I am in the proscess of obtaining my first woodworking bench. I am looking in to both buying a new bench as well as building my own. I like the idea of building my own bench, but am cincerned over the time, cost, and; I don’t have any experience working on a bench…at least not since high school…so I do not have any idea of the types of vices, size, construction, dog configutation, etc. to really know what I would build. I am a stickler for quality. If I am going to spend money I have worked hard to earn, or time that I value, I want the very best bang for my buck. That means quality both in craftsmanship as well as durability and versatility
So my thought is to buy my first bench and spend time learning my likes and needs. The problem I am running into is that the less expensive vices do not seem to be built well, and if I am buying an interim bench to learn on I would like a quality bench. I have narrowed my search down to four: Sjoberg, Veritas, Laguna, and Lie-Nielsen…everyone has to dream, right?
I would like to hear some opinions from all of you about the experiences you have had either buying and/or building. Design ideas, vice prefferences, etc.
Also looking for opinions on specific makes of benches and how they work for you. If it is really worth the money, I am happy to splurge on a Lie-Nielsen. I know it will be a good investment. Just need to to make it a well informed investment.
Thank you all.
Replies
I bought my father a bench for Xmas two years ago now. It was from Diefenbach (sp?) cost was close to LN but not as high. It is a very nice bench and comes in many styles. I did look at the LN bench (It was at a wood working show the year before) and it is a nicer bench then the Diefenbach. But it had a few issues. First off at the time I tried to get one they were not yet part of the full LN web page, and the details were still in transition. Then the price took a large jump (a few hundred) and the cost of shipping was a Lot more then the Diefenbach. Add in that they were talking about a bit of a wait and would not give a definitive amount of time, but that they would have not been likely to get the bench in December and it all added up to looking else where for a bench. Some of the other options that you have posted were not easily available at the time. So I was limited in options.
Only really downside of the bench is that it may be a bit short for me (I am 6'6") and that the fright company was a pain in the butt. The importer (forget the lady's name) was very nice and she jumped all over them and it only cost 1 day extra ship time.
So the things to take from my exp. 1) Premade benches can be very nice (and the LN is about tops on that list). 2) Premades have a lot of thought behind them, so a lot of the design is worked out for you. 3) Not building your own means you can spend time building other things, not building a bench.
Downsides would be A) Shipping is a pain in the but, B) Cost, if you go good it is expensive, if you go cheep you will not be happy. C) it is not the exact bench you would have built D)Unless you live in the right location you will have to buy the bench with out trying it out first (but then you cant try out one you are building either)
I would suggest if you can afford it go with the LN. At least get as good as you can afford. If latter you want to build your own, you can keep this one as a second or sell it. Personally I do not think that I will ever have to replace the Diefenbach (my dad and I share a wood shop) but it is not as nice as the LN. One thing I did do is order it without draws or anything, as I want to be able to build those to suit me, as soon as I figure out what I want on that).
So do not let people talk you into building a bench unless you really want to. Me I would have loved to but the cost would have been about the same and the time would have been to much, I have so many other things to work on that I decided I wanted to build other things more. In my case I built the kitchen cabinets and bought the bench, this gave me almost the same bench I would have built, and gave me cabinets that I wanted and could not buy.
Hope that helped a bit.
Doug M (did I tell you that the LN bench is a beauty? The Diefenbach is not bad (call it a vette, but the LN is a Ferrari).
Montet202,
If you google "Bob's Workbench" you'll get some good information about creating your own. The key message I took away was ..." you'll probably have 5 workbenches over a life time" that statement helped me get past a lot of uncertainty and confusion.
It's not easy building a workbench with out a workbench. Think trough all the details. Good Luck
Here are a couple of links that might be helpful:
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/fwnpdf/011188058.pdf
http://www.workbenchdesign.net/rreadymade.html
There are also several good books available on workbench design. If you haven't already seen them, the books might help in pre-determining which features meet your needs, as well as explaining the reasoning behind some of the designs.
M,
I encourage you to build your own bench, for two main reasons:
1) There are few commercially-sold benches that will be anywhere near as good as you can make yourself for the same money.
2) You'll learn a lot by designing and making a bench to suit just you, rather than having to put up with a generic bench designed for everyman.
There are some good books on bench design and making. Even so, I would avoid copying someone else's design verbatim. Rather, take elements from many designs and integrate them into a bench that will suit the work you do, your personal physiology and the types of tools/operations you prefer. In particular, beware of bench designs deemed good merely because they are old/traditional. Fish out the traditional elements that will suit you, rather than becoming a slave to the tradition.
Here are some links to bench threads. There are plenty more threads on benches, shoud you wish to do a search of Knots.
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33871.1
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33837.1
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=31454.1
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33300.56
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33822.137
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=36047.1
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=36790.1
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=36851.1
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=38173.1
Lataxe
About eighteen months ago, I was at the same point. Through luck, and not sound reasoning, I knocked together a bench using Douglas Fir from a local big box retailer. It took me less than one week-end.
It was a simple bench. No vises, no dog holes, no hold fasts. It cost me less than $30 IIRC. But it gave me a solid surface to work on that was comfortable for my height and the type of work I was doing. It also didn't move around and it didn't rack. That's very important.
Because it doesn't have vises, I had to hold work in place using some existing clamps (the same ones I use to glue up panels). However, that $30 investment gave me a working bench and some first hand feed back on what I would or would not like in a bench.
For example, I'm convinced that a tool tray is not for me. I also have a well developed appreciation of the benefit of vises, dog holes and hold fasts having made do without them. I'm also satisfied that I don't want cabinets under my bench. A shelf to hold the tools I'm currently using will be sufficient for me. Doing this should also give you an idea of what size bench you want for yourself.
The bottom line is "build yourself an inexpensive bench and use it to see what you do and don't like in a bench." Even that small investment won't be wasted once you acquire your "real" bench. In my case, it will serve as a staging table, glue up table, etc.
After one or two projects, I had a better understanding of my preferences and needs in a bench.
Good luck!
Phil
Lots of good advice for you so far -- I agree with just about every response you've had. The one thing I would strongly recommend is reading a few good books on the subject before making a commitment. I foung Scott Landis' The Workbench Book indispensable durring my own quest. As it turned out, I built the Klausz bench with few modifications, and I'm very happy.
I think the biggest challenge is coming to understand what you need to make the way you work most enjoyable. That's why doing a bit of reading helps. Having the wrong bench will force you to work in a way that doesn't meet your needs, and will slow you down, make you unhappy, and prove to be a waste of time, money, and effort. On the other hand, going to the trouble of really understanding what you want and why, is a process that you have to go through with every project, so doing that with a bench is a good exercise in critical thinking.
