Replies

1. 
   BG | May 14, 2003 06:51pm | #1

   Joe13,

   Welcome!  You'll get a lot of support from many on this forumn much more knowledgeable than I, however, to get started I would suggest you buy Ian Kirby's book on Dovetails.  It has a nice description of how to square up all 6 sides of a board and a minimalist point of view on tools needed to begin. Obviously, the book goes into nice practice and procedural detail on joinery using the different dovetails methods.

   Personally, I'd hit my library first to see what they have available if for no other reason than it's for free. There is also quite a bit of good stuff on the web and many here can give you links to those sites. 

   Relative to your question on hand planes, perhaps the best place to start is with a #5 jack plane..as the name implies, it does everything planing (flattening) wise ..kinda.   I have a jack, smoother, jointer and shoulder plane..once i find a good used scrub plane I'm stopping...right! 

     

1. 
   allisgood | May 15, 2003 01:22am | #5

   Thanks for the advice. I do have a couple of hand planes, a block plane, an edge triming block plane and a #5 jack. Not having a lot of practice with them success has been limited. A problem I have encountered is getting a slight bow out of a 6 or 7 foot board. Seems straight until you put it against the other board I'm joining it to. Maybe I'm not using the right tool? Also, how do you deal with a twist?  Joe13

1. 
   allisgood | May 15, 2003 01:29am | #6

   Should have read all responses before asking a question that had already been answered. Thank you, I love books so I won't hesitate to get some more. Joe13

2. 
   billyg83440 | May 15, 2003 01:38am | #8

   >>A problem I have encountered is getting a slight bow out of a 6 or 7 foot board. Seems straight until you put it against the other board I'm joining it to.

   If you clamp both boards you are glueing together side by side and plane both edges you're gonna glue together at the same time, they'll fit perfectly.

1. 
   allisgood | May 15, 2003 01:59am | #9

   If I clamp the boards together and plane the edges to be glued at the same time, and then have a slight "hump" in the center, wouldn't it be compounded when I put the two together?    Joe13

1. 
   billyg83440 | May 15, 2003 02:30am | #11

   Good question. Not quite sure how to answer it. You're right if there was a hump when you were done handplaning it'd be in both boards and would magnify the problem. I guess I'd dry fit it, notice the hump, mark it and then reclamp the boards together and flatten that area out some.

   When I've done this I've used a power jointer to do the edges, then clamped the two edges to be joined together and ran a hand plane down them. This cleans up any problems if the power planer isn't absolutely perpendicular.

   If I have a signifigant bow in a board I nibble that down with a hand plane before using the power planer. Faster to do it that way, and quieter.

   Guess I've never totally flattened out a board with just a hand plane.

   Of course, I can oversize things a bit, then cut the width to fit on a table saw. If you're totally going with handtools, you lose this option.

3. 
   BG | May 15, 2003 02:19am | #10

   Joe13,

   To eliminate the bow I do three things:

   1. use the jack on the diagonal (45* angle across the end of the board)

   2. Force it flat with either biscuits or a spline

   3. get another board

   those are probably not the right answers but is is what I do.  Very often the bow shows up after all the boards to be joined have been sized for joining.  I really don't want to end up with one board appreciably thinner than the others so that gives me either option 2 or 3 to choose from. With twist in a board using ripping it will reduce the twist significantly and then plane...but I often put it aside and cut it up for shorter pieces.

   Sometimes buying rough stock dosen't save you anything in the short run...

   I hoping someone jumps on my statements and shows me another way... 

2. 
   billyg83440 | May 14, 2003 07:07pm | #2

   I'm no expert. But, I do own one plane, and love to use it.

   Do a search here on things like hand plane, shooting boards, hand planing, etc. I've seen quite a few good discussions on these subjects.

   Here's a quick overview of how to work with a hand scraper. One of the tools I've yet to purchase. I'd recommend you get a good book or two on the subject, and start small, with one or two planes you can practice with, then as you work it'll become apparant which tools would help most.

   Good luck with it.

   
3. 
   BenM | May 15, 2003 12:23am | #3

   To get a board flat you need a flat surface, a pair of winding sticks and a plane.  If you have a workbench with bench dogs you can clamp the workpiece between the dogs.  If you don't then just take a piece of wood that is thinner than the workpiece and clamp it across the workbench to use as a stop.  Your workpiece only has to be pushed up against the stop; no clamping is required.

   The winding sticks are nothing more than two boards, with dimension of about 3 inches wide, 1/2 inch thick and about 24 inches long.  The dimensions are not critical.  What is important is that both boards have parallel sides.  Place one stick at the front of your workpiece and the other at the back.  The sticks should be approximately parallel to each other and it is the 1/2 inch edge that rests on the workpiece.  Sight over the front stick and lower your sight until the top  edge is aligned with the top edge of the rear stick.  If they are not parallel then you can see where the high spot is at one stick with respect to the other stick.  Mark that with a pencil scribble and plane away the scribbles and retest.  A standard bench plane will do but if there is a lot of material to remove a scrub plane is more efficient.  When the sticks are parallel the board is out of winding.  Use a smoothing plane to smooth the surface and then the board is flat (no light will show under a winding stick held against the board).

