust collection port, and more importantly, a 3 hp motor and 13" resaw. In older reviews and posts on forums that I've run across, several have said that the B-20 is much preferred to the B-18, but with the new improvements, Jesse at Eagle couldn't recommend spending the extra $400 for a quick release on the table trunnion lock (the B-20 shares the same motor. The guides have also been improved and in my experience so far they have been very easy to dial in (contrary to the FWW review, for instance).
In the end, the total price was steep ($2600 shipped and with three blades and a mobile base), but again, its a beauty. I peek in the garage just to look at sometimes... My only minor complaint so far is the foot brake pedal is a bit high and requires a good bit of pressure to stop the blade (the power cuts instantly).
At any rate, I'm thrilled overall with the purchase and doubt that I'll have regrets.
The link to Eagle Tools (note the specs have not been updated)
http://www.eagle-tools.com/Pages/agazzani.html
A very good review by John Preston that outlines similar logic to mine:
http://www.woodcentral.com/bparticles/agazzani18.shtml
Good luck in your decision. I'm the first to admit that many of my motivations go beyond the tangibles and that there are many saws out there that will get the job done just as well.
Cheers,Chris C.
Chris,
Great info, Thank you!
Pete
"MM16"
I have heard the fence and miter of the MM16 are not of much account. Do you use the originals?
Tinker
I don't use the miter gage; I'm not even sure where the original one is or if I even got one with the saw. I got a great deal on a Incra V-?? back a year or so ago and bought it for the saw. Have yet to use it. IMHO the miter gage is a rarely used accessory for a band saw.
I do use the "rip" fence--all the time. While the little magnifier window is pretty useless, I find the fence just fine for my use. It is cast iron, very sturdy and locks down SOLID with no flex, wiggle or deflection that I can detect. It's not a thing of rare beauty but honestly I can't figure out how mine can be so different from the ones that everyone is complaining about. I made a accessory fence for resawing wide stuff. It's just a couple pieces of 3/4" MDF that "sandwich" the stock fence. It has a rounded Maple stick in the middle. I was able to shim it perfectly square to the table with a couple of sticky notes so the stock fence can't be too far out of wack!
When I bought the saw I had two requirements; it would be the last band saw I'd ever buy and I'd never regret buying it. So far, so good. I paid less than $2K for it ,delivered with four blades. I looked at the Laguna, Grizzly, Aggazani, Jet, Powermatic and Delta. I considered "old iron". In the end it came down to the salesman between Laguna, Mini-Max and Aggazani.
If you need a great band saw I don't think you could go wrong with any of those three. If you only need a good bandsaw or are on a tight budget the field is wide open. The market is getting very competitive and new features are being added all the time. What is top of the line today will be overshadowed in a year or less. Mrg's are realizing that ww'ers won't settle for junk anymore and are slowly but surely coming around (again).
I may use my band saw differently than most but I don't consider it a "precision" machine. I mean the ripped edges need jointing; the resawed surfaces need refining and cutting curves always requires some finish work. What I need in a band saw is power, smoothness, resonable accuracy and reliability. I feel that the MM-16 gives me copious amounts of all these qualities.
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
Thanks for such a long detailed post. This is where I learn. I should have told you that I have the MM-16 already. A former secretary was getting married a couple summers ago in Austin Texas. So we went down there and while there went to the MiniMax sales place and wouldn't you believe when we left we owned a MM-16. I have been so busy building the shop etc. that I really haven't had time to use my new tools to get acquainted. Kind of finishing the shop so would like to use the tools. Now SWIMBO says it is time to remodel the house. Life is too short. Good to know you are using the original fence.
Do you use small blades on yours? I don't think mine will fit a blade smaller than 1/2 inch.
Edited 11/19/2008 12:10 am ET by Tinkerer3
Tinkerer,
I leave the 1/2" "Woodslicer" from Highland Hardware on it all the time. I've used a 1/4" a few times; worked just fine. I have an 1/8" that will not work with the stock guides.
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
I purchased a 19" grizzly, and couldn't be happier. It resaws to 12 1/4" and will use blades from 1/8" to 1 1/2" for the money $1149 it's hard to beat. You can look at all the specs at grizzly.com Also you may have noticed that Grizzly has a tendency to almost always get the best value vote everytime a magazine runs a tool test. Good luck.