As far as the build or buy choice is concerned, I lean toward the build option. But if you know what you want and have the cash, buying will save you time for other things. With regard to the challenge of building a bench if you don't already have one to work on, I built mine when all I had in the shop was a B&D Workmate, so it can be done if you're willing. I'm happy with the result.
Good luck,
Verne
I agree with everything I have read, but I think you should build your own, it's only right (for a wood worker) you will learn lots about things you might not try until you have to, I know I did when I built my first bench. Since then I have built myself an other workbench last winter complete with a front vise and a twin screw vise on the end , which is better than the first, not that the first one was that bad.
Thanks for all of your input,
I am a 32 year old aspiring woodworker. At the moment I have a fairly large (35' x 25') shop space and I have outfitted it with a number of machines, wall mounted benches, shelving, and on and on. I spent the bulk of my twenties on residential finish work and made the transition into woodworking mostly through powertools, as that is the backbone of the residential world. I am starting to learn handtools, and am quickly learning to go to them first.
My concern is this: If I buils my own bench I fear that I don't have the experience to know what I like, need, want.
I am very retentive when it cimes to tools and obtaining the best there is. I don't like to buy things twice. So I am likely to turn my first bench into an atempted work of art that will be WAY overbuilt and suitable for a helipad. It will be way to bug, and wind up costing easily as much as a comercial bench. That is just me knowing me. (The meds are helping a bit.)
So I am thinking that my first bench might best serve me as a comercial bench as a tool to help learn what it is I realy want and need. A few years with this and I will be a more accomplished woodworker, and more comfortable with design decisions.
I have been reading The Workbench Book, as well as exausting the internet, FWW Archives and such. Npw I am looking for personal advice. The bench I am working on now is a 4' x 8' brick s#$t house of a table on locking casters. Sturdy but without vices, dogs, and a oiled wood surface. Good assembly and glue-up bench, but no woodworking bench.
Keep it coming boy, I appreciate all your input.
MTS
Montet,Merry Christmas.
Without getting to wishy washy about this workbench thing, for me, it's not as much about the design of the workbench. It's more about how the inclusion of the workbench refocuses your perspective. All of sudden you stop looking at magazines and purchases for solutions and start asking how did and do the pro's accomplish the task. I think you'll find this refocus to be very rewarding. Also, the creation of 'jigs' may suck up those genes where perfection is paramount. Every time I watch a pro work wood they will devise and use some little jig or technique that really makes it easier. Again, for me, the right bench design is less important than incorporating it effectively into my work environment. I don't want to have the bench loaded with stuff when I want to work...so I want tool storage near by...and electricity...and a place to store small cutoffs. If I had the money when I was building my bench I would have bought a pattern makers vise.
It might help to break the problem down into a few independent characteristics and then put them all together to get the design that works. I'd start with 1) bench size and height, 2) vices, 3) dogs and clamping methods, 4) on-board storage, and 5) power connections. The problem with a ready-made bench is that you may have to make compromises in order to get most of what you want. If you build your own, that isn't an issue. And, while it may not be the work of art that you'll be able to turn out twenty years from now, I'd bet it would be an excellent work bench that will last until you decide to build that work of art.
I think bench height is the most difficult -- it's sort of like choosing a recliner; the only way to get it right is to spend about an hour in each of several chairs. You can work this out in your shop by blocking your table up a bit or effectively lowering the surface by standing on one or more layers of plywood. Unless you're more than two sigmas from the norm, a couple of inches one way or the other is all the range you'll need to try in order to find the height that works for you. I'd adjust the height and then work on it for a week or two before changing it again -- unless it was obviously wrong.
Where vices are concerned, I'd recommend getting the best you can afford. If you build your own, buy the best hardware you can find. If you have junk for screws, it won't matter how good your work is, your vices will give you fits. If you get really good hardware, you can always rebuild your vices if you need to. In fact, you could scrap the whole bench years from now and use the hardware on a new one.
As for storage, I would stay away from drawers and shelves on my bench as long as I had adequate space in the shop for alternatives. I only have one shelf under my bench and it collects dust, shavings, and clutter. I do have a tool tray on the top that I like. It also collects a lot of junk, but it's easy to clean out and it keeps lots of items close at hand but off the bench surface when I'm working.
Thats probably a sufficient does of my opinions for now. Hope I've helped.
Verne
Twenty-five years of woodworking and I have built four benches and I’m planning number five. Build it, learn from it and get ready to build another. Two of the four are in regular use in my shop as will be the next one. Don't worship it use it, it's a tool.
Chris Schwarz over at Woodworking Magazine has just published both a book and a CD on workbenches. The CD is called The Workbench: How to Design or Modify a Bench for Efficient Use by Christopher Schwarz. The book is called Workbenches: From Design & Theory to Construction & Use.
Both are available from Lie-Nielsen at http://www.lie-nielsen.com/catalog.php?grp=1420
I really like Chris Schwarz's approach to things,so I'm prejudiced, but you can't go wrong seeing what he has to say.
BTW - I finished a workbench about 3 years ago, and made it's top from a sandwich of two 3/4" MDF panels with a 1x4 pine frame around it for edge stability and looks. It's solid, holds a face and an end vice very well, and the dog holes don't move around as I feared that they might. However, as I've come to learn, bench tops must be level, and they don't stay that way. They need to be flattened every few years.
Now I'm faced with the dilemma of having to find a way to flatten this MDF sandwich without creating more dust than flies around West Texas.
I suspect that I'll get to replace the top with a wooden one. Not a big deal - the bench got me started back in woodworking and has served me well.
Have fun! In woodworking (as a hobby) it really is the journey that counts.
Mike D
Do not get me wrong, if you want to build a workbench by all means do so, it looks like it would be fun (we do do this for fun no?) and it would be great to work at a bench you build. Kind of like living in a house you built and or designed. (ask me how I know about that last one) In fact one of the projects I am starting to design is a tool box. I think I will end up with a wall mounted box for my had tools. So I do not mind building things like this. But lets be honest. Most of us only have so much time, and any time spent building a tool box or a work bench is time not spent building what ever other projects you have on your list. So if you have the money and if you have a long list of things to do in relation to the amount of time to do them, then perhaps buying a bench is your better option. This way you end up with a nice bench and a nice living room table. The other way around you end up with an nice bench you built yourself and a POS from Ikea in the living room. (you only have so much time so you can not build everything)
Also i would like to point out that the argument that you should build your own workbench because you are a wood worker and that is a what a wood worker does is just nuts. Just because years ago the old times wood workers built their own bench. To use that same idea, we should build all our own tools because at some point in history that is what wood workers did. So let me know how you are all doing building a table saw from scratch! So can we at least let the conversation about building vs buying rest on the pluses and minuses of doing so vs the "All real wood workers build their own."
