Three times in the last month I’ve had to pull out the mini-drill bits (#65 for instance) and struggle with a cheap hand drill to use them. Want to get something made for these little bits. Any help on deciding between a pin vise and a jeweller’s drill would be appreciated. Here are the two I’m looking at:
I see how the jeweller’s drill works, but what about the pin vise? What makes the bit go ’round and ’round?
forestgirl — you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can’t take the forest out of the girl 😉
Replies
I see how the jeweller's drill works, but what about the pin vise? What makes the bit go 'round and 'round?
your fingers
I like the ball head type because it fits in your palm and allows you to easily exert some downward pressure if you need to: http://www.ehobbytools.com/media/79005s.jpg
A dremel is best for small bits if you want to do powered drilling. Best is a dremel on a flex shaft hooked up to a pedal, dial or some other rheostat type system that allows variable speed drilling from stop to full out.
Check out micro mark:
http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares.asp?MerchantID=RET01229&Action=Catalog&Type=Department&ID=16&Offset=0
http://www.ares-server.com/Ares/Ares.asp?MerchantID=RET01229&Action=Catalog&Type=Department&ID=59
Edited 12/26/2006 1:02 pm ET by Samson
Thanks for the links, Samson. My current Dremel collets don't go small enough for the miniature drill bits, but I see a set on the eHobby site that goes from 0 to 1/8", perfect.
Still, I might want one of these simple hand drills.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Jamie,
The problem with the smaller drills in a dremmel is that the motor is too fast and the slightest off-centre in the bit will finish up with a bent bit like an alan key. Pin vice is fine for everything I have done, mostly modelling with the kids.
David
hey fg,
i think you put me onto mikes workshop for the scrollsaw blades. i bought the mini drill bits too. not sure if you remember but he sells a chuck for those small bits that fits a drill or a drill with a quick connect. if memory serves it's only $7 or so.
I bought that chuck and hated it. It isn't actually made for miniature drill bits, if I recall correctly. Made for some other unrelated purpose. It would not grip the bits correctly, made them wobble.
For such tiny bits, I think it will be much better to have a lightweight tool to use. Nothing like holding a heavy cordless drill with a #65 bit in it. Hard to be accurate and also to not break the bit.
I have a couple different variable-speed Dremel options for the powered stuff.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
good to know about that chuck. let know how your best option works as i too have some of those small bits.
I probably won't get the order placed until Thursday night or Friday morning. A week delivery time......forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
i have a cordless dremel at work and now i'm thinking maybe i can find a way to chuck those small bits in that. it's also a fairly light tool and you made a good point about the weight on the cordless drills. my cordless dw 18 is fairly heavy.
Look here for a set of very small collets for a Dremel. Sounds like one of those and variable speed would get you there.
PS: Be sure and use eye protection. Those little bits can break very easily!
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 12/29/2006 12:39 pm by forestgirl
thanks for the link and i wouldn't dream of doing work with power tools without eye and ear protection. i just looked at the store for small dremel chucks and didn't find any. thanks again.
I've used a jeweler's drill and they work very nicely. The kind I had had a much larger diameter "collar" on the twist shaft. You hold them with two hands and use a very light touch and they are very precise.
The pin vise is crude by comparison. The amount of rotation is limited. You are literally forcing the drill bit into the work, whereas the jeweler's drill really drills.
Rich
You are literally forcing the drill bit into the work, whereas the jeweler's drill really drills.
In my expereince, a pin vise "really drills" in that the bit is actually cutting the wood, plastic, brass, whatever. You are not pushing the bit in like palm hammer/brad driver and a brad or anything. The difference is whether the turning power is coming from the archemedian (SP?) mechanics of the jewlers drill like a Yankee screwdriver or from your fingers simply rotating the vise. With such small holes, finger turning works fine and reasonably fast.
Edited 12/26/2006 2:45 pm ET by Samson
The 'Shoulder' (or, head of the tool remains stationary pressed into your palm. The shaft rotates with the help of thumb and forefinger
The tool has two collets inside. Each have two different sized openings (Thus, four sizes of bits are accommodated. A handy tool and great for accurately starting holes after center punching.
