Hi all
I just picked up (figureativly) a huge 12″ jointer.
A real creampuff in great shape.
Now, how do I move this monster.
It must weigh over 1000 lbs.
I hate to take it apart to lighten it, as everything is aligned perfectly.
I’ve thought of using a pallet jack and blocking it to fit on.
Then using a small truck with a lift gate.
Don’t know how the fellow moved it with Dolly’s and 4 people originally.
This is a low budget project.
Jeff
Replies
get it on skids..jack it up, 4x4x8' bolted to the feet..then 3 rollers..lally colums, pipe, dowels ..what have you..leap frog them and always leave one under the skids..or skis..one in the center only and ya can pivot to turn a corner.
get a tow truck to cable boom it into a truck bed or better a trailer..
Spheramid Enterprises Architectural Woodworks
Repairs, Remodeling, Restorations.
Hi there
Thought about that and might do it.
Has three legs, so I might need to get it onto some plywood also.
Jeff
I will be moving my machinery within the next week and that is exactly how I'm going to do it. Been there/done that
Jeff,
I have a DJ-20 which is Delta's 8" jointer. I HAD to take it apart to get it into my basement. What this did for me was to get to know it up-close-and-personal when I had to put it all back together. This is not a bad thing. If you can move what you have in one piece and postpone the personal stuff till later that's Ok, too. You did not mention the brand, but they all come apart and hopefully you were given the manual.
Good luck!
Phillip
I've successfully helped my hubby move a Chev 327 engine around the garage twice using pipe as rollers. Have to admit, it's not alot of fun though. Just be careful with the jointer that you're not all pushing sideways at once! It might hit a bump and tip over :>( Congrats on your new machine.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
You should avoid lifting by the tables obviously. I have had a lumber yard come over with their forklift. They will charge of course and you may have to wait for a free schedule. There are also machinery movers that will do the same, they are cheaper than fixing broken parts. Like Forest Girl says, you don't want to tip it over. I would not recommend lifting or moving around by hand unless you want a hernia.
Hi all
Was talking to a shop equipment mover today.
He said the machine weighs in close to 2000 lbs.
This is an old American Machinery 12" Jointer.
Has a massive 3 hp 3 ph motor that weighs more then I could lift by hand.
I think the tables weigh close to 500 lbs each.
He has the right equipment to move it, but will cost close to $1000.00 to do.
Now I'm really not sure the best way.
So much for low budget.
Now I see why no one wanted the machine.
Anyone have a free weekend and alot of muscle?
Jeff
Jeff,
You're getting a machine that would probably cost $8,000 to $10,000 if new, so investing a $1,000 to move it with guaranteed safety is a justifiable expense.
Moving heavy equipment is an art and screw ups can be disasters of major proportions, either a total loss of the machine or crushed body parts or both. Unless you have someone to help who has some experience with moving machinery, I'd suggest you let the pros do it, they make it look easy.
John W.
Moved a lot of iron over the years with such diverse ways as hoists, a log truck and log claw, tow trucks etc. My all time cheap way is to use an engine lift and a few chains. You can rent these usually from many places for less than $100 a day. You can buy an engine hoist for a few hundred bucks rated at 2,000 lbs. I've lifted a 16" oliver jointer that was rated at 2,000 lbs so I don't think your's will be any heavier. Keep the boom short for maximum weight capacity and lift the jointer up and back a pick up truck under it. Bring the hoist to the new location and repeat to remove from the truck. I've done this many times with planers, jointers, tablesaws and it's based on real experience not theory. I've also had guys with flatbeds for carrying cars move stuff such as bridgeports and such but each case has it unique differences. So far have not even come close to injury so it's well worth being safe and thinking it out carefully. If you have any doubts pay the professional. A low trailer would be better than a truck. Taking it apart is a good option but if you don't know how to align it back again it can be intimidating. On the other hand the odds of it getting bumped off calibration is very high because of moving it in general.
Jeff,
4 guys, by hand, moved mine (the same make and size) to my basement by disassembling it. It comes apart and goes back together easily. The tables are not that heavy, believe it or not. I carried one myself, if I recall correctly, so I can guarantee it was less than 150# or I wouldn't have even tried to do it. The base is the heavy part, and 4 guys got it, but the legs are also removable (we did not do this). If it has shims, note their position carefully, and replace, and see if it not right. This is a simple machine.
Enjoy your new toy.
AlanAlan
http://www.alanturnerfurnituremaker.com
Hi all
I think I've worked out the details.
My plan is to block the jointer up on 4x4 PT posts (timbers? whatever) by using my floor jack (will easily lift it) to get it onto the frame.
Bolt on the big metal dolly wheels (rated 1000 lb ea) I have.
Winch it to the Garage door and up onto a low trailer.
Remove wheels and tie down.
Reverse to get into my shop.
I used the same plan when I moved my planer (about 300 lbs) myself.
I'll keep it on the Mobile base in my shop till I get it set.