Doug M (Building as much as I have time for)
I have to (eat some of my words) and agree with Doug, that lots of us do not have time to build everything ourselves, I have no time limit on any of my projects as I work on them in my spare time from my construction job, the one that pays the bills. I have a good friend that is totally blind and he builds lawn furniture, I have never built any lawn furniture, I have bought a few picnic tables, chairs and a really nice loveseat bench from him, its not that I could not build that stuff I just can't find the time to do it. Back to the topic of the workbench as others have posted the vises you use should be of the best quality you can get, I cheeped out on my front vise and I pay for it every time I use it, as for the height of the bench Frank Klausz suggests to find the right height for yourself you should stand up, put your hands next to your pockets and your palms parallel to the floor. The distance between your palms and the floor equals the bench's height. Now that might not be perfect for you but it is somewhere to start. The bench I built ended up 36 1/2" at my 6' 2" height it works for me. So if you decide to buy or build the height is very important and I think the benches you are interested in can be ordered to your desired height. You will enjoy working on it either way you go.
I would still build it, never heard of a shop built table saw, but I did read of someone who built a band saw out of wood.
Edited 12/26/2008 2:04 pm ET by mikeddd
Edited 12/26/2008 2:16 pm ET by mikeddd
Way back in the good old days of FWW (black & white) they had a few articles on home built tablesaws. Pretty good stuff back then.
Thanks for the input.
For now I have decided to buy a bench.
Rest assured, though, that plans are in my head for the one I am building later. Figuring in cost and time, I think I will come out ahead buying one now. I want very much to build my own bench, but for now I want something to learn on and to help decide the things I would like to build into my own bench later. Besides...who couldn't use a second bench in their shop? And, after reading The Workbench book, and Workbenches, and reading every article from FWW, the bench I now have in my head will take me a year to build...at least! And it will be magnificent!
So without further debate on home-made or store bought, can anyone give me any advice on one of three benches:
Veritas, Sjoberg, and the Hoffman & Hammer Large benches. Or any suggestions on anything else?
Yup.
Take the wheels off that tank, get your self a solid core door, get 2 if ye want it THICK and attach it/them to the tank. Get the best and biggest Lee Valley front vise, and if you're really adventurous, grab their Twin Screw to throw on one end.
Use that for a year and you'll know what you want for a bench. You might just be surprised.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 12/26/2008 10:03 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Two solid core doors? Hummmmm, now THAT's an idea. Plain outside solid-core doors are flat and non-skewed.
Mike D
Edited 12/26/2008 11:35 pm ET by Mike_D
May the Lawd preserve us all. The OP answered his own question right from the start when he said:
" If it is really worth the money, I am happy to splurge on a Lie-Nielsen. I know it will be a good investment. Just need to to make it a well informed investment."
So that is the answer because 1)We don't know what competence level he is at or 2)what tools he has for building a Proper Bench (whatever that is) or 3)If he even has the space to build a bench and
4)If he buys a reasonable bench to start with he can actually do some woodwork in comfort and build up some skills and experience so that at a later stage 5)he can build his own bench to suit himself and
6)Recoup the money he spent on the original investment because he will be able to re-sell that bench, especially if he has looked after it and even added some refinements.
I says my piece and holds it too.Philip Marcou
Edited 12/27/2008 3:29 am by philip
Philip,
All you say is true and one can nod in agreement until the prices of them LNs are viewed. $2500 for a basic one! For that one might build a veritable fortress of a bench in solid lignum vitae! (Well, almost). Perhaps an LN can be resold for a good price....but then there is the shipping cost.
And is not the building of a bench a good project both to learn many woodworking skills and the building of furniture in it's own right? (Shed furniture, admittedly). One might use basic joints or go mad with large and ostentatious dovetails everywhere, depending on ambitions.
****
Still, the OP wants to buy. I felt the same - before I realised that there were few commercially made benches that were up-to-snuff. That LN is a rare exception of the well made variety. Most other marques seem to be made down to a price, a build-approach that the user will eventually pay for in another currency, such as frustration or annoyance with a lightweight, skitter-across-the-floor, wobbly and vise-racking heap of expensive wood.
That last FWW article concerning ready-to-buy benches was not too complimentary about most benches. "Overpriced and underbuild" seemed to be the conclusion, apart from a couple of exceptions (which were still expensive) such as the LN.
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/Workshop/WorkshopPDF.aspx?id=27577
Lataxe
Lataxe and all,
I think you under value a decent bench. It is my contention that building a real bench is not an easy task for the new man, unless he will accept a make -shift one . Ofcourse one can make a serviceable bench using a solid core door (if fireproof it will be much heavier than any thick laminated one) but there is still the question of attaching legs and vise if the standard woodworker vises are to be used.
By the time one has the skills to build what you guys like to use as a bench then the price will have been paid in terms of inconvenience and time wasted alone so I think it is better for the serious diy woodworker to invest in the best he can afford- it will last him a life time anyway.
As a matter of interest- does anyone recall these benches- pictured in a 1997 Garrett Wade catalogue? (Brief history: A Portuguese guy ran this business for about 15 years and did well with those benches and other (better ones)-then he sold out to another company in 1993 and by 1997 the business was well on the way to being screwed due to quality control problems etc).Philip Marcou
philip,
I guess it's a matter of what your priorities are and how much money you're willing to spend. I vaguely remember those benches you spoke of but the mind isn't what it used to be methinks.
Anyway. I got the impression the OP was in the trades, maybe Im wrong, so I thought he might have access to a salvaged solid core door. With a wee bit of work he could be up and running pronto.
I think the workbench is the most important tool you will ever own and is a matter of personal preference as much. It's hard for me to say - do this or do that as my situation isn't like anyone elses.
The OP is either reading these words from us, comparing the suggestions to see if they are viable for him, or who knows, he might be assembling his new bench!
Whichever way he goes it will be right in the long run - we jus offer what work(s/ed) for us.
Mebbe I'm just too much of a penny pinchin old phart :-)
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
I am no longer in the trade. I traded my nail bags and long hard days, went to school and now have a cush county job as a Paramedic. I am now a year and a half into learning to work wood as an art. I have no intention of making a living at it. Actually don't care if I ever make a dime.
With a background in residential carpentry my first instinct was to buy a bunch of machines, and am now learning handtools.
It is hard, though, with no way, locally, to learn other than mags, books, videos, and this site. I have a few friends locally that I can bounce ideas off of, but many decisions, like this bench, are a slightly educated crap shoot.
I like nice tools. I prefer to buy tools once. So I tend to research the hell out of anything I buy to ensure that it is the last. If I have to spend more to do it right, then so be it. (No kids yet! Gotta do this while I can.)
Hope this helps put things in perspective.
