Replies

1. 
   BArnold | Sep 15, 2004 06:26pm | #1

   Paul,

   This is one of my favorite subjects -- tanning cherry.  Here in Florida, we have the luxury (well, except when one of the storms comes around) of working outside.  My usual finish process with cherry is to take the parts (in some cases completed assemblies) onto my driveway.  There, I apply a BLO, mineral spirits and poly blend.  The sun warms the mixture as I rub it into the wood and also begins the tanning process.  In one days time down here, the cherry is noticeably darker.  I usually repeat the process the following day for a second coat.  After that, I continue finishing the item(s) inside -- I learned my lesson about poly bubbling in the direct sunlight after it begins to build on the surface.  Turn the item(s) every hour or two to ensure even tanning.

   Good luck!

   Bill Arnold - Custom Woodcrafting

   Food for Thought: The Ark was built by amateurs; the Titanic by professionals.

1. 
   Pondfish | Sep 15, 2004 07:13pm | #2

   Thanks Bill!  Maybe I'll do the same, although I prefer Danish oil over BLO or BLO based blends.  I was hesitant to place oiled finishes in the sun, but I would expect the heat will help the wood absorb the oil and help the oil cure.  

   Cheers

   Paul

1. 
   BArnold | Sep 15, 2004 07:34pm | #3

   Paul,

   What 'Danish Oil' product do you use?  Most of the Danish oil products I'm familiar with are linseed oil (either BLO or polymerized) and MS blends.  Other products say the oil they contain is tung oil, while a few labels use the words 'contains tung oil' and, in fact, are maybe 10% tung, 40% BLO and 50% MS (or some such percentages.

   Also, I've read a lot of posts on here about warming the rubbing oil prior to application, although I haven't used that process yet.  In my case, letting the sun warm the oil and tan the wood seems efficient, if nothing else -- being lazy makes me think of things like that. :-)

   Regards,

   Bill Arnold - Custom Woodcrafting

   Food for Thought: The Ark was built by amateurs; the Titanic by professionals.

   Edited 9/15/2004 12:37 pm ET by BArnold

1. 
   Pondfish | Sep 15, 2004 09:36pm | #4

   Good point.  I use Watco Danish oil, which I previously compared to plain BLO (and ended up prefering the Watco).  Watco natural Danish oil is 60% mineral spirits plus raw linseed oil, drier, some unspecified resin, and other things Watco won't reveal on the MSDS.  Sounds like it's time for me to do a little chemistry experiment, comparing Watco and a BLO based oil/varnish mixture.  Could turn out cheaper than Watco, and easier to find in large quantities.

   Paul

1. 
   BArnold | Sep 16, 2004 11:45am | #8

   Now that I've been able, over the past couple of years, to spend the amount of time I want building furniture, I've taken the time to examine the content of some products.  For instance, I've purchased 'Minwax Antique Oil Finish' and it worked great.  Then I took time to check into the contents of the product: 1/3 BLO, 1/3 MS and 1/3 poly -- and it cost $7 per quart!  Well, I can make a quart of the same mixture a heck of a lot cheaper than that.

   On a lot of pieces, I'll use a 50/50 BLO/MS mix as a rubbing oil, then top it with poly after it cures.  I'm very comfortable building most any kind of furniture, but still have everything to learn about finishing.  I still use poly for top-coating simply because I've used it for so long and I can't seem to break the link.  For small items, I generally use lacquer because it dries so fast.  Maybe by the time I complete Jeff Jewett's book, 'Complete Illustrated Guide to Finishing', I'll have the guts to try some different processes.  <grin>Bill Arnold - Custom Woodcrafting

   Food for Thought: The Ark was built by amateurs; the Titanic by professionals.

2. 
   Pondfish | Sep 16, 2004 02:15pm | #9

   That's an excellent point, Bill--always check the ingredients.  No reason to pay extra money for the "convenience" of someone else mixing a few simple ingredients.

   I'm also with you on finishing.  I feel comfortable with furniture design and construction, but finishing can be a real bear.  There are so many things to learn that I suspect it is going to take me another 20 years to master finishing!  Right now I am working on a sofa table with paduak legs and skirt.  Did you know that if you seal the paduak with shellac, the color can bleed out into the shellac?  If you are brushing the shellac on (which I am, as I have no HVLP setup), you get little streaks and puddles of paduak color that don't look very good.  Lighter shellac cuts make the problem worse.  I've never seen or read about this problem before, and I wonder how many more finishing surprises are in store for me down the line.

   I'll post pictures of the bookcase when it's finished.  I might be ready to take the cherry outside for tanning by the time the effects of Ivan wear off on the Jersey coast.