   To make the opposite side parallel to the first side you need a marking gauge.  I like to use a japanese gauge because it has a long fence but any kind will do.  Set the gauge for the thickness you need and hold the fence against the side you just flattened.  Scribe all around and then plane to the scribe lines.

   Now you have a board that is flat and of uniform thickness.  Plane one edge.  The longer the plane the easier it is to get straight.  Use a square to mark the two edges square and to get the correct width.  Plane the edges by planing in from both edges so you don't get tear out at the ends and finish up with the fourth side.

   You're done.

4. 
   JeffKurtz | May 15, 2003 01:04am | #4

   Joe,

   I'll recommend two books that are very helpful for handtool beginners: The Complete Woodworker ed. Bernard Jones, 10 Speed Press, Berkeley, 1980. and The Practical Woodworker ed. Bernard Jones, 10 Speed Press, Berkeley, 1983.  Both volumes sell for less than $20 each - think I bought mine at Barnes & Noble.

   I really like these because they were written at a time when there weren't any power tools, so the writing doesn't represent handtools as some sort of compromise.  They also give a lot of little pointers to help things go a bit more smoothly.

   As noted, check your public library and used bookstores for an old high school or even junior high text book.  They're written clearly and in detail.  (Lee Valley Tools has reprinted quite a few classic volumes which they sell for very reasonable prices. http://www.leevalley.com/home/main.asp)  While you're there, check out their planes as well - pricey, but nice.

   Finally, I'll pass on my opinion about planes.  First, three planes should cover most of your needs: a jack plane, a #5 smoothing plane, and a block plane.  Second, a used pre-WWII Stanley in good condition, properly tuned and well sharpened works just fine.  (A lot of people today think you need a $300 plane fitted with a $50 iron.  Bah!  Folks got along just fine for hundreds of years before cryogenically treated plane irons came along.)  Enjoy!

   Jeff

   
   

   ---

   Edited 5/14/2003 6:09:47 PM ET by Jeff K

5. 
   Alan | May 15, 2003 01:32am | #7

   Joe,

   I'll second the notion that before you buy any planes you should do a bit of reading.  The Handplane Book, by Garrett Hack is a great resource.  He discussed the various kinds of planes, what they're used for and how to tune them up and use them.  Besides the knowledge it contains it's a very handsome book; to quote myself, it's a coffee table book for those who made the coffee table.

   Another good reference is Planecraft, by Hampton and Clifford.  Planecraft is largely an advertisement for Record planes, but there's a lot of very good information and instructions.  It's well worth finding (IIRC it is carried by WoodCraft and Lie-Nielsen).

   Reviewing these, and any others you run across, will answer most of the questions you asked.  Buying tools, any tools, without the knowledge of why you need them and what they're used for can be a very expensive education.  Like anything else, IMHO, you should be a knowledgeable consumer.

   Alan

6. 
   Ronzonie | May 15, 2003 02:59am | #12

   Joe 13,

   All I read here is all valid infirmation.  Let me add my bit of sparse knowledge.  Garrett Hack's book is an excellent source of information and a good place to start.  Also, check out Patrick Leach's site on the http://WWW.  It would be great to have an unlimited amount of money to spend on a handplane to do each task we want it to do.  Reality being what it is however, here is one way to look at it.  You need a scrub plane to take the rough stock down quickly.  Then comes a trying plane to get it close to flat and true.  Then comes a smoother to put on the final, and I mean no more sanding, finish.  Until you can build up your cash reserves, this is what I suggest,  get a good (what is good?-used Stanley,Record,Clifton, Lie-Neilsen) and get different blades, each sharpened for it's intended function.  You will need to learn how to sharpen/prepare the irons.  This is a whole subject in itself and one that should be learned well whether you choose oilstones, waterstones, diamond paste, sandpaper and glass, etc, etc, etc.  For instance, say you got a good used Stanley #5.  Grind the Stanley iron for use as a scrub plane.  Get a Hock iron and grind it straight across for use as a trying plane.  Lastly, get another Hock or Lie-Neilsen and prepare it with a very slight crown ( I'm talkin' a crown of a coupla mils) and use this one for final planing.  Yes, it's time consuming to go from one to another but later, when you strike the mother lode, your not out much because you can always use the irons.   I want to emphasize learning to prepare a cutting edge here because I've found it to be a totally neglected and misunderstood part of the woodworking process.

   Ron

1. 
   Len | May 15, 2003 03:55am | #13

   Ron,

   You beat me to it. I agree. Learn to sharpen your plane blades. It makes a world of difference.

   Joe13,

   Here's a couple of suggestions for books.

   The woodworker's guide to hand tools - Peter Korn

   The complete guide to sharpening - Leonard Lee

   And welcome to the wonderful world of woodworking

   Len

7. 
   10fingers | May 15, 2003 07:01am | #14

   Hello Joe13,

   I think that you are on the right track starting with handplanes.  You will probably get addicted to collecting the "user quality" handplanes.  I bought a early stanley#8 as on of my first planes.  I spent a long time sharpening the blade until I could shave hair off of my arm with it.  My daughter still has one of my first long shavings of a mahogany board.  When you get your plane tuned and it performs well you may find yourself making shavings just to make shavings for practice.   Have fun.

   Chuck