Replies

1. 
   Jimma | Jan 07, 2004 01:33am | #1

   Hi! Can't answer your #2 question, but I do have the L-N scraper and am looking at the Veritas cabinet scraper (Stanley #80). As with so many tools, it all depends on the work you do. I got the bigger L-N to do a project that had a lot of large curly maple panels. This was because my hands couldn't take using card scrapers for so much area. I've also seen the #80 used to great effect where some aggressive scraping was called for that would also be too much for the card type of scraper, but not suited to the scraper plane's larger, heavier body. Soooo, I guess it may depend on what you're going to do with the tools. However, I'd probably not compare any scraper with the 4 1/2 simply because the scrapers are so good at what they're made for. As for the L-N, it's a gem like most of their products, but it took some practice to get it right and I doubt if it will ever be regularly used -- once again because it's such a specialized tool. (I already had the Kuntz scraping plane and it was a waste of money.) The Veritas looks good in their catalog, but that's not to say it IS good even though many of their tools are well liked. The L-N comes with a very hard blade (cryogenically treated, whatever that's worth) and you don't burnish a hook on it. If you can save money on the Veritas vs. the L-N and send it back if it doesn't do the job, I'd try it. Good luck.

   
   

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   Edited 1/6/2004 5:35:40 PM ET by JIMMACMAHON

2. 
   Midnight | Jan 07, 2004 04:02am | #2

   I own both the L-N 4 1/2 with the york pitch frog, and the 112 although I canna claim to be proficient with it. The 112 is a hard tool to learn; finding the optimum pitch for the blade for nay given board takes a lot of "suck-it-an-see" but once you find it..... the finish is unbeatable.
   If you already have the 4 1/2, you'll already know it's capabilities with highly figured wood. In all fairness, I honestly can't give a head to head comparrison of the two... their end results may be similar but.... it's like comparing cheese with oranges.. yea..?
   Best I can say is that the 112 excels in situations where..... when nothing else gives a satisfactory finish, this will get the job done... although personally, I doubt there'd be too many species that's give the 4 1/2 a hard time, especially with the York frog.
   I don''t regret buying either, although I fully expect long intervals between occasions when I use the 112 simply because there are other planes that can achieve a fine finish on most boards more easily.

   Mike Wallace

   Stay safe....Have fun

   edited cos it's late and I'm haveing blonde moments

   
   

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   Edited 1/6/2004 8:08:49 PM ET by Mike
   

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   Edited 1/6/2004 8:10:58 PM ET by Mike

   
   

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   Edited 1/6/2004 8:11:22 PM ET by Mike

3. 
   RANGERP75R | Jan 07, 2004 06:45am | #3

   BOBABEUI

      I have the Veritas scraping plane and chose it over a #112 style. Wider, a bit longer and bigger handles giving you hands more comfort and less cramp. If you follow directions to the tee, it won't cut to my satisfaction and frustration. Had to set down after I did follow them and stare at it over a cup of coffee. Analized each component separately and as a working unit. Got up and made the proper angle adjustment to the iron tilt and it keeps on keeping on.

      Did some test using several woods and found the best tilt for each. Recorded them in a shop note-book and feel comfortable tackling anything with it now. It turned out not only to be a keeper, but a real "jewel".

      Cannot make the comparison as I use a Veritas #4 1/2 with a standard pitch. Have a separate iron with a 5 degree back bevel. Also agree with others that you can't compare apples and oranges. I will add that if I didn't have either, I would go #4 1/2 first as it does many jobs. The scraper specilaizes.

   Regards...

   sarge..jt

   Proud member of the :  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

4. 
   Scrit | Jan 07, 2004 09:40am | #4

   It sounds as though you are not certain of the differences between a hand scraper and a scraper plane. If you want to flex the blade in the middle like you would a hand scraper then the only tool to do the job is something like the Record #080/Stanley #80/Sargent#54 or the modern equivalent, again made by Veritas. These are effectively cast iron scraper holders and allow longer periods of work with the scraper without blistering the thumbs.

   Because a scraper plane uses a thicker, less flexible blade that blade normally cannot be flexed using a thumb screw and the manufacturers of these planes therefore don't provide a screw to do this - the exception is the Veritas #112 which will function as a scraper holder (with thinner blades) or a scraper plane (with thicker blades) because of that extra screw. As stated by another respondent scraper planes can be an absolute pig to set-up, so for the beginner the Veritas's ability to use both flexible and hard blades may well make it the better choice.

   Given only one scraper plane to buy (and assuming I'd had all my other scraper planes/holders taken away), I'd therefore plump for the Veritas plane on the grounds that it is more versatile.

   I don't feel that one can make any comparison between a York pitch plane and a scraper plane. The LN only goes up to 50 degrees (York pitch) which has limited use on some hardwoods (try rowed purpleheart) whilst a scraper plane can achieve much higher pitches, however, trying to plane down a piece of wood to dimension with a scraper plane would be a mind-numbing experience, not to mention very tiring! These are different tools with only a small amount of overlap in their function, therefore choosing one over the other is not really feasible. To be frank the number of times I need a York pitch plane in a year is relatively few (and I make hardwood furniture professionally, though mainly in the milder temperate species) whereas I find myself reaching for the scraper plane on an almost daily basis, especially to remove planing marks on large visible surfaces, etc.

   Possibly the thing to do is to get some hand scrapers and learn how to sharpen them and use them first before trying to assess if you need a scraper plane.

   Scrit

   
   

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   Edited 1/7/2004 1:44:09 AM ET by Scrit

1. 
   Biscardi | Jan 07, 2004 02:55pm | #5

   I have a #80 Stanley. I have never been able to sharpen the thing, even with ater reading Hack's book. I need an iterant sharpener who will come to the house and teach me how.

1. 
   Scrit | Jan 07, 2004 04:15pm | #6

   Problem is that you often need to reburnish the edge during the course of a session - probably when your itinerant sharpener is at the other end of the state....

   Scrit

   Edited 1/7/2004 8:22:10 AM ET by Scrit

   Edited 1/7/2004 8:22:29 AM ET by Scrit

2. 
   BG | Jan 07, 2004 05:36pm | #7

   Biscardi,

   I had a hell-of-a-time sharpening the #80.  I ended up putting it in my sharpening jig at 45 degrees and taking it through the grits from 100 to 4000.  Then I put it in the vise and took a rod to the edge from the bevel side....bending the edge ....  it is unbelievable now. 

1. 
   BOBABEUI | Jan 07, 2004 10:31pm | #8

   All,

   Thanks for your time..