I am looking at Grizzley, they seem to have been around long enough to be a quality saw.
Thanks!
Pete
I've had a Laguna 14" for three years without ANY trouble. Fence is great, dust collection superb, guides are "sparky"but I guess that is what they are supposed to do. Blade change is no problem.
I am a member of a MM forum. From the number of complaints about their saw, I am glad I have the Laguna.
Frosty
"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
I have never seen a Laguna machine, always considered them too expensive. But, their cost seems in line with comparable saws from the other brands, and they got "Best Overall" in FWW 193.
Have you had any contact with their Service Dept.?-this seems to be a problem area.
Thank you.
Pete
Once - shortly after I got the saw. I asked how to fit my 4" DC hose to their "odd-sized" outlet. They suggested a 'Plumber's Boot' from my local hardware store. It worked great and was cheap. Ever since then I have not had any problems and thus no need to contact service.By the way, the mobility kit is a winner: two front wheels and a wheeled bar to raise the back-end to move the anywhere - easily.Good luck with your choice.Frosty"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
Yep.... you will get a million responses. I spent about two months comparing around two years ago and finally made a decision on an 18" based on what I found. I was fortunate to be asked to demonstrate that machine (along with all the manufacturers machines) at the International Woodworking Show in Atlanta two months ago.
There are some good machines out there but... the Steel City 18" was my choice and will be the last band-saw I own....
Good luck...
Sarge..
Edited 11/4/2008 9:38 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,
I have never seen a Steel City product, but have read reviews- FWW, here- and they seem to have come out with a line of quality.
The Jacksonville, FLA Woodcraft has a vendor show 14-15 Nov. I hope to see several different machines side by side, or at least get the reps to explain their products.
Like you, this will be the last bandsaw I buy!
Thank you.
Pete
The best thing you can do Pete.. is to compare them side by side. The BS will tell you more than any opionion you will get on line if you know what to look for. Good luck with whatever you decide.
Sarge..
Sarge,
Good points, thank you!
The Woodcraft stores here (SE GA, NE FLA) carry Steel City, I will call and see if they have the 18" in stock. The web site write up sounds real good, and price is reasonable.
Pete
It's an excellent BS, Pete. And... I do believe there is a double rebate on it and other machines until Dec. 31. With this economy being able to get an excellent machine and a discount makes much sense.
Again... good luck with whatever you decide....
Sarge..
Thanks again, Sarge!
Now I am going to try to actually see one.
Pete
I have a Mini Max E16 and it will be the last bandsaw I own. 2 1/2 hp motor gives you all the resaw power you could need. Cut a resaw 12" board like butter. I payed 1500.00 for it new. It is built extremely well. Would highly recommend.
Sarge,
I am probably going to order the SC 18" this week, but have one last question.
I went to the Woodcraft shop Sat. and talked to the Jet rep and an SC rep. Neither brand had an 18" inhouse. " JetMan" told me the new 18" Jet (triangular style) has a much beefier upper guide post than the SC, allowing better resawing. I read in the FWW # 189, pg 30 that they saw the same problem. Have you had any problems with the guides "flexing out of alignment and allowing the blade to twist during resawing"-quoted from article?
The 14" SC I looked at seemed well made, very easy to adjust bearings.
Jet Man should have had a pink blazer/shirt/pants, white tie/shoes and a toothpick-I thought I was on a used car lot. I am definetly not in the market for a Jet product.
Thanks again!
Pete
The guide bar may be beefier.. I haven't seen the new Jet's so I can't say. I will make a point Monday to have a look at one about 15 minutes away. I can name several BS's that have a beefier guide bar than my 18" SC but... the question still remains will that effect the re-saw?
My guide bar doesn't flex when re-sawing even though it probably would bend under extreme force sooner in a test pitted against another one thicker. Get a 7/8" steel bar and then get a 1 1/8" steel bar and subject them to extreme weight. The 7/8" will flex and bend sooner than the 1 1/8"... brilliant. But.. I do not think that either will flex or bend under the conditions that re-saw places on them period.