Also: Any reson not to use old growth CVG Fir for a bench? (Reclaimed from a building built in 1906) Just found out I may have access to a bunch for a very good price. Most pieces are 16' x 16" x 3.5". Will the top last years of abuse?
montet202,"Also: Any reason not to use old growth CVG Fir for a bench? (Reclaimed from a building built in 1906) Just found out I may have access to a bunch for a very good price. Most pieces are 16' x 16" x 3.5". Will the top last years of abuse?"You'll be amazed at how little you care about the wood type of the workbench when your working up a lather trying to flatten a board.
C H R I S who posts here a lot just built a very nice bench from some salvaged old growth Doug Fir. Great material, hard enough and dry enough to be stable, but you don't have to baby it. Sarge also works of of a pine/fir bench and he just rebuilt the top for it a few months ago.
I would give it a try, build your first one and enjoy the learning curve. Sounds like you have some reasonable cheap material to work with. It depends on what you will build with it, you say art pieces so that could be anything. If you are carving alot a different carvers/patternmakers vice might suit you better. If you are a traditional furniture builder, then Lataxes double twin screws will be great. I have one and prefer it as well.
If you are building kitchen cabinets and such and an assembly table about 18 to 24" high is much nicer, for glue ups etc. It is at a workable height.
Good luck and enjoy the process. AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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-------(*)/ (*) http://www.EarthArtLandscape.com
Built? No - is building. Eight months in the making, I foresee another few at least.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
"Any reson not to use old growth CVG Fir for a bench? "
I'd think it would work great. The only problem is that it might be a tad light. I value density as much as hardness simply for the weight. My idea of the ideal bench is a traditional top mounted on a big concrete block. Mine is laminated maple, and it weighs a short ton, but it could be heavier. If you use the Fir and you find it a little on the light side, you can always sand bag the legs or add weight some other way.
Inertia makes all the difference!
Verne
Will the top last years of abuse?
Kinda doubt it - it's soft wood. But, I would be all over buying it if ye can get it reasonable, especially if it's mostly clear and not too many knots. Tight small knots might be ok though.
If ya know anyone with a portable bandsaw mill those planks could make some really nice boards for furniture, especially when your gettin started. What about cabinets for the woodshop? Make some of those too.
Some of those 3½" thick planks ripped down could also make some nice bench legs. Hey whatta ya got to lose - make a benchtop out of some of it and mount it on that tank ye got there. And you'll be Green at the same time!
What I'm suggesting is if you can buy some material at a good price, use it to learn with - make sumpin with it. Jeeeeesh, I'm beginning to sound like Charles.....
Betcha yer still on the buy/build a bench fence aintcha? I say build it! You know, there's a salvage place not too far from me that has sections of bowling alley........
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
old groth VG fir is neither light or soft. the tight rings are very hard and pretty close.. it is probably more dent resistant than hard maple which I consider soft ( in that it can easily be dented by small objects.... like dog fingernails).
If I were doing this I would be tempted to use the edge grain top to bottom to maximize the hardness of the growth rings.
james
All right, I am taking all of your advice to build this bench. And just so we are clear; I am ralking about a Klausz style bench. Not an assembly table, or some other make-shift get me by kind of thing. My shop currently is full of make-shift-get-me-by benches and a fine assembly bench.
This fir is amazing. I went to look at it yesterday and looking at the end grain I found it to be some of the nicest stuff I have seen! Being from the northwest, fir is everwhere. This stuff was harvested around where I live in the Panhandle of Idaho right around the turn of the LAST century. Kind of cool to think these trees were felled with handsaws...fitting for a bench. Anyway; very tight grain, easy to find pieces without knots. Really very hard...not your Home Depot's fir! Not as hard as Maple, But hundreds less. Turns out enough material to complete the bench with enough left over to build a few shop cabinets and a build-in in the house for the boss for about $600! Already drug a truckload home, checked for metal, and planed one end of the top piece: Beautiful!
So now my OCD is on a mission, which has oppened up doors to many, and I mean many, more questions. Tackle all, or some, ans rest assured, there will be lots to follow:
1) Vices: Which ones would you suggest? Tail, front, and shoulder are what I am thinking, although may trade the shoulder for a Veritas twin screw. And where is the source for the best hardware? I would like to buy the vice hardware once. Hundreds of hours of OT lately so cash is available. Furniture is my goal. Boxes, etc. No carving. No turning. Occasional cabinets.
2) Apparently building my own bench is going to require a few new tools! To plane the top flat I am going to need either a low angle jointer, a #7, or #8. Thoughts? Would like something that will do the job, but still be useful for future projects, ets.
3) Dimentions? According to the height of my palms...35 1/2 inches...So I am interested in length/width. This will replace a 4 x 8 foot bench so space is available.
4) What not-so-obvious items, tools, materials, etc. will I need?
5) Suggested lables of Scotch and/or Irish Whiskey to aid in troubleshooting the inevitable problems when they arise?
Thank you for all of your help. I do appreciate it.
M,
Using a veritas twin screw as a face vise will also give you a lot of the functionality of a shoulder vise. Also, not needing the fifth leg to support a traditional shoulder vise assembly will make construction simpler - and that fifth leg won't get in your way.
Do you really need a 4 ft wide bench? I suppose it remains usuable if you can walk all around it. But it will be too wide if you use it agin a wall, as you will not be able to stretch to the far side to use a tool there.
"Solid and weighty" is the most important aspect of a good bench. Thick legs (1/4 X 16/4 if possible) and chunky aprons. Personally I think two long aprons are better than just one, as the top is then not required to create stiffness to the top end of the bench undercarriage. Also, making it knock-down (bed bolts into the long aprons and top just wedged in place raather than fastened down) will make the bench easier to move if it has to change buildings.
Round dog holes are easier to make than square. I would argue that they're also more versatile, as they allow the flat face of the round dog to face in any direction. Also, they wil take a hold-down with a 3/4" post, so you can place that hold down anywhere on the bench top and not just in a single, dedicated hole. Use of Veritas bench dogs and pups means that you can put less holes in the bench top, as the dogs/pups have in-built mini-vises that represent "virtually moveable" dogholes.
Tool trays are shavings/dust and junk collectors. If you have to have one, give it a removable bottom that you can pull up and out.
A cupboard/drawers under the bench adds weight but also useful storage space. If you can, work out how to place (open) drawers to act as plank supports at various heights; and ensure that a long plank held vertically in the face vise doesn't prevent you from opening the cupboard with the tool in it that you want to use. :-)
Lataxe
Glad you've decided to build! I can't wait until I feel the need to start on a new bench myself.
I agree with James that your fir is not soft, not so sure about the weight - I think that varies, but since it's old growth, he's probably right that it's heavier than the usual lumber yard stuff.
As I said in a previous post, I like my tool tray 'cause it keeps things handy but below the surface and it's pretty easy to clean out. Drawers and shelves collect just as much dirt and junk, but they're harder to clean. Guess you'll just have to sort it out based on your work habits.