I also have and use a few different sizes of center drills (double ender)to enlarge the small pre drilled holes. Buy a few small 60 degree countersinks for use for flat head screws. Steinmetz.
If you find a miniature Jacobs chuck, you can fit it into any electric drill or flexible shaft chuck. Dremels run TOO fast for tiny drill bits .
Steinmetz.
Edited 12/26/2006 5:13 pm ET by Steinmetz
Hey Gurl, I forgot to mention Grobet pin vise . Google up the attached
Buy your small drill bits either Swiss made, or US made high speed steel Nothing from China, India. They are too soft and crudely made. Use slow speed and back out frequently to clear shavings. Ed.
Edited 12/26/2006 5:41 pm ET by Steinmetz
Edited 12/26/2006 5:44 pm ET by Steinmetz
Hey, Ed, thanks! I have a feeling the pin vises take a certain amount of one-handed coordiation. We'll see if I'm up to it. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Don't be afraid of the pin vise, I've had and used one for years. Granted it is a slower process but those fine wire drills need a delicate touch. Left hand guides the chuck, Right thumb and fore finger rotate the barrel.Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
Jamie, the jewellers drill is not greatwhen you want to drill small holes in wood because some timbers hold onto the bit. Finger power is good because you feel what is happening.
The smallest chuck from Jacobs is #0 asfar as I know-still comparatively clumsy.
I just use the ball type pin chuck and if there are many holes then I use a pin chuck that can go into the chuck of cordless drill-the noncy-poncey one, not the 24 volt grunter.
I do most of that type of drilling with a variable speed foot-switch operated flexible shaft jewelers drill. These are low cost versions of the dentist's drills. They work very well. Mine is a Vigor brand but several MFRs make them. Mine has a very small jacobs-type chuck. I also have some small dremels and similar type rotary carvers tools but the collet type gripping system is very inconvenient unless you use the same size bits all the time. The variable speed function is also very useful and most of the dremel type tools are too fast for the typical application.
When I ran a frame shop I used to have a dedicated dremel with which I used tip-hardened brads to drill pilots for the framers brads and that was a very effective system. The high speeds worked well there.
Here's a link to one like mine: http://www.pearsons-uslj.com/flex_shaft_1.htm
Edited 12/27/2006 7:13 am ET by bigfootnampa
I had a chance to buy a Foredom from someone about 3 years ago, but I'd already bought his plunge router and some miscellaneous stuff, spent my wad. He was moving to France. Took great care of his tools, and I've always regretted not having the $$ for the Foredom.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Forestgirl,
Your problem is that you were using a "cheap" hand drill. A small vintage North Bros. egg beater style hand drill will handle a bit down to #75. North Bros. are well known for their "Yankee" spiral screwdrivers, but they also made wonderful hand drills, also under the "Yankee" name, with a unique ratcheting drive.
The model I own is a number 1530A and is my first choice for small bits. You might also find that Millers Falls hand drills, which were also very high quality, will hold a very small bit.
John White
Thanks, John, for the specifics on good drills. I'll do a little searching around, see if I can find one. I do crave, however, with the realllllly tiny bits, the ability to hold something pretty small to drill holes.
Funny, when I go to estate auctions of woodworkers (couple times a year or so) I rarely see a good hand drill. They must be coveted and get "assigned" before the auction.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Forest Girl,
It depends on the job, I have a pin vise and a spiral drive jeweler's drill also, but the Yankee drill is surprisingly easy to work with, its weight and length make it easy to hold in line and it self feeds.
A pin vise or jeweler's drill are good for thin, easy to drill materials, but they are fatiguing and tedious for holes that take more than a few seconds to drill.
Happy New year!
John W.
Hi Jamie,
I picked-up a Millers falls #2 hand drill, circa WWI, several months ago, and I love it! It's heavy enough to put some mass behind the bit, but not at all cumbersome. The chuck grips small bits very securely, and provides great feedback during use.
I don't recall if I bought it through e-bay or from Patrick Leach, but both are good sources if you've done a bit of homework so you don't overpay.
Have fun,
-Jazzdogg-
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
I have used quit a bit, the knob type pin vise/drill, and if used gingerly,it will work very well, although a dremel is often faster. Noisier and less estheticly pleasing, but faster.
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