So... just how much pressure do you feel re-saw will put on the guide bar where the sharpness of teeth and the teeth count of the blade do the real work? I would personally be more concerned with the size of springs that tension... the bearings and the ease of adjusting bearings. The way the springs are attached to the case and how the upper arm at the base of the upper case is re-enforced.
My guide bar on my SC is slightly smaller than some other models and I noticed that from the git-go. But... I chose it over those by comparing the double springs.. healthy re-enforcement on the upper case attachments.. etc. etc. Why... because I feel as long as the guide bar is healthy and can be micro-adjusted... it won't be an issue under re-saw conditions.
I love the Aggazani and Mini-max BS's. I had a deposit on one before I decided on the SC as I felt the SC would take care of my needs without having to pay more to get industrial heavy duty equipment. After having it for two years I know I made the right choice for me and I still have 3 years of warranty left.
The Steel City is not as stout as those two BS's as those two. They are basically scaled down reproductions of factory industrial strength 36" BS's. But the SC is extremely stout and will take everything I throw at it 6 days a week that I am in the shop.
Compare the re-saw of one of those to mine.. you won't tell if it was done on the SC or Aggi-MM if you didn't see it done. Now.. put a dull band-saw blade with the improper tooth count on both machines and see what happens. You still won't be able to tell the difference as both will be poor cuts and you will have trouble maintaining a true re-saw line.
It's great to compare.. just be sure you know what to compare.. :>)
Good luck with whatever you decide. And BTW.. I hope the article you refer to was not the Steel City Band-saw has Flaws article that appeared a while back in FWW. If so.. let me know and I will explain the Flaw which wasn't in the SC band-saw but... the article and author who submitted it.
Sarge..
Sarge,
Thanks again! I will be ordering the SC tomorrow. My biggest problem in comparing is exactly what you said-I don't know what to compare. These last several days have been informative to say the least. Probably the clincher was when "Jet Man" recited a very long list of reasons the SC was a piece of junk compared to the Jet.
What resaw blade works for you?-1/2", 3tpi by Suffolk (Timberwolf) seems the best for me on my INCA.
Yes, the article I quoted from is indeed "18" SC bandsaw has flaws".
Thanks again.
Pete
I took a look at previous post and didn't see which size BS you ordering so... I run a 3 tpi for re-saw in 3/4". When I used a 14" BS (I still have it set up for 1/4" 6 tpi blades for curves) I used a Highland Wood-slicer in 1/2" for years. I now run a 3/4" Lennox bi-metal 3 tpi which works well for me on both re-saw and ripping + 4" stock.
Many... many use the Timber-wolf and love it. I have tried one but it is a low tension blade and I find "I" just prefer a high tension blade and my SC 18" with double springs can deliver high tension. Just a personal preference after using both.
I thought you were referring to the bold title SC BS has Flaws. Take a look at the following copy and go to the editors mail-box to see the apology in tiny print about the author pulling the BS off the pallet and not bothering to tune or adjust it. He figured the guide bar was bent or cast crooked... but it turns out he had a dead-line and didn't bother to make the adjustment on the guide-bar which he didn't even realize was on the saw.
Look on the right side facing the saw and you will see 4 Allen head bolt heads. Those are micro adjusters for the guide bar. And the author would not apologize for giving a table flatness of .018. Go back and read the article closely. He measured that with the table pin off the saw. That is a no-no as the table is ground at the factory with the pin in and has to be there to measure flatness.
Band-saw expert indeed. ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Good luck and if you need to know how to micro adjust check the manual. If you are confused... e-mail me or call Steel City technical and ask for Jim Box (brother of Scott Box the president). Just tell him "Sarge" sent you. He will know who you are talking about.
But.. the manual is rather simply written and you have 5 year warranty. And if you get a chance purchase one of the excellent manuals about BS tuning. Rich mentioned a free article by Michael Fortune that is extremely good.
Sarge..
My experience is with a 20" Jet BS. Because of this experience, and experiences with a Jet air filter and Jet dust collector, I simply can't recommend Jet tools. The specific problems with the BS were/are:
- A roller guide bearing froze up after a year. The guides were very difficult to adjust anyway so I replaced the guides.