I also agree that 4' is really too wide for the top. Makes for a long reach and requires a lot of material and assembly time that doesn't really add to the essential work surface; you can't reach that far to accomplish anything with a plane, chisel, or saw, so it doesn't matter if your work hangs over the back.
I'd recommend building your legs out of any stout but cheap material you can get your hands on. If you decide you need to raise or lower the height, it won't cost much to scrap the originals and build a new set and make them really nice once you know how long they should be.
I'm glad to see the topic of adult beverages pop up -- I usually only see that in conjunction with cigars on serious fly fishing forums. Unfortunately, I can't help you on the Scotch question; however, I find a dirty Bombay Saphire martinin with just a wiff of vermouth really adds to my creativity.
Cheers!
Verne
Well I see you've found your way.
Be forewarned that this slope you're about to slide down is but one of many that will surely come your way. Sounds like we'll be seeing posts from you about fettling planes, sharpening chisels, what is the best dovetail saw, what carving chisels should I buy..........
Oh man, you're going to have a blast! I do see one flaw in your thinking though. You're thrifty! I don't see a lot of gew gaws in your travels.
Charles, will you stop it,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Just my thoughts on the subject after a few years butchering wood… My last bench is a combination of Ian Kirby’s design in the English tradition, (shorter and wider no tool tray), with a Yost patternmakers vice on the face and the addition of a John Nyquist style tail vice. (see “The Workbench Book” by Scott Landis page 132 or “The Workbench” by Lon Schelleing pages 86-87). I find it suits my working style, I use it for planning and cutting joinery and some assembly.
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I like this tail vice not just because of its simple construction but it offers three places to hold the work. It is VERY strong and I highly recommend it.
Edited to add: that I am a bourbon drinker myself. If it is going bad I'm in the Jim Beam, I toast my success with a bit of Makers Mark or Woodford Reserve. You know the greatest woodworking job in the world may be as a cooper for a good distillery…. Wow, I gotta look into that!
Edited 12/31/2008 1:19 pm ET by Napie
Bad news friend -- a lot of the good distilleries are located in dry counties and only the quality control folks get to taste.
I have to agree that Makers' Mark makes a nice conclusion to a job well done.
If Bull Halsey had been a cabinet maker, he would have said, "I don't trust a woodworker who doesn't drink or smoke!"
Here's dust in your eyes!
Verne
Know all about <!----><!----><!---->Kentucky<!----><!----> and the dry counties, but you can still get a taste, try this for fun:
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http://www.kybourbontrail.com/#
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Admiral Halsey was a great man and hero of mine (I'm former navy), but did you know that he really never learned to fly? He got just enough qualifications to have a carrier command.
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I also enjoy the occasional Ashton with my Woodford.
Well off the thread here, but have to let you know that, even though I'm former Coast Guard, I'd never hold your past against you -- especially since it seems you drink better than I do.
Carry On!
Sailors tend to drink well, or at least a lot…<!----><!----><!---->
Coasty huh? You know why you have to be over six feet tall to join the Coast Guard? If your “boat” sinks you can wade back to shore…. All kidding aside some of my best friends were puddle pirates. Were you on a cutter?<!----><!---->
Aye, Mate! Will follow up by e-mail and let folks get back to woodwork here.
Verne
Having strayed AGAIN just a wee bit,
Enjoyed your link to the Bourbon Trail,especially the 1792 'close up'.Question,if I may? The first & second shots of the slide show show numerous concrete block structures around the site.Do you know what their purpose? I thought maybe workers lodgings,but seems too many.
With thanks
Robin
Ah, Maker's Mark AND Woodford Reserve, my two favorite bourbons. While I was picking up a bottle of each for upcoming Christmas visitors the store owner said "wait, you just have to try this". "This" was a bottle of Woodford Reserve Sweet Mash - very tasty.
If you like those you will love the offerings from Mitchners (sp?). not commonly available but worth the search.
james
Wow, Google can't find it so it must really be rare. Is it a Bourbon?
Mike D
The Woodford Reserve sweet mash is fine stuff. They had it this year at Costco of all places, case after case stacked up, like gold. That of course opens up the sweet versus sour mash debate which can be more intense than the oil stone versus water stone one. The research is a bit more pleasant though.<!----><!----><!---->
By the case at Costco? Please don't tell me what it cost a bottle - I suspect that I paid a premium! Oh, well - it did go down very smooth, and my guests really liked it. :)
You're right, you don't want to know, I bought ten bottles.
The Woodford Reserve sweet mash is fine stuff. They had it this year at Costco of all places, case after case stacked up, like gold. That of course opens up the sweet versus sour mash debate which can be more intense than the oil stone versus water stone one. The research is a bit more pleasant though.
Trouble (or blessing) is that if the research is conducted properly, you can't remember the results!
So the research is ongoing :-)
David
"All right, I am taking all of your advice to build this bench. And just so we are clear; I am ralking about a Klausz style bench. Not an assembly table, or some other make-shift get me by kind of thing. My shop currently is full of make-shift-get-me-by benches and a fine assembly bench."
Montet - I came into this thread late, but your first few posts about buying a bench and your interests in woodworking brought up a couple of salient points:
You're not likely to save any money making your own bench unless you consider your time to be free.
-And-
If you're into hand-tool work, buying a commercial bench is a real mistake. There are several reasons for this, none of which has to do with customizing a bench to suit your tastes, etc... The reason is that the commercial benches are not really suitable for the full-range of hand-tool work, including preparing rough lumber by hand. One of the biggest, most glaring design errors of these benches (including the quite pricey Lie-Nielsen) is that the legs are not flush with the front, and they have an apron. That makes gripping a board to work on its face quite difficult - there's no provision for supporting the lower edge.
OK, now here's the real point of this post - it's a severe mistake to build a bench that's intended for hand-tool work without buying Chris Schwarz's "Workbenches: From Theory and Design to Construction and Use". The reason is simple - the price is dirt cheap (about $25), and Chris does something in this book that is simply not present in any other - he analyzes the reasons for making a bench in certain forms, analyzes the shortcomings and pros of particular vises, and generally makes a mockery of previous workbench books that are largely a catalogue of famous woodworker's benches. While those books are nice as a coffee-table item (I have several), they are not appropriate for someone out to design a workbench for hand-tool work. Chris may not be right about every point in the book, but he provides the basis for you to decide whether he's correct or not - very few other authors do that, they just teach you the "right" way to do something.
This book will save you a boat-load of frustration, aggravation, and money. Buy it, or check it out from a library. You will likely get some nay-sayers on this thread, but ignore those - it will not cost you anything to read this book because you can sell it for about what you paid for it - it's that good.
Seems like sound advice.
As I mentioned earlier in this thread,I'm at the head-scratching stage myself,and this book sounds good.
