Delta 14″ BS vvviiibbrrraattiioonnnn
woodman2263
| Posted in Power Tools and Machinery on
Morning all,
I have neglected my 14″ delta bandsaw because I purchased an 18″ and use it mostly. I want to turn my attention back to the 14″ and use it more because I actually like it. My problem is, it vibrates extremely bad. Its a open stand model that is not bolted to the floor. I have replaced the blocks and added bearings. I have also set the tracking and tension properly and tried different blades. I still can’t get it to “calm down”. Is there any advice out there on what I can do or am I just use to using an 18″?
Jeff
Replies
Just a guess but assuming the tires are ok it may be a problem with one or both of the wheels- out of balance or out of round.
How does one check all that and if there is a problem, how to rectify it?
Lots of good suggestions in previous posts. You might find one or all of these books helpful; The Bandsaw Book by Lonnie Bird, Care and Repair of Shop Machines by John White, and Mark Duginski's Bandsaw Handbook.
Jeff,
A few things that come to mind to check:
Build-up of gunk on the tires
-Clean off the gunk and install a brush on the lower wheel
-hook up some type of dust collection
Out of balance wheels
-With the blade and belt off, give the wheels a slight spin and note where they stop. Repeat several times to verify and start adding a bit of weight to the opposite side of the wheel until no longer stops at the same spot, then epoxy the weight in place. (I've worked on a bandsaw that required a "27 cent" solution)
Bad belt or out of round pulley(s)
-Replace the offending part. I've heard good things about the link belts, only bad part is they're pricey.
Also, is there(or can you add) a shelf that you can add some weight to the base, i.e. cinder blocks or...
Have I overlooked anything???
Good luck,
-Kevin
All the other suggestions are good but if you've used this saw and blade before, and you were happy with it, then I would suspect the belts, tires or the blade taking a set because it's been under tension.1. Take the blade off and power up the saw. If you still have vibration you've now eliminated the blade, guide bearings and upper wheel. I would replace the v-belt with powertwist (link) belt(s) in any case.2. If the blade was under tension during your long infatuation with your 18" BS, I would suspect that the tires have been flat-spotted or the blade has set. Replace both. Regards,Ron
Edited 3/23/2007 9:50 pm ET by RonInOttawa
Does the blade have a bad weld?
Also, call these guy’s, they are the undisputed experts on Delta 14” bandsaws:
Iturra Design
4636 Fulton RD
Jacksonville, FL 32225-1332
1.888.722.7078 voice
1.904.642.2802 fax
My Delta 14” is a new machine after I tuned it up with their parts.
Start by isolating the problem. Take off the blade and run the saw. If it vibrates, you've narrowed the problem to the drive train. Look at the belt: if it has hardened into a bad shape, a new belt (perhaps a link belt) could help.
Grab the saw by the frame or table and push it in every direction. It should be rock solid. If something is loose or a foot needs to be shimmed, fix it. That's the simplest thing that might make a big difference.
Edited 3/23/2007 11:16 am by AlanWS
Check the balance on your wheels. Delta's website FAQ's has an excellent one on doing so.
btw, seems to be the "undisputed experts" on Delta's 14" bandsaws would be...DELTA. 1-800-223-7278.
Maybe, but all I can say is that after I made the modifications and installed the upgrades from Iturra, my saw is twice the machine it was from the factory. Just my humble experience, but Delta themselves were not that impressive.
Before you do any of that other stuff, check the bolts that hold the saw to the stand. I've had one get a little loose, and man will that make things go crazy.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
forestgirl,
Do you think a new custom made lignum mallet made by you for me would help the vibration? :)
Jeff
Trust me, Jeff, you don't want forestgirl turning a mallet for you! I've run a lathe exactly once in my woodworking life! That's why I've gotta rope someone else into turning one for me. I'm plotting, I'm plotting.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Hi Jeff. I have a very old Delta 14" that was extremely neglected. I used some resources right here at Fine Wood Working. John White's tune up procedure and Robert Vaughan's tire installation was a wealth of information for me.
