Replies

1. 
   SteveSchoene | Jan 18, 2008 11:28pm | #1

   The answer depends on whether you have spray equipment available. 

1. 
   70445 | Jan 30, 2008 09:02pm | #10

   I do have a HVLP.. sure wouldlike to duplicate their colr  dark brown, more like a coffee color..any help would be appreciated

1. 
   SteveSchoene | Jan 30, 2008 10:24pm | #11

   I would basically start with a dye to get into the basic color range--a little lighter than your intended final finish.  Then I would use a finish material tinted with TransTint dye to build the finish to the desired darkness.  That might look a bit too much better than the pottery barn finish, so you perhaps should consider an application of a pigmented wiping stain after sealing the dye inorder to obscure the grain on the wood a bit more before applying more toner.   

1. 
   70445 | Jan 31, 2008 05:05am | #12

   Thanks good info!

2. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 19, 2008 12:13am | #2

   I have had some great success matching colors with transtint dye.  Like Steve says, though, you are going to need decent spray equipment to get the results you are looking for.  It's soooooooo much easier to control the depth of color when spraying.

   Jeff

1. 
   Quickstep | Jan 19, 2008 12:18am | #3

   Jeff, your comment "It's soooooooo much easier to control the depth of color when spraying." made me curious. Why is it easier? I don't do much staining/dyeing, but I have just gotten into spraying and eager to learn all I can.

1. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 19, 2008 12:31am | #4

   When spraying, I can control how much material goes on the wood by spraying light coats.  I continue to add coats until I've got the right depth, or darkness desired to match another piece.  Once you've gotten the right tone, it's a matter of getting the right amount of dye on the wood to achieve a certain level of color.

   I'm not talented enough, and I never want to spend the time to try and get it right with a sponge or brush.  I have difficulty getting just the right amount of color on the wood.

   I just finished a table where I was matching the color of the chairs.  I didn't make the chairs.  I mixed the right tone of color with transtint dye, and continued to add layers of color until I achieved the proper level of darkness on the table to match the chairs.  I don't think I would have ever been able to sneak up on it like that with a brush.

   Just my .02.  Other, more talented finishers may tell you otherwise.  That's what works for me.

   Jeff

    

1. 
   SteveSchoene | Jan 19, 2008 04:14am | #5

   Jeff's right on.  Using a tinted finish (toner) is only really practical with a sprayed finish since it's too hard to get a hand applied finish on evenly.  For the extreme example of the bad effects of using a tinted finish made to be applied by hand, look at Polyshades, the abominable product from Minwax.  With spray equipment, you would apply a dye to establish a dark brown base over a white wood such as maple or birch.  Then layers of toner can both increase the darkness and adjust the color balance with even applications.  The problem is going too far and ending up like Bombay furniture. 

   By hand, you would have to dye, then seal, and get a bit of depth with a gel stain.  Even with a light sealing over the dye, and using a gel stain, there would still be a bit of "blotch" that you might not like.  If you want a really even finish then you would spray toner to get the depth and extra darkness.  If you wanted some more "character" you would still use a bit of the gel stain or other wiping stain, but damp the effect of any "blotching" by using toner over it. 

1. 
   jeffreysherow | Jan 19, 2008 06:09pm | #6

   I have a similar project coming up and would like to use toner to match some existing furniture color, what is the recipe for toner please? Is it basically a thinned finish (e.g., 1lb cut of shellac?)

2. 
   SteveSchoene | Jan 19, 2008 06:42pm | #7

   Toner is generally a thin finish but with either dye or pigment added to provide color.  Certain dyes, such as TransTint, work in a number of finishes.  Universal tinting colors can also be added to most finishes.   The finish is thin so that a number of coats each only lightly tinted can be used to "sneak up on" the desired darkness.  This also means that the finish should be sprayed.  Otherwise every overlap or missed spot will show up as a streak.  That's the problem with Polyshades.  It dries too quickly to even it out by brushing, but too slowly to spray effectively without having a sticky mess from the overspray.   

3. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 19, 2008 08:44pm | #8

   Steve

   I couldn't agree with you more about controlling depth of color by spraying.  For the life of me, I cannot hand apply a dye stain, with water or alcohol, and get it to look even close to what I would deliver to a customer.  It always looks blotchy, and I can't control how much color I get.

   Just recently, and I posted it in the Gallery, I built a white maple table.  It was a gift to my mom and dad.  I built her kitchen a few years back, and it is entirely honey maple.  She wanted the table, rightly so, to have a contrasting deeper, darker color.  The chairs she bought ended my being a great color, and transtint medium brown was the dye I used to match the color.  By hand, I couldn't get the color right on test boards.  But, I knew I would be fine with the spray gun.  I brought a chair home to my shop, and literally just snuck up on the color by adding light layers of color until I had it just right.  There's no way that I could have achieved that with a brush, not to mention trying to get the color even with all the figure in the maple.

   For me, spraying dye makes it idiot proof, which is exactly what I need it to be  :>)!

   Jeff

4. 
   SteveSchoene | Jan 19, 2008 09:05pm | #9

   Spraying dye does give the most even application.  Alcohol dye should ONLY be sprayed.  Water based aniline can be hand applied reasonably well.  The secret for less, though not always zero, blotching is to apply it very liberally.  A sponge, starting from the bottom up is the best tool to apply it.  Then wipe off any excess with the same sponge.  This method allows the concentration of the dye to determine the darkness, not how much you apply.