Do you by chance have its ISBN ?
With hopeful thanks,
Robin
"Do you by chance have its ISBN ?"
Robin - the ISBN in the front of the book is confusing - there are 2:
ISBN-10: 1-55870-840-5
ISBN-13: 978-1-55870-840-2
If you choose to buy it, you can get it from a lot of sources (including, ironically enough, from Lie-Nielsen). You can also order it personally from Chris' publication company, Lost Art Press. If you arder it from LAP, you get a signed copy:
http://www.lostartpress.com/
When I first started down this road I purchased several of these books from Amazon.
If I remember correctly there was a discount buying "Workbenches" and "The Workbench" together. Both have served me well. Also, as mentioned..."The Workbench Book."
They all seem to be useful books, however, I have to agree that "Workbenches" is the most practical and useful.
Being the cheap bastard that I am...I am doing my best to find some free "leftovers" from the timbermen around my area. (Decided not to use Fir for the top.)
"Being the cheap bastard that I am...I am doing my best to find some free "leftovers" from the timbermen around my area."
Nothing wrong with that - Since you're going to have to do a lot of processing anyway, and it doesn't matter if there are knots on the underside, you can use relatively crappy lumber. One thing I should mention is that it's worth lining up the grain patterns so that it will all plane in the same direction. It doesn't matter if you're going to use a drum sander to flatten the top, but chances are down the rod you're going to need to re-flatten it in assembled bench form with a handplane.
Hi,Saying this with a wink, but if you bought more books about workbenches, you could ultimately make the books into a workbench....My bench is a foolish, ugly donkey. Redwood 4 x 4 posts for legs / rails, pinned mortise and tenon through out, top 'n bottom rails on all sides. Laminated pine 2 x 4 top, 30" x 72". A simple floor made from old cabinet doors spans the bottom rails, home for my tool chest. The floor occupies only half the rails, the rest is open to the garage's concrete floor, where I stuffed my Shop Vac.My "vice" is a set of Jorgenson hold-fasts that are fixed where ever it's necessary. On the edge for hand planing, on the top to hold things (sawing, drilling), wherever. Pine means never having to apologize for drilling an ad hoc hole.10 years ago, I built this ugly donkey as a temporary thing until I built a magazine quality bench - still haven't built that good bench! Upon this ugly donkey that is tailored to no particular method of work, I've built 2 complete beds, a Scott Gibson inspired hallway cabinet, 3 tables, a self-made lathe to make drums, and 4 stave-constructed snare drums.Don't fuss about the bench. Just let the sawdust fly!Cheers,Seth
Dk, Many thanks,I'll try all three!
Tis a bit confusing,tho', TWO numbers !
R.
Phillip, I remember those benches. Considered buying one, but never did.Greg
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My Current bench is made of 2X6 construction lumber,, It works!
However I have made several of a better quality..
I was NEVER sure one was BETTER than the other!
They are good points you make.
I have a great interest in the thread,as I too,will be putting together my proper bench in the near future,so all this is good stuff!
I have read many of the articles from FWW about benches,new & traditional,and they still form my 'going to sleep' reading.
"Get a life" do I hear you all cry?
Robin.
Robin,
I don't know where you are located, and I am not surprised you are scratching your head. There is a very "nice" way to do it-as described by STPatrick, if you have the resources. Then there is DKeller's advice, which is hard to beat, provided you have sufficient skill level. Then again, if you have a good look at a L/n bench and find that it is suitable, this has its own advantages too.
And then you could just build something which would probably be regarded as quite weird-like the one I have had for 25 years.Philip Marcou
Philip,
I think I'm on the other side of 'the ditch' to you. Reading all the correspondence [as one does] in these columnmnmns,I gather you reside in Neu Tzeeland. Are you a Northern or a Southern person,and are you close to any of the wine making regions?:-) I'm in the Southern Highlands of NSW.
Ah,benches, that's right! Be under no misaprehension....I will not [can't] be buying a L/N or any other already manufactured masterpiece without first goin' cap in hand, the cap first bein' approved by David the Lataxe,doyen of the Brainwarmers Guild,to the bank manager. This will NOT happen.
I'm presently using a simple structure,a fairly sturdy base with legs of 100 milligrubbers square,stretchers top & bottom of 40 x 100 of them similar things,all bolted together with obscenely large nuts & bolts,the top bein' MDF,I'm sorry to admit,but this structure was only ever intended as a stand in until the real thing came along. As I think on it,it has never mattered wot the top was or is, as one catches only brief glimpses of it whilst picking up here a tool,grinding there a chisel,searching amongst tubes of stuff,brocken blades,etc.,etc.,......you've probably come across things like this before.
Suffice to say,I want to build me proper one.
Cheers from Bowral
Robin
Robin,
Wot I need is a large grant from Her Majesty, so I can go around the woodworking nations (first clarss, natchelly) to help with wood-scavenging and bench-making. That is a life I might take to, especially if the bloke being visited lives near a fine wine producing region, such as that New South Wales. (I once stayed in Bright, which may be in Victoria but is not too far away from the southern end of NSW).
For a bench, which needs large volumes of heavy timber to make a good 'un, scavenging for freewood is a necessity, as them timber yards are greedy when it comes to pricing 4" X 4" hardwoods. Derek has taken to skip-raiding but I recommend the cultivation of builder-men down the pub, using amber-nectar and flattery to persuade them to get you nice old timber they would otherwise rip out of an old place to put in the bonty-fire or the landfill.
Then you will just have to buy a couple of Veritas twin-screw vises. :-)
Lataxe, who knows a bench is quite a simple thing to make really.
Hello David,
Wot a luverly life THAT wood be,sloping around the globe,dispensing succour and bon hommie on bearf of Betty W,sorting out a supply of good stuff for one's shed!
Hmm.
You're dead right about the pricing of hardwood....even the recyclers here are noticeably greedy,particularly anywhere within a drop kick & a 9 iron's distance of us here! V.posh we're supposed to be..and therefore able to buy at vastly inflated prices.
Your suggestion of plyin' the local tradies in the pub is worth following up,even tho' I've resorted to a wee bit of skip raiding in the dead of night when the temptation has been too great!
Posh indeed. [snort,harumph.]
Yep,my beast wasn't too hard to build,but it's the hardwear that I miss,and must get on with.. as you laughingly noted. I DO need a couple of proper vises..I've convinced mesell about one o'them fancy two handled gadgets,and I really like them laterally mounted end ones like wot ya put on the front of the bench,and use with dogs or sum such.
I see a bit o' a problem gittin' this one fitted,but if'n I itch ma wee heed long enough,reckon as how I'll see tha light. Probly need to rebuild that corner,sister up the stretcher or sumpn simlar.Anyroad,wotever it takes,I guess.