- The fence was worthless and had to be upgraded.
- The miter guage is next to worthless.
- There is too much flex in the saw. The more rigid, the better.
- Blade removal is difficult because the blade has to be rotated 90 degrees and then removed to the side. I can understand why, given how the fence rails are mounted, but there are saws that allows the blade to be removed to the front. Try to get one of those.
Tom,
Have you looked at the new Jet bandsaws with the triangular frame? I've been looking at them and have been pretty impressed with the fit and finish as well as the adjustments. I didn't look at blade changes though. The 19" is about $1400.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
I took a look at the saw you mentioned it it seems improved over my 20". I can see from the picture that the blade is removed to the right side of the table. Unfortunately I am stuck with the one I have.
Thank you for your response. I believe, based on the comments I've read here and looking at Jet products over the years, that Jet is like Delta-not in the running.
Pete
PCM,
I would encourage you to look at the Grizzly 19" extreme series...I just got one a few days ago..it has a large solid table, a great resaw fence, blade change and bearing adjustment is easy as is tensioning the blade...the blades are 143" so don't seem commonly available although Grizzly stocks them...also don't get the mobile base they recommend, it's too small..you need the next size up (I had to send mine back) ...I had (still have) a 14' Rigid....the grizzly is alot quieter in spite of it's 3hp motor...don't think you'll regret the Grizzly
Neil
As I said to Woodman, Grizzly is on my list.
Thank you.
Pete
"the blades are 143" so don't seem commonly available ..." Blade companies commonly make blades to order. Check out the Timberwolf blades at Suffolk Machinery for example. The pricing is listed at 6" increments of length, so your 143" blade would cost the price listed for a 144" blade on this page listing prices for bi-metal blades.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Pete,
I believe that you and I are in the same boat. I've been looking at the Grizzly saws as well as the Jets. I have confidence in Laguna's quality, but their saws start at $1595 Cdn and I have no confidence in their C/S based on what I have heard here - it's a roll of the dice. I do like SC and their C/S however. They might get the call...
Chris @ www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Chris,
Grizzley, Steel City, Laguna, seem to be what I want. Also will look at General and Powermatic.
I want to buy one bandsaw, and only one bandsaw.
Thank you.
Pete
I really appreciate all the info/comments! This is a one time buy, so I am dithering.
2 more quick questions:
If I buy a bandsaw in the factory crate at a show/store, can I lay it on its back in my truck without any damage, or does it have to be transported upright? Like moving a refrigerator.
Does the frame (solid frame vs. riser block) make any difference? The riser block system seems to be a jury rig.
Thank you all again.
Pete
Regarding riser block, consider what you will use the BS for. The riser block will give you greater height without going to a bigger wheeled, more expensive, BS. This allows you to resaw thicker material which is important for cutting veneer. The downside is that this doesn't provide greater maximum width. So if cutting the widest possible piece is important then you might want the bigger wheel.I don't think laying the saw on its side will hurt anything since the table will not be in place during shipment.
Edited 11/5/2008 10:25 am ET by AustinTom
If I were laying a bandsaw down, I would lay it on its back, not its side. Some saws have pulleys, motors, switches etc. on their sides that could be damaged. Better to call the manufacturer before laying down to avoid the possible trouble.
Thank you.
I am probably going with a frame saw because of the wider blade to frame capacity.
Pete
I've transported a couple bandsaws laying down without a problem. Just remove the table which protrudes muchly.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Chris,
Thanks again.
I will call the manufacturer if I end up transporting it myself.
Pete
I bought a Grizzley and asked CS if it could be laid on its side I was told yes as long as its not on motor.
Dont do it!!! There were damaged parts which Grizzley promply replaced. I would keep it up right or in what ever position its shipped in.
But also I have been having problems with ths blade staying on. I dont know if this is a result of laying down or not. I am researching articles on this site to adjust and check co planer
In all fairness though this is my first bandsaw and I am new to set up and adjustment. Also personal circumstances have not allowed time to really look at it.
I got the GO513 17" on sale for 650.00 its now 750.00
I am considering the Grizzley line.
I will be transporting the saw upright because it seems to make the most sense.
