So I’ve spent the better part of my spare time during the last two weeks building a 66″ x 36″ maple mirror frame with a 5 1/4″ wide profile, 1 1/2″ thick. I sanded to 180 and finished with two coats of General Finishes Georgian Cherry Gel Stain and three coats of Java (same brand). The first two coats went of heavy to obtain a deep red. The last three coats went on somewhat lighter to cover with a mocha brown but still let the red shine through.
I debated what to topcoat with and settled on Minwax clear satin poly applied with a brush, only because of my comfort level and my fear of screwing this thing up. I went with a thin coat of poly to avoid pooling in the corners and valleys. I just went to sand for the second coat. I used 320 grit and was very gentle, yet I went through the stain to a pale pink in a small 16″ section on one of the ridges. I am sick! How could I take off this color with such a soft stroke? What the hell do I do now? Can I apply a dry brush of color (which is how I finished the last coat) in this area OVER the poly? Do I live with the bubbles left in the poly from the first coat? If you can’t already tell, I’m a relative amateur woodworker, cabinets and Minwax up till now. Any input would be appreciated.
Replies
Thin your poly to make a wipe-on version, this will eliminate future bubble problems. I'd say thin it about 50:50 with mineral spirits. This should also minimize the need for sanding between coats... you ought to need only to sand very lightly before the final two coats. Once you've thinned to wiping poly viscosity you'll need three coats to equal one as you'd have done it with a brush, so lots more coats but they'll be quick and easy to do and much less sanding, NO bubbles, NO runs or sags!
Touch up the area where you sanded through with a tiny brush, q-tip or whatever works and then apply about 6 coats of your newly made wiping poly before any further sanding. At this point things should look much brighter and you may only need to buff with some fine or medium synthetic steel wool pads (or you may need to sand very lightly with 320 grit paper or 180 to 220 grit sanding sponges). Go with the least abrasive option that you can get the job done with and be careful. Now a couple of final wipe-on coats and you are done! Nice Job mr. sflood75!
Hey Bigfoot, thanks for the tip. I will be taking your advice. Just a quick follow up question. What does this mixture of poly and mineral spirits cut the dry time down to. I'm using fast dry poly that takes about three hours to dry. Does this make it 1.5 hours when cut in half? Any thoughts would be appreciated. P.S.- I have to tell you how generous people are with their advice. I think this is the greatest resource I've found out there. So glad I finally clicked on "Knots".
Too many variables to answer this question from a distance. It should dry faster though... if faster drying is desirable I'd use naptha instead of mineral spirits for thinning. Smell it and feel it for stickiness.
If it still smells but is Not sticky (or only very slightly) that is just right for recoating.
If no or very little smell it is dry.
Edited 12/27/2008 1:30 pm ET by bigfootnampa
>> What does this mixture of poly and mineral spirits cut the dry time down to.Thinning an oil based finish will have little or no affect on "drying". Oil based finishes dry/cure in two steps. First the thinner evaporates at which time the finish becomes tack free. At this point the second stage begins which is the combining of the varnish with oxygen. This second step is the actually hardening and developing full adhesion process. This second step takes from 3-4 weeks to fully run its course.So, adding more thinner only affects the evaporation step. It takes the same amount of time for the thinner to evaporate no matter how much is added.Howie.........
sflood75, I found this thread shortly after reading your first one. Had almost ponied up a suggestion to "always try your finishing schedule out on scrap!" but decided to keep mum. And then came this thread.
My experience is pretty limited, but one thing I've learned (the hard way) is to never try a finish on a workpiece until I've tried the whole thing on scrap from the project. Finishing can seem like PITA to many, if not most, of us. It goes way beyond a PITA when an experiment ruins something that took many, many hours to build.
Wishing you luck with fixing the "oops" and getting on with the mirror. Keep the experience in mind next time around. Ouch.
Thanks for the advice forestgirl. I actually did do a finish schedule on a sample board. I'm far to paranoid and anal to wing it. I applied five coats of stain and the first coat of poly and stopped there. I didn't see a need to continue the final two coats of poly on the sample. I think that is where I was wrong. I'll definitely keep that in mind for the next time. Thanks again.
You did not ruin your project. Follow Bigfoot's advice and you should be ok. Remember, since you already have a finish on your mirror, you will not screw up the rest by spot staining the areas that you sanded through. Take it slow and the spot work should blend in pretty well. A wipe on poly or varnish application with a 50/50 mix is the way to go. I have been spraying my furniture for 30 years, but when I have a situation where I cannot spray, I use Bigfoot's method.
Thank you to Bigfoot and Terrylee for the reassurance and advice. I took my sample piece late last night (couldn't sleep) and duplicated my mistake. The touch up came out perfect. I was just afraid of applying color over that first coat of poly, but the color seemed to take fine. I will definitely take your advice on the wipe on version. I have an HVLP sprayer that I would prefer to use, but my shop isn't heated and I have a one year old in the house, so the basement is out. Sorry for the dramatics last night. I can freak out sometimes. Thanks again for all the great advice everyone.
"The touch up came out perfect." Congrats!!
"...(couldn't sleep)...." I know the feeling!
Do we get to see pics when it's finished (done, that is)???
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Absolutely! After all, I feel like a lot of you helped me build it. I suspect they will be up in a few days. I'll be sure to notify you when they are up. Thanks again to all!
Small artists brushes from your local hobby store are terrific for these sorts of errors. Don't sweat it, as it happens to every single one of us. Part of being a woodworker is learning how to repair our mistakes. You'll be fine......don't panic.
Jeff
I'm glad you found the fix.
Finishing (and woodworking) is a matter of building your knowledge base -- your own experience, what you read, advice from others, etc.
In this case I hope you learned to never, ever touch the first coat of a finish with sandpaper unless you are extremely cautious, since even a fine grade (like the 320 you used) can cut through in a heartbeat, particularly edges, corners, curves. Steel wool or woven products like ScotchBrite will virtually eliminate this problem -- although you still have to be careful.
To build that knowledge base, I recommend you keep a notebook with a description of products, techniques, and problems you had for each project. Such notes can also become an invaluable reference if you ever need to do a repair, or want to duplicate/vary a finish you used in the past.
Good luck................................
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"It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."
John Wooden 1910-
Thanks for your input. I thought I did something very wrong, to have have five coats of stain and 1 coat of poly and still burn thru the color. I didn't understand this. I was nice to hear that it does happen with sand paper. Even 320. I will keep in mind that synthetic stuff is the way to go. In the meantime, thanks to you and all that responded. You have made my first real finish job slightly less painful. Happy New Year!
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