Ong passong, Bright and the areas thereabouts,are producing beautiful cold-climate wines these days.Another visit would be most rewarding!
If'n ye have any brainwaves about that end vise,would luv to see a missive :-)
In the meantime,
Robin, Itch'n away.
Robin,
Always scratch an itch. It may cause a scab but what a pleasure it is to give in to the desire to claw at the tickley bit! This is life as a human - itchin' & scratchin'.
Here are some old posts about my bench-fangles (and some of other folk). There are many other posts and pics within Knots of bench and bench-stuff. Sarge, in particular, is a great bench-man.
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33300.56
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33822.137
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33822.132
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=33837.25
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=37569.10
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=31060.16
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=38173.1
Lataxe
My dear Lataxe, if I may presume, and thru' you, all the other Gentlemen who have contributed to the thread..........I have you all written down..up to 14 of you all..would take me the rest of the afternoon to type you in,but I suspect you'll know who you are,
Thanks to all of you for xtallising my ideas about what I want to do for my 'proper' work bench.
It all started with my seeing a 'New workbench' header,and arriving in the middle of the disscussion,as usual!
David, the Lataxe,listed a number of previous posts,and from his comprehensive selection, you guys appeared,along with more very relevant items,and I would like you all to know how appreciative I am of your ideas,and in the words of one of our once famous pugulists....."..Thank yuz, an' I luv youse all"
Like Philips',my current bench is a rather ugly looking affair,not unlike Mrs Worthington's daughter,she of Noel Cowards famous song, when aspiring to a stage career,was deemed unlikely to succeed,just as my bench is unlikely to metamorphose into a thing of functional beauty whatever is done to it!
However comma time has come for a serious overhaul.I propose adding 2 shoulder vises,[ face and tail ] Veritas twins of course,aprons all around to accomodate the aforementioned,and to facilitate dogholes as and where most useful,the little shop made front slung doover for end support of vertical boards,as beautifully depicted by the Lataxe,together with his metal toothed thingummy,if I can find one. It is also time for the MDF top to go,to be replaced [ I hope ] with 1 or 2 solid core doors,hopefully scrounged from a re-cylcled timber joint nearby.If that fails,then it looks like a lot of egde glueing coming up!
Just another opportunity for further steep learning curves. :-)
I pale somewhat and become a little braintied when I think of my good fortune in finding this forum,and through it,you fellows [girls included] with your collective knowledge & practical skills so freely given in these columns.I can tell you that this bench upgrade,as only 1 example, would have been a mere flea-bite on the elephant's arse had it not been for the shared experiences of you all,and the confidence you all inspire.
I'm now thoroughly embarrassed,and will take my copies and sit quietly re-reading all this good stuff.
Cheers from Bowral
Robin
Robin, with an assist from Bro. Froe I negotiated a pair of "York stops" from the Axminister tool folks. I ran the edge of the tail twin screw flush to the front edge of the bench and mounted the stop with #14 screws. It is quite robust but works very well. Paddy
Paddy,
Wonderin if ye could make one with a pipe flange, a 90° elbow and a hacksaw?
Taint elegant but then agin I don't have a shed neither.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 1/10/2009 5:19 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
S.O.B. I would rather make two flat iron brackets(or one wider one) to house a sliding block of hard wood 1 1/2 sq. with an extended flat of flat iron 1 1/2 x 1 7/8 filed to pointy teeth mounted on the end with three hard #6 or#8 screws. Ya could also thread the top of the flat bar bracket for a 1/4-20 thumb screw or one of those fancy LV jig knobs to get in position till the clamping tension happens. OR cough up the 19 1/2 pounds (as of this A.M. , without VAT) PLUS S&H from the land of the Queen.
IIRC, I caught a sale for 13 or 14 pounds, and I thought I had been abused.
In thinking about your solution- all iron pipe or heavy wall brass- 1/2" flange, close nipple, cast 90, short nipple(est. 3" to clear the flange and note no adjustment for center of board), 90, close nipple filled with a dowel with a screw in it's center (cut off the head and file to a point) and it is uuuuugley! Paddy
Paddy,
I been readin' & a tinkin' about your comment regarding the York stops,and how you mounted the pair of 'em.
Am I right in visualising this as one mounted a la Le Lataxe,and the other on the vertical edge of the moving face of the vise?
[ I read Bob's suffix line to his posts,and frequently,ruefully smile to meself!....Is it any wonder? ]
Robin
Robin, your first visual is correct, I followed the master, (see thread 33822.137 pic of tail vise) but placed it to suit holding a long board with the pattern makers vice as the face vice. I would not use it vertically on the tail vise (use dogs instead) but I have seen it used vertically just below the back of the bench edge opposite the face vice or opposite the tail vice at the other end as a pop up stop. Paddy
Many thanks Paddy, There're certainly no shortage of variations,are there not?..All useful.
Now I have to finish the bench.
Robin
Robin,
Yes, get on with that bench, lad. Soon your chest will be thrust out with pride. :-)
Meanwhile, as it's summer down in the antipodes, please post a pic of yoursen in shorts (also one o' them hats with corks) if you would, in the "Its cold" thread, as there needs to be a counterbalance to all that snow-talk over there. Make sure you keep yer hand on your happeny, as we must not over-stimulate the Knots ladees with glimpses of a dark short-leg interior and its Rood Inhabitant.
Lataxe, whose own bench is awash with stuff just now.
Well there is no shortage of sunshine and white legs posing in shorts here either. Nice little 40 mile ride this mornin, a sunny 58 to start and it's a purfic 70 outside. Would stop to chat, but my bench is callin, the door is open and the beams are a radiating!
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Morgan,
You may notice a green aether oozing from your PC as you read this. It is the aether of envy. It's pishing it doon here nd blowing a gale. I managed a ten mile walk up and down the canal (to Lancaster & back) yesterday but no bike this week.
Still, it makes for more shed-time.
Lataxe, waiting for Spring to sprong
And I, Morgan and Lataxe, was confined to the indoor trainer (one hour maximum, otherwise my brain turns to mush). And will be for a while. There's so much snow around here it likely won't melt until June. Good thing we have cross country skiing to keep us busy and fit..
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Z,
I've done some time on the rollers in the past. Thank gawd that stage of life is over. I found it tended to turn my brain to, well, if not mush a thing merely in idle-gear. Also I rotted the bearings with sweat-drip.
These days there is always the posh gym, which does a good price/annum for auld-gimmers like moi. It has much equipment, a large swimming pool and so forth. Also, idle young ladies go there during the day when the likes of me are grunting and sweating about the place in full "Looka, I'm still just a boy really!" mode. Of course, I am too busy working my body hard to notice them ladees and their lycra. (No I'm not).