I plan to make the base wide enough and long enough to prevent tipping.
Any thoughts if this has a problem?
Also, any idea how strong the 4x4's are, and can they support this weight.
Jeff
When I moved my 36" Moak BS, 16" Sidney jointer and PM 221 planer all aver 2000 lbs each, I used a palet jack, come-a-long and a low-boy trailer. Used the jack to raise and paletize then move it to the trailer ramp. Then used the come-a-long to pull it up onto the low-boy. Once to the shop use the jack to roll them off. Made a mobil base for the jointer and use 6" casters under the PM221 planer.
Dave Koury
Could you expand on the details for "tie down?" This will be a crucial part of the operation. What material/method do you plan to use?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
FG
Tie down will be with 1" webbing strap.
The 5000 Lb type used for climbing.
Will go from sides and top to the pallet on the bottom.
Will also block the feet so it they can't move.
Thinking of blocking from the from the pallet right to the bottom of base to take weight off the feet for travel.
Then planning to strap (tie) with either heavy rope or strapping from the top, sides, back, etc to the trailer to prevent movement.
Will probably put some 2x4's on the top bed to protect them and tie them down also.
I'm trying not to put any real heavy pull on the beds to protect the ways from damage.
I may remove the motor to take the pressure off the mounts also.
I'll need to remove it anyway to replace with a single phase.
Anyway, that's the plan.
Jeff
"Then planning to strap (tie) with either heavy rope or strapping from the top, sides, back, etc to the trailer to prevent movement."
I would use a ratcheting strap at the very least for this part of it. Anything you do with plain rope or strapping is going to stretch.
Have fun!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
climbing rope and strap may have the strength you need but will elongate too much under stress – hey this is what climbing rope is supposed to do! You don't want 2000lbs of metal coming in the back of the truck! You'll need to tie the machine to prevent it tipping onto its side as you go round corners, and also fore and aft to restrain the mass when you start and stop.
now the tricky bit – as you drive down the highway, the whole machine, especially the tables, will vibrate up and down on account of the bumps in the road. If you don't support the tables, there is a risk that they will "flap" and damage the ways, so I suggest blocking under the tables and tie downs directly above this blocking. Then you only need worry that the bed of you trailer or truck will flex – only you can answer this one.
take care and enjoy the machine.
BTW I suggest you stay with the 3 phase motor.
Ian
Ian
Sorry, I was being simple with the answers.
I actually was planning to use mostly heavy strapping and very heavy Static rope.
I used all this type of stuff years ago when building radio towers.
I can easily winch with pulleys and the stuff I have the weight of the jointer into the trailer.
I also planned to put 2 sheets of plywood onto the trailer bed to be sure it will hold.
I was worried more about the 3 feet (breakage) and balance.
I was planning to do a good job tying everything down to prevent tipping and such.
I was also wondering if the beds would be ok.
No one mentioned that they should be blocked, but I can plan to do that also.
Your thoughts are very welcome.
Thank you, and any more feedback is greatly apprciated.
Jeff
Jeff,
I have some experience moving large machinery, tractors, etc. Sounds like you've got good ideas for lifting, and putting the castors under it. Not sure if 4x4's will be strong enough for 1000 lbs each. The risk there is that they will simply break, probably 1/2 way up the trailer. If I was moving it, I would weld together a metal truck for the jointer. Use 4" channel iron to build a frame, nice and wide since jointers can be top-heavy. Weld the castors on, wide again, and bolt the truck to the base of the jointer if possible. If not, weld on some blocks to keep it from sliding on the truck.
Winching it on a trailer would work just fine. Use good heavy ramps, blocking them if you need to. The worse place for the ramp to break is when the jointer is 1/2 way up. It could easily tip then.
When strapping it down, use plenty. Those 1" straps are OK, but 2" 14,000 lb straps would be better. I think I bought some for $18 a piece, ratchet and all.
Don't just put a couple straps on the top, pulling down. The jointer could tip, with nothing keeping it. I would use 4 straps to hold side movement...one for the front pulling right, one front pulling left, one back pulling right, and finally back pulling left. They're pulling against each other, but there is no risk that the jointer will tip and slide under the strap. Do the same front-back with one pulling forward and one pulling backward. Also, make sure you strap high enough on the jointer. You will need the leverage to keep it from tipping.
A note on the 3-phase. Not sure what size the motor is (5-7hp?), but you may be shocked when you price a single phase motor that size. 3 phase motors are much, much, much cheaper to purchase and operate. The only problem is that pesky expensive phase converter....
Good luck in your move. I'd love to pick up a big jointer like that sometime. Consider the metal truck idea. You may be happy you built it, when you want to move it around your shop a couple of times.
yieldmap
I have a time problem here.
Fellow is practically giving it away, he's in a hurry to get out of his shop to save money.
I planned to support and tie all around like you suggested.