My saw is an open frame mountend on a mobil base. While the saw doesn't sound like it was vibrating as much as yours, it was vibrating. Remounting the motor closer to the lower wheel shortened the belt length. Carefully aligning the drive and idler pulleys, and installing a link belt were very effective. Cleaning and aligning the wheels, new tires, and inspecting the bearings, helped even more. Along with the rest of the adjustments and a new tension spring my old saw is now a joy to use.
Vic
Given that you didn't notice a serious problem before, I'll second the poster who said check the belt. It's almost certainly dried out or taken a set. It's amazing how much vibration a bad belt will cause. Get a good-quality machine belt from a supplier like McMaster rather than taking a chance on lumpy cheapo belts from the hardware store.
Pete
Jeff and all others, if ya need the link belt hartvilletool.com has item #33626 four feet for $20.98. The best price in two or three years.
Also on sale is the Starrett combo square sets, one cast(#53031) with the wrinkle finish and non-reversable protractor, which is really more than good enough, for $134 and the real deal forged, smooth finished, hardened and reversable for $169 (69228). All good till may 31 but some supplies are limited. Enjoy, Paddy
Morning All,
I replaced my old belt with the link belt. Boy does the belt run smooth. But I still have the bad vibration problem. I ran the saw with no blade like many have told me. It ran pretty smooth. I put the blade back on a the blade oscillated back and forth somthing fierce. Also vibrated really bad. Should I try to align the wheels? Should I buy those high dollar new tires? You guys tell me what to do next and I will try it today.
Thanks,
Jeff
Have you felt for a 'flat spot' on the tires? I gather the saw was out of use for some time.Frosty
Same deal, gotta figure out what changed or went bad since the last time you used the machine. Is this a band you've used before or is it possible that it's bent or welded wrong? Feel the tires (with the band and motor off of course) and see if they're grooved or cracked. Grab each wheel and see if there's any play in it. Spin the wheel and eyeball it for wobble. Make sure the tracking mechanism is properly assembled. If it's one of the ones with a spring in the tracking mechanism, is the spring still there and making good contact?Running the machine with the belt on and the band off may help to isolate a wheel problem.[EDIT] Looked at one while I was in my woodworking store today. The track mechanism uses a wingnut rather than a spring to hold the track setting. If this got loose, I would expect the top wheel to vibrate all over the place. As above, you want to go over all the likely suspects to isolate the cause.Pete
Edited 3/25/2007 2:00 pm ET by PeteBradley
W, we have to make assumptions here .
1- ya didn't fuss with the upper wheel settings yet. other than tension and tracking.
2- It was under tension when not in use.
3- it's a new or proven good blade with no obvious faults.
4- the last time you used it it was fine.
If all above is true then I would shop for a good price on new neopreme (sp) tires (Woodcraft has them on sale in the stores frequently or use the internet sellers) . Then try again to bench mark the saw. Get "The Bandsaw" book from Taunton and do a standard set up A to Z . If this fails replace the tension spring with a Carter (you could do that now as It wouldn't hurt) and only then would I start fussing with the mechanical setup of the upper wheel . The upper wheel has more adjustment possibilities than a Federal tax form. Good luck. Paddy
FWIW, I’m telling you, call Iturra, see my post #5. Their catalog is like a repair manual for the Delta 14” bandsaw. I fixed all the tracking problems my saw had with their help. Including installing the heavy duty tracking arm bracket and tension spring they make. And the wheel alignment kit they offer makes the job very simple. And he has great prices on Link-Belt, and they are great people to deal with.
Spare us. Besides, he'll have the problem fixed long before Louis gets around to sending out a catalog.Pete
Edited 3/25/2007 8:51 pm ET by PeteBradley
Aside from your obviously sunny disposition, I take it you did not have a positive experience with Louis? I can only speak from my personal dealings with him and I had no problems.