   Cheers,

   Paul

3. 
   jonsherryl | Sep 16, 2004 06:27pm | #10

   >>'There are so many things to learn that I suspect it is going to take me another 20 years to master finishing!"<<

   You're a pie-eyed optimist, Paul. :O)

   Edited 9/16/2004 11:32 am ET by Jon Arno

2. 
   HowardAcheson | Sep 16, 2004 02:53am | #5

   Boiled linseed oil, varnish and mineral spirits = Danish Oil

   Raw linseed oil plus driers = Boiled linseed oil.

   So, Watco is boiled linseed oil, varnish (resin) and mineral spirits.

   The starting point is equal amounts of each. For more durability but less tactile feel, add more varnish.

   You can add as much mineral oil as you want as it totally evaporate anyway. Therefore a 1/3 boiled linseed oil, 1/3 varnish and 1/3 mineral spirits will end up being 1/2 boiled linseed oil and 1/2 varnish when the mineral oil evaporates.

   Howie.........

   Edited 9/15/2004 7:58 pm ET by Howie

2. 
   jonsherryl | Sep 16, 2004 03:59am | #6

   Paul, Bill's and Howie's advice here pretty much parallels my tactics when working with cherry...But I'll throw in just a couple of thoughts:

   If you use poly in your Danish oil blend, Make sure the can doesn't mention that it is formulated with the "benefit" of UV blockers...Personally, I'd avoid poly in favor of a good old fashioned alkyd varnish.

   And secondly, you were asking about figured English sycamore. Actually, the Brits refer to one of their maples as "sycamore"...so, the wood you have is basically like our western bigleaf maple...meaning it has a figure like our hard maple, but is slightly softer. It's a nice cabinetwood with excellent shaping and turning characteristics...but be careful using it in any application where stability is critical. Like most of the maples, it experiences a lot of shrinkage...and distortion (cupping and twisting) can be a problem...especially if the wood has a fiddle-back or quilted figure where the grain meanders.   

1. 
   Pondfish | Sep 16, 2004 04:57am | #7

   Thanks Jon and Howie -- it's been a while since I made an oil/varnish mix, but I recall it was easy and gave good results.  And now I know another definition of "boiled"--adding driers.  I guess the driers are better than heat treatment for getting LO to cure at a reasonable rate.

   Jon, thanks for the clarification on English sycamore (Acer campestre; I should have noticed it was a maple).  I'm planning on using it as 5" floating 3/8 panels in a 3/4 frame, so I hope to avoid problems caused by movement.  At $12 bf, I was wondering if I should cut it thinner and use it as a veneer.   An example photo of this wood is attached for the curious.  For more information, see http://www.hearnehardwoods.com/inventory/englishsycamorefigured.html

   Also, thanks for the warning to watch out for UV blockers. 

   Paul

   
2. 
   ktureski | Sep 28, 2004 03:26pm | #11

   Apologies for a tangential and possibly simplistic question, but after quite a while searching these lists and reading many articles (including your recent piece in FWW) and Jeff Jewitt's finishing book, I landed on "a couple of coats of BLO followed by some dark shellac" as a method of finishing an heirloom cherry bookcase. Well, heirloom may be a bit premature; I'm rather nervous about the finish :-) While I was originally intrigued by the "instant aging" technique using lye, this BLO & shellac method is one that is consistent with your preference for letting the cherry decide how to age.

   This thread has some nice explanations of the difference between formulations of various linseed oil products, but I am still unsure of whether "polymerized linseed oil" is effectively equivalent to BLO.

   According to my handy Lee Valley catalogue, Tried & True Danish oil "is a pure polymerized linseed oil with no additives".

   There's also T&T Original Wood Finish: "highly refined polymerized linseed oil with pure beeswax as an additive" and T&T Varnish Oil: "a combination of highly refined polymerized linseed oil and natural-resin varnish (modified pine sap)"

   Which of these (or "none-of-the-above") would be best for the BLO & shellac method?

3. 
   jako17 | Sep 28, 2004 05:16pm | #12

   Try a very ,very dilute lye solution in a spray bottle,neutralize with a vinigar wash.Test it first on scrap and be very careful not to get it on your skin etc.You might like to run it past Jeff Jewitt at homestead finishing as he is more knowledgable than I

1. 
   Biscardi | Sep 29, 2004 03:55am | #13

   I recently stumbled on a nice cherry finish. I finish sanded the piece and left it near the south facing shop window for about two weeks. Then I put a coat of BLO on it. I then put two coats of orange shellac on it and three coats of 11/2 lbs super blonde dewaxed on top of it. It was rubbed out with steel wool and a brownish wax. It has lots of depth and a little warmth without too much amber or gloss. It was pretty easy too.

   Frank