Thank you!
Pete
I forgot to mention that the Agazzani came shipped on its back spine, so if you can't transport a saw upright, that's how I'd do it (after taking the fence, etc. off). The crating weighed almost as much as the saw and took a good long while to break down.
I'm sure you'll be quite happy with your choice and I also doubt that anyone would be able to tell which saw pieces of veneers came off. And I also agree that blades make all the difference. Enjoy your new toy when it arrives!
Cheers,
Chris C.
I have the Steel City 18". Both wheels are adjustable without shims. It appears to be a well built, heavy duty machine. The 2hp motor delivers plenty of power. Runs very smooth. I keep mine set up with a 1/2" 3TPI bi-metal blade. Works great as an all purpose blade, was fine for the little bit of resaw work I have done, nothing over 6" so far. Guide adjustments are fairly easy. Setup out of the crate was a breeze. Everything was aligned, no problems. Fence is quite serviceable. Stock blade isn't much. Blade change with the 1/2' blade is a snap, a little more effort with a 3/4" blade. No complaints or regrets.
I transported mine in the crate laying on its spine in a utility trailer. It is heavy!
Greg
One more for consideration (nothing like muddying the waters! ... :) )
For about 3 or so years I had a 14" Rigid. Chose this one on price and the high ratings in a FWW article. It was OK but underpowered and the table on the given stand was too high. I added a 6" riser, and eventually uprgraded the 3/4 hp motor to 1 1/2 hp. The latter really helped, and I was able to cut 11' Oak with relatively little difficulty. For my total layout, this was a cheap option.
Over the years I have used my tablesaw (12" blade plus sliding table) less and less, prefering to work with the bandsaw. It was time for an upgrade. A few months ago I bought a Hammer N4400. This is approx 18", now 4 hp in single phase, rated at 20 amps.
View Image
The Hammer was chosen over both the Jet 18" (with 3 hp motor) and the Carba-tec (identical to Grizzly) 18" (rated at 2 hp). It simply left them in the dust in terms of finish and design.
The Hammer is more expensive - not so much in the cost of the machine, but its 20 amp rating meant that I required a new circuit installed in the workshop (fortunately I am in the throws of a complete rebuild, so it was not disruptive). The cost of this was almost the same as the machine alone!
But ... oh my my .. what a wonderful machine. It is silent and vibration-free. It cuts through my (very) hard Australian timber like a hot knife through butter. I am re-sawing with a 1/2" 3 tpi blade.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Pete,
Last weekend I was able to attend a seminar with Michael Fortune. Michael said he has 6 bandsaws and the one with the superior cut is a $300 Rigid from Home Depot. Everyone was shocked! Considering that he resaws a substantial amount of material, his thought was that a 1/3 hp motor is really all that is needed. I personally own a Delta which I have never been really pleased with until now. After following Michael's recommendations for blade selection as well as how to tune up the saw (no after market acc. needed)I am very impressed by the changes in performance. His recommendation was to purchase 2 of the Rigid, set them up with different blades, and that is all you need.
Bill
Bill,As far as I'm concerned, Michael Fortune is the patron saint of band saw operation. His advice turned my sub-$300, 14" lowest-end, absolutely no-frills Grizzly into a wonderful machine. After I set up as he advised, I did EVERYTHING on that saw, very often far preferring it over my table saw, and doing just about all my ripping. I only had 6" resaw capacity, but I sawed Hawaiian kiawe, which is as hard or harder than desert iron wood into beautiful veneer. I gave the saw away rather than transport it and my other equipment on a move from Hawaii back to the mainland."His recommendation was to purchase 2 of the Rigid, set them up with different blades, and that is all you need.