Lataxe, still sweaty after all these years
Ewwww, the dreaded trainer..... Gawd I'm as happy as Lataxe that that is not in my life anymore. Better to go to Spin class at the Gym! On the other hand, the cross country skiing sounds like a great workout and it is outside!! No shweaty, cold virus spewing bodies around. I really like that!
Have a night ride planned tonight on the Mt Bike, some fun rock rippin and beer tippin fun!
Morgan <!----><!----><!---->
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Morgan,
You're fortunate to live in a place where you can bike during the winter. I can go from about February through November in most years, but you just can't ride safely on ice or snow-packed roads. So the indoor trainer is the port of last resort.
It's not a bad thing, however to get out on skis and off the bike during the offseason. I can pack on some upper body muscle that melts away on the bike during the summer. Plus, as one of my biking buddies says, "I'm building up my 'core strength' - pointing to his growing belly." That's the attitude.
Actually, I'm training for a couple of cross country ski races in Northern Michigan next month. The guys who live up near where the races are held have all the advantage though; they can train on snow sooner in the year than we get it down here, and they can practice on hills like we don't have in the flatlands. So, no podium finishes are in the offing. Still fun to go and compete as hard as possible though. How many people get the opportunity to do that, to push themselves to their absolute limit, in their late 50's?
But there are times - and this last ten days or so with bitterly cold temps is a good example - that it's even too cold to ski very well or very long. And then I descend to the basement and the rusty old trainer. It must be penance for something I've done or committed at one point in my life. Riding that thing does make the prospect of the first spring ride all the sweeter though..
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Robin,
"Suffice to say,I want to build me proper one."......I think that if you are using solid legs of 100milligrubbers square mit zubstantial rails top and bottom then you are indeed starting off on, er, the right leg. I have seen a lot of these mighty thick laminated tops fit for duty as mine shaft/pit props that are mounted on spindly legs that will flex.
I am indeed exiled in Niew Zilland, as they say.Not in a wine region as such but not too far from one of the main regions in the top island.Philip Marcou
Hey Mike,
Yeah, it works for me. This whole thing about first workbenches to me is kinda like the which came first chicken/egg thang.
I saw myself in the same boat as the OP and couldn't decide what to do. To make a bench ye needs a bench ta build a bench!
Bought a flat solid core door for $25 - salvaged from a school, sawed off the side with the hole for the knob/handle and mounted it on my pre-existing tank and lag bolted it to the wall.
In retrospect I wish I hadn't sliced off the hole part of the door. I keep drills, sanders and other tools that I use frequently right handy to the bench. The hole would have provided a nice way to keep the cords under control. Mebbe that's one reason I've bought a lot of cordless ones.
To me when first getting started ye don't really know what ye want and for $25 and a littl bit of work, I'm up and running pronto.
Regards, Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob,
I'm with you on going, well, "inexpensive" for a bench. I bought a damaged 1 3/4 inch damaged solid core exterior door from a door supplier in our area. Maybe paid 15 bucks for it (beating your price by a handy sawbuck).
But then I splurged and screwed a piece of 1/2 inch Baltic birch to it from the underside. Now I've got a flat, smooth, very solid bench top - and the top surface is replaceable if it ever gets damaged. So far though it's been about 5-6 years and the birch is holding up perfectly well. I'm not even thinking about replacing it.
For the base I just made a big cabinet base type structure out of 3/4 inch birch plywood. Two drawers for planes and stuff, and open shelves below that for small power tools like routers, sanders, nailguns. I'll bet I don't have a hundred bucks in the entire thing. Well, except the Record vise..
I've got my bench fastened to a wall under a double window, so there's light, and the solid wall means it can't rack. No, I can't walk around it. But I never have wanted to. Frankly, I don't spend a lot of time worrying about stuff like this.
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Build your own
My first bench was from an old Stanley book "How To Work With Tools And Wood". The top was a couple of edge glued 2X6's and 2X8's on a frame of 2X4's and 2X6's. I used that for years while thinking about what I wanted in my new bench. The new one is still a work in progress :-( and the old one is in the corner with my miter saw on it.
My large bench is laminated 4/4 hard maple with trestle base of the same construction. I like the trestle for leg room and looks, though the four leg design would be good for adding storage. Both the face and tail vice are two heavy duty german made screws from Woodcraft, independently mounted with thick jaws. If I was going to make my first bench all over again I would use the same hardware but think about everything else out of KD 2x4s, maybe 2x6 for the front apron. The maple is great to have, but considering the time and money it took . . . won't pay for itself any time soon. I think now the main thing is to overbuild and make it sturdy. Mine is both sturdy and beautiful, but sturdy would have been beautiful all on its own.
Brian
I had the same dilemma several years ago, and the same experience as another poster with the timing of an early LN bench, so I enrolled in the master workbench class at William Ng's Finewoodworking School in Anaheim, Calif . . . made my own and am quite happy with it. Some things i might change/tweak when i make another, but overall pleased as a pig in whatever. Face vise, veritas twin screw tail vise, hard rock maple milled from rough, square dogholes with handmade walnut dogs, heavy as all getout and sturdy as can be. Took a week, class size was about 8, loved every minute of it.
Patrick,
As a matter of interest, what did the course cost and what was the end cost of the bench?
Philip Marcou
Philip, the end cost can be calculated several ways; on the one hand, i am happy with it whatever the cost, but on the other hand, i will be the first to admit that it would have been cheaper to get the LN than to take an entire week off of work. That said, every time i look at it or fondle it i get a smile on my face . . . . but the first couple of scratches were painful!
The class was $800-875 or so. The face vice screw hardware was ??, the Veritas twin screw a couple of hundred (?), the hotel (without a woman) was probably $700-800, the wood cost was . . . ? i don't really remember, but was 8/4 hard maple for the base, stretchers, vise jaws, skirt, doghole strips, but we used a prelaminated hard maple top for the field.
http://www.wnwoodworks.com/classes.php?class_id=205
Some thoughts from a few years back:
http://forums.taunton.com/fw-knots/messages?msg=7518.1
Build it. But do it cheap and quick. A bench doesn't have to be fancy to get work done, and honestly as you improve in skill you'll know what you want in a bench. So when you're ready to upgrade you wont need to ask us this question!
I said the same thing back around the fourth post or so.Phil
I said the same thing back around the fourth post or so.
Oh... well I thought it first... :)
My next bench will be some take-off on John White's "New-Fangled Workbench" explained right here on FWW. Not sure the adaptability and versatility can be beat especially at this cost. And with a bit of care I'm sure the rich charm of a classic bench can be approached.
http://blog.woodworking-magazine.com/blog/PermaLink,guid,02ff6c5f-12fa-457c-a81f-e161839efec2.aspx
Worth taking a look at the Nicholson bench -- really a very nice first (or last) bench for hand work. And cheap and easy to build.
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