I’m interested in purchasing the Clearvue cyclone (5hp motor @ 20A full load) for my attached garage workshop, however I’m not sure if I have the capacity needed. I currently only have one 30A 230V circuit running to the shop for a 3hp Jet Xacta saw, so can I also run the cyclone on this circuit? I’m not sure what Amps I’m pulling with the Xacta saw so need help here.
The bad news is that I don’t have any more room on my 30 year old Zinser panel to fit another 230 V circuit.
Thanks for the advice,
Brian
Replies
The saw motor should have an amperage rating on the plate. I am only guessing it would say about 12 to 15A. You will likely be able to run both machines for a while, until you stall the saw or run it continuously for a while. Looks like you are at least exceeding a safe margin.
If the panel was more modern, I would say that you can get half size breakers as you can for double-D and others. Adding this much capacity may exceed the safe margin for your service though. Don't know what else you have (electric furnace, hot tub?) Since there are too many variables and you need to ask this kind of question, I would strongly suggest getting someone knowledgeable to *look at your service*. You don't have enough info for any other recommendation. I think this is the answer you would get on a Fine ElectricianWorking forum, were there one.
Andy
You've brought up a number of issues with this post.
It's not a good idea to put a 5HP 21A motor on the same 30A circuit with a 3HP saw which is probably rated at 15A.
Your Zinsco (Zinsser is a brand of shellac and primers) electrical panel is known to be unreliable and in some cases prone to causing fires. I have actually seen arcing between breakers and bus bars inside Zinsco sub panels in a 1960's era apartment building. See this site for more information: http://www.inspect-ny.com/electric/Zinscoreplace.htm
Why, in the first place, would you want to build a ClearVue cyclone from a kit that takes many hours of your time making some components, buying and modifying some, and assembling others, looks homemade yet costs more than Grizzly or Penn State 2HP machines and just a little less than Oneida, performs no better than the Grizzly, Oneida or Penn State 2HP machines yet runs a 5HP, 21A motor requiring a bigger circuit? (e-mail me and I'll send you my spreadsheet comparison of Clearvue, 2HP Oneida Gorilla, 2HP Grizzly and 2.5HP Penn State.)
Good luck
Like Bruce, I too question the need for a 5 hp dust collection system for a garage workshop. My workshop is 1800 sqft, and the machining area where dust collection is used is 700 sqft, yet a 2 hp dust collector serves all of the machines. You don't run all of your machines at the same time, so why would you need such a large system?If you dropped down to a more reasonable sized system for your shop space, you could run the DC from the same 30 amp circuit as the tablesaw.
I would reiterate BruceT's warning. There was visible evidence of arcing on my Zinsco panel. One of the 240V breakers (for the stove) went bad--only 80V across it, and others made disconcerting crackly noises. Most breakers were loose.
I would seriously consider upgrading the panel before upgrading the dust collection system.
About as good as the old Murry panels ? ;-)Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
Can we see a .pdf of your spreadsheet? After reading the research published by Bill Pentz I opted for the Clearvue (do not have it yet). I too am only a hobbiest working in a small one man shop. If I could have afforded it, I would have went with the Felder RL125, but that would have doubled my cost. I came to the conclusion that Mr. Pentz has done the research and is a genuine and caring persons that honestly cares about other woodworkers health. While I agree with your reasoning regarding price, build time, and the end appearance, I am tired of the "Knock off" Industry and companies stealing intellectual property of others. I know that Mr. Pentz gets a small cut, and am glad he does. I know Onedia is built in the US, and that was the only other Cyclone I considered, but after reading the information I opted to pay a higher price for what I think is a better system and support a small growing company at the same time.
If we do not support North American Manuf (actually built in North America) we will all be standing around in twenty years wondering what to do. I know of a Apple grower that trained some Chinese people how to grow Apple trees, and low and behold ten years after, they went out of business because the Chinese could offer a better price.
Just one persons view.
I'll post pdf if I can figure out how to get Acrobat to not split a one-page spreadsheet into 4 pages.You said, "I am tired of the "Knock off" Industry and companies stealing intellectual property of others."Bill Pentz himself says that he did not invent anything, he just applied features in use in larger machines to his design. You said that you considered Oneida, but were willing to pay more for Clearvue. I found Oneida 2HP Gorilla price to be a couple hundred higher than CV 1800
BruceT
Yes, that is true, but he took the time and effort to figure out the mechanics of the cyclone, identified the fundamental problem facing the hobbiest along with its impact(indoor filtration), went to the expense of independent tests and at the end of the day he published it for all to find. Today, Cyclones are feasible for hobbiest's to own. Now I was not involved in this hobby when he first started researching, so I could be off on some of the history, but I have not found any of the other manufacturers publishing this extent of information. I can honestly say that I wouldn't have been as concerned about the dust in the air in my shop now unless I had bumped into this information. As many others, I was on the exact path Bill describes. You know, start with shop vac, oops not big enough, hey lets try this fancy lid on a trash can, darn, thats no good either, next 1hp or other portable then maybe onto something else reading solely what is published in the mags. We all start somewhere and expand upon it, its how you go about the improvement that I value. The knock offs I am referring to are the types that blatently copy someone elses design, you know, buy one and take it apart and figure out how to build a near exact replica. Their only goal is to sell product.
The 2hp Onedia worked out to $966 (I wanted the Baldor motor) and that includes the filter. The CV1800 was $1160 ($1245 including $85 shipping allowance) and each filter cost $70 from Wynn. The shipping is also more when shipped from two locations. I just about fell out of my chair when I got the UPS bill for the filters.
Brad
"...but he took the time and effort to figure out the mechanics of the cyclone, identified the fundamental problem facing the hobbiest along with its impact(indoor filtration), went to the expense of independent tests and at the end of the day he published it for all to find."I see your point. BruceT
Oops, Brad, I checked out pricing again and found I had put only one filter in my spreadsheet instead of the two that Clearvue specifies and freight is much higher than when I previously checked. Clearvue is now about $100 higher than Oneida 2HP Gorilla.BruceT
Hi,
I'm not an expert but like others I studied Bill Pentz info then went out and found the best buy that fit into what I read. I even checked with BP before the final purchase. He made some recommendations(duct size etc) that I followed and now I am quite satisfied with my purchase.
If you have done your homework, which in my opinion should include the comparisons offered by another in this discussion, and are satisfied with your purchase or potential purchase and a 5 hp dust collector is what fits, then so be it. First though, I would have a qualified electrician come in and show him what you plan. Then I would get him to complete the necessary connections for the dust collector and also have him set your panel up for the future. You are getting to the point where this may be necessary as it sounds like you like the heavy duty stuff.
Pi____ng around with electrical connections can endanger you and your family.
As your garage is attached, you sure don't want your dust collector operating(collecting dust) at less than peak performance, so your ducts and connections have to be properly installed.
Ed
You do have enough power in you 30A 240V cct to your garage. however the bad news is the two motors have such a large difference intheir rating it would not be wise to put them both on the same cct. If you were to stall the you could damage the motor. This is called the stalled rotor current and is higher than the Full Load Current(FLA) the best solutionis to call an electrician to come look at how difficult it would be to upgrade your panel.
A simple cheap solution may be to put in a small sub panel and feed the two ccts off of that sub-panel. If you know any electricians ask one to come take a look. this is probably the cheapest, safest and most workable solution
How do you figure that a 21A 5HP motor and a 15A 3HP running simultaneously on the same 30A circuit is ok?
BruceT
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