Bill"What an incredibly tempting and seemingly logical thing to do as I sit here just about to finalize my decision to plunk down just about $1100 on a 17" Heavy Duty Grizzly with all the bells and whistles. That includes shipping and a roller base.But here's the reality - The Ridgid machine is not $300. It's $369. With tax here in Florida, it's $400. It has no fence. To equal the fence on the Grizzly, or any comparable machine, add $150. A 6" riser block kit is $60. A rolling base (a must) is another $70. Now we're at $680. Maybe we can get the whole machine in the car and avoid delivery charges. Otherwise there's another $30-50.Lets not consider two 14" machines, which combined, are now more expensive than the single big machine, even if we buy just one fence and swap it between machines (do-able). Let's just consider that one machine only saves $400 when compared to a better-engineered, large, smooth-running machine, whose frame will not flex under load, with much better, smoother, more-accurate adjustments, a much larger table, at a much more comfortable (lower) height.Yes, I COULD make do with a 14" band saw again. And I certainly can understand Michael's reasoning. The Ridgid is a very good machine. Maybe the best in its size range. But a bigger machine is going to make band sawing sooo much easier and more productive.Rich
Edited 11/6/2008 7:28 pm ET by Rich14
"... To equal the fence on the Grizzly, or any comparable machine, add $150...."
Rich,
The Grizzly 17" is a very nice saw, and I like mine a lot: however, the fence is poorly designed and you may find an upgrade necessary. I have been looking at the Kreg, but no purchase yet.
Best!
-Jerry
Jerry,I'm looking at the G0513X2 with the "heavy duty cast iron fence" and the "deluxe re-saw fence" option. Is that what you have?Rich
Rich,
I have the "un-deluxe" G0513. The tension lever for the fence is located to the right of the fence's face. This lever position makes adjusting the fence difficult with a piece of stock on the table. I knew this when I purchased the saw. The overall fit, finish, and $$$ value of the saw far outshine the bad design of the fence.
Best!
-Jerry
Yes, it looks like the "deluxe" fence shares that same design "flaw." Oh, well, it's always something. I'll just have to learn to reach around and under to lock the fence.If the fence itself is reositioned on where it attaches to the sliding head, can the setting scale be accordingly adjusted for that change?Rich
Rich,
I had not considered changing the fence/head relationship. My first inclination was to extend the tension handle pivot rod and locate the handle at the left end of the sliding head. Since I intend to upgrade the fence anyway, I'll do some futzing around with it and let you know what I come up with.
-Jerry
Thanks,I'll have my machine in about a week. I'll let you know if the fence has the same problem you describe.Rich
Rich,
I decided to relocate the tension lever to the left side of the fence. Materials used were some 1/4 x 1" alum bar stock, 3/8 brass rod, 6-32 machine screws, and a M8 socket cap screw. Photo attached. I was about to spend $105 on a new Kreg fence. Guess I'll have to spend the money on something else....
Best!
-Jerry
Jerry,Looks great! I hate to have to re-engineer machines, but that looks like an easy solution.Rich
This changes everything!Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Chris, I wouldn't take a "sample of one" as a complete eval for the Ridgid band saw. There seems to be a wide variety of experiences with that saw, some great, some just awful. Of course, the good thing is if you get a lemon you can probably take it back!
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 11/9/2008 12:41 am by forestgirl
That may be true, but it also clearly shows to potential of the saw.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Bill,
I will look at a Rigid the next time at HD, but am dubious based on previous posters here, neighbors, etc.
What is the max resaw height? The HD spec sheet doesn't seem to specify.
Thank you.
Pete
Pete, I do not know the specifics of the Rigid as I have never looked at one. I have had a Delta for about 10 years now. The only reason I brought it up was because of the Fortune seminar. Fortune also said he would look at a refurbished saw before new since, in his opinion, a number of individuals purchase the saw (it comes with an awful blade), take it home, realize it doesn't cut well and then take it back. The problem is in the blade and not the saw. Refurbished saws sell for under $300.
After attending his seminar it became apparent, at least to me, that the main concern with any bandsaw is going to be blade selection and set up. Like I said, once I followed his advice my Delta has never been better.
The other interesting tidbit of information I obtained was that only North American bandsaws have lower guides. European saws do not have them. When a European saw is exported to the US the manufacturer adds the guides.
Bill
Pete, I have the Ridgid -riser block-swapped in cool blocks, a Carter tension spring and tension release and put a Herc-u-lift under it. The 3/4 hp just takes a little longer but it cuts very nice with Suffolk blades, I will up the hp next year and look for a more robust fence than the Kreg that I installed.