I would love to build a metal mobile base, but can't do it myself, so I would need to have a local shop do it. All are busy and backed up with construction season in full bloom here.
As for the 4x4's, if you feel they're not strong enough, I can double them up.
I'll just bolt 2 together.
The fellow selling the jointer has a phase converter. Wants $800.00 it.
Motor on the jointer is 3 hp.
Local shop quoted me $400.00 for a 5 hp motor.
I'd take the converter for $500.00 if he'd go for it.
Any other great thoughts before I pick this up?
Jeff
I think I'd feel better bolting two 4x4's together (1 bolt directly under each leg, or more). After all, you've got 3? legs for points of contact...that's a lot of weight on just 4x4's. Just a thought...if the base is not too wide, you could laminate and bolt several 2x4's together to form the base (kinda like a benchtop). Ready-rod for the bolts. That would be pretty strong as well, and you could bolt the casters underneath it. Just a thought.
As for the phase converter, it depends on your shop. I don't have one, but I understand they make quite the whirring noise when they run. If you're in the basement or garage, your better half might complain. Myself, I'd just go with the motor. $400 doesn't sound too bad, as long as your electrical system can take it. I'm no electrician, but I'd bet 5hp would need 40-50 amps under full load. My sawyer has a nice 12" jointer, and it doesn't make too much noise. He's running 240V, no 3 phase.
Regardless, get that puppy out of the guys shop if it's in his way. It's not very often you run into deals like that!! I just hit one, where I'm cutting down about 2000 bf of red oak trees just for removing them from the property. Not a bad deal.
yieldmap
I'd originally planned to block it up onto the 4x4's like you suggested.
Decided it would be easier to get it on a pallet, then add the 4x4's with wheels.
Shop is seperate from the house, so noise isn't a problem.
I run a 5 hp on the tablesaw, so the power is no problem.
Jeff
3 hp single phase is more than enough power to run a 12" jointer. Why do you need 5 hp? Maybe if you are running three shifts continually but in my opinion it's overkill. You could even run the three phase motor on a statric converter and not have any problems. A static gives about half power because it basically just starts the motor and kicks out when it's running. A three phase motor will run on 240 single phase. You can get a phase-a-matic from Enco for $160. You said you were trying to keep it cheap!!!
Good thought.
I'll investigate.
Jeff
Actually if you really want to go cheap on phase conversion you could get a smaller motor to start the jointer motor spinning. Typically the smaller motor is on a pivot so you can disengage the motor. As I said before a three phase motor will run on 240 single phase but it won't start. The reason for the loss of power running this way is you are only running on two of the three legs. The spinning gets it past the missing leg and the other two legs keep it running. A static converter provides the third leg and after the motor is running the static converter does nothing but it's easier than doing the small motor thing every time you start the machine. Actually it's only cheaper if you have a small motor laying around.
Edited 6/1/2004 6:13 pm ET by rick3ddd
Rick
Grabbed a catalog real quick today before running out.
I can pick up a static (?) converter for under $200.00 and a motor (TEFC) for a little over $200.00.
Before I do anything, I'll probably throw it out to the crew here for thoughts.
First job is getting it here.
Jeff
If you can get a three horse single phase motor for $200 it's a no brainer. Typically three hp and up motors use a meagnetic starter which you made no mention of. As long as the starter isn't ancient you will have to upgrade the heaters. If the heaters aren't available you will do better to get a new starter. Cheapest would be Grizzly or Woodworkers Supply. http://www.surpluscenter.com/ and http://www.norterntool.com I use a lot as well.
Make sure whatever motor you are looking at is the same frame size as well as the same rpm and shaft size. If not you will have to adapt the mount and likely buy new pulleys. I am a fan of rotary converters. Your options will really open up as far as used machines go if you have 3 phase available. I run a 5 hp unit from tri-phase industries and it has worked great for the past 3+ years. Tom
Douglasville, GA
i hope you wont use that same piece ofwebbing for climing anymore!
Of course, I plan to use it again.
Actually, my climbing days are over.
I have a bum knee.
Jeff
I have the exact same jointer, and moved it into my shop on the second floor of an industrial building with 4 guys and two stout rollers (wooden frames with hvy duty casters.) It went in without incident (not to say that we weren't all quite alert throughout the trip) but if I was to do it again, and I will be in a couple of months, I would take the tables off. They slide off horizontally, and doing this in no way affects the rest of the adjustments. This will make the machine less top-heavy, which is the biggest danger in moving it.
(Also, don't put the beds anywhere that the machine might land, if it should still fall.)
Lift with your knees, exhale as you do, don't rush.
Good luck,
Matt
Matt
I've been pumping iron all week in preperation.
Jeff
I moved my 16 cresent jointer that weigth about 1500 lbs with a bucket loader and some chains. Put it on a trailer got it home and used a bucket loader again to get it in the garage. Now it is on a home made moble base and can be moved when I need to. You will like yours when you start to use it very smooth and plenty of power.
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