My apologies for the less than sunny response. Iturra knows a lot about band saws, but the importance of his catalog is massively overrated on Knots. A 14" Jet leaves the factory with the potential to do great things. Whether that potential is achieved depends much more on experience and adjustment than on what aftermarket whistles and bells are added.There was another post yesterday in which someone posted a laundry list of stuff that they'd bought from Iturra but said they couldn't consistently resaw past 6". On the same day, a guy on OWWM posted that he was consistently resawing 12" on his stock Delta with a 1/2HP motor. Pete
I would agree that being able to set up ones machinery is far more important than any add-ons. I have rebuilt all the Delta machinery in my shop, (Unisaw, bandsaw, 13” planer, drill press, shaper), plus quite a few jointers, bandsaws, shapers for friends of mine and I found Iturras parts to be of high quality and made the job go faster. If I’m putting the time into the rebuild, I’ll upgrade what I can. My bandsaw resaws 12” with no problem, the best modification there is the two horsepower motor and the Carter guides.
I can't recall if you reported that you replaced the blade on this machine. And in a recent post you said the blade "oscilliated" back and forth quite a bit. One of the things this could suggest is that the blade itself is defective. If it was welded up out of alignment, each time the weld passed the blade guides the blade would move violently in and out of its normal tracking range (backwards or forwards), and that could cause vibration.
So, it would be worth throwing another blade on the machine (preferably a high-end one) to eliminate that from one of the (many) vibration-producing possibilities.
Zolton
Zolton,
Would you think it would be the blade (timberwolf, 961/4 x 1/2") or do you think it was the tires. The bandsaw (Delta 14") is 6 years old. I have never replaced the tires. What do you think?
Thanks,
Jeff
Jeff,
That's a good blade and not likely one that would be welded up wrong. However, things do happen, and it wouldn't be impossible for the blade to be at fault.
Have you tried another blade on the saw? That's the easiest way to eliminate the blade being the source of the problem.
But the tires could also be out of round, or the wheels out of balance - or the entire slew of other things that have been suggested here...
Zolton
Zolton,
One last question. Should the wheels be in perfect alignment? If I put a yard stick on the wheels, should they touch perfectly? If they do not, should I try to make them that way?
Jeff
They should be co-planer. The answer to your question is YES! But a yardstick is hardly the tool of choice to check it. If you have a 4' level that would be better, or any known straight metal straightedge.
To determine the problem, as there are many potential causes, I would suggest one step at a time. It's been my experience that manufacturers assume that their machines work perfect out of the box. NOT SO!
As Zolton has suggested, have you tried a different blade?
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 3/26/2007 9:36 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Jeff,
"Perfect" alignment of the bandsaw's wheels is a worthy goal. However, I'm unsure as to whether that would contribute more than something else to the vibration problem you've been experiencing...
Again, I'd try another blade first to see if that helps to clear it up. If it doesn't, then you can move on to the structural issues. Obviously, those things are important anyway. But if a different blade makes the vibe go away, well, then you can start sawing some wood..
Zolton
Amen to that brother.
John White, Shop Manager, Fine Woodworking Magazine
Jeff,
I have neglected my 14" delta bandsaw because I purchased an 18" and use it mostly. I want to turn my attention back to the 14" and use it more because I actually like it. My problem is, it vibrates extremely bad.
Did it vibrate B4? If so, what changed?
I have a brand new Delta 28-206 on a mobile base and it vibrated a lot. I took it off the mobile base, bolted it to the floor and the vibration nearly went away, bearable. Made some 3/4" plywood skins, applied to the inside of the stand, GONE!
Remounted to the mobile, No vibration. Problem solved.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Woodman,
Did you check your wheel bearings, both upper and lower, for play? Should be zero movement . Also, try isolating the motor with thick rubber washers placed between the stand and the motor base. Motor bearings o k ?
Paul
If you are going to take the time to check and/or adjust your wheels for co-planer, make sure they are under tension ( saw unplugged, of course) when checking.
Paul
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