If I get another saw it will be the SC 18" and I will keep the 14" Ridgid I think. All the best, Paddy
BTW, HD has been selling off all the stationary tool floor models if you can find one.
Why will you purchase an SC 18" if you buy another bandsaw? This model is on my very short list.
I will certainly keep my INCA 10" because it is a jewel of a machine, and I am fairly confident about using it.
Thanks!
Pete
Pete, I followed Sarge's precription and touched and tested them all. More news at 11:00. Paddy
What are his recommendations? Where I get them? Thanks. Email [email protected]
I would much rather own a nice used machine than a poor;y made new machine. I have seen many nice used machines on ebay that go for very little money. If you are looking for a nice machine then look for a heavy machine that is direct drive. Look for machines such as Oliver and Yates. $1500 should buy a decent machine.
There are used machinery dealers on the internet too.
Quite a number are listed at http://www.exfactory.com/equipment.aspx?catId=SB&pos=0
Personally, I would stay away from the 18" Jet. I bought one about a year ago and had to re-engineer it to do hardwood sawing.
Knightrider,
I recently bought a Jet 18" to do mostly hardwood resawing. While I don't have any complaints, I have nothing to compare it to. What kind of re-engineering did you do to improve your performance, I might be interested in trying the same.
Thanks
Tony
I replaced all the guides with carter roller bearings. I was tired of having to readjust all time. I had to put shims under the wheel because the was too much blade drift, about .005 acording to the micrometer but when cutting queen ane legs thats a lot on a long cut. I put in a turn buckle for the motor tension adjustment. I found that on 6" stock , the motor would start slipping and I could not get it tight enough, not real sure why. I also extended the table to allow me a quick way to use a rip guide. I talked to one of the experts, he bought the same saw and had similar problems, said he sold it the next week and bought a grizzly.
Thanks for the reply, I will keep an eye out for any of those issues now that I know what to look for, I would like to extend the table, I think I will give that a try first.
Thanks again----Tony
>Is Laguna worth the price?
Yes !
Every time i use my Laguna it makes me smile. Since mine is lower price range there are some paint blemishes. The saw and its performance are sound as can be and after years of owner ship and use I am totally please.
The thing that sets it above the others for me (I came back and added more three times):
The table support/tilt is more robust than anything near this price range. ( I compared Jet, Ricon, Delta, Powermatic two years ago or is it three now?)
The wheel axles (spindles) are larger/stiffer than other brands by quite allot.
American Baldor industrial grade motor; you pay for it within the original price of this saw but I am glad to have it.
The Resaw King Blade (it comes with the saw) is very accurately made and so is very predictable and precise. Fast, Agressive cut but leaves smooth finish !
http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaw.resawking1.aspx
The Ceramic Laguna Guide System ( the guides on the least expensive saw do not look exactly like the blue aluminum ones but they work exactly the same and have the same superior blade support)
http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaw.guides.aspx
You can watch the video on line now. You do not need to get a DVD in the mail from Laguna After you go to the site using this address click the "Video's" button. My saw performs exactly as the owner of Laguna in the video says it will. Easy to repeatably set it up to resaw. No problem. Once you initially set up the saw as the instructions say to.
http://www.lagunatools.com/bandsaw.lt14se.aspx#
I resaw mostly bubinga and purple heart but works great on walnut and primavera. I have made nice veneer from all of these using my Laguna
There is nothing I would rather have at any price except a big old giant Laguna which I don't really need and do not have the space for it.
You may need to bump up your price max a tweak to fit a Laguna into it but In my view a bandsaw is the most important stationary power tool in the shop. If you are used to paying Inca premium prices it shouldn't be too much of a stretch.
Happy sawing.
Edited 11/11/2008 12:10 am by roc
Edited 11/11/2008 12:18 am by roc
Edited 11/11/2008 12:20 am by roc
Take a hard look at the 14" Grizzly "Extreme Series" with a 6" riser block. It comes (nearly) fully loaded, works like a champ and is a terrific value for the money.
Laguna got a top-of-the-line review in Fine Woodworking recently. I would give my back teeth for that saw.
Yes, Best of Show, but the price of their larger saws (higher capacity)is out of my range.
Thanks!
Pete
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled