Replies

1. 
   popawheelie | Jan 03, 2009 05:32am | #1

   There are self centering bits that you can use. Vix bit is a big maker of them. Many of them come with a bit that isn't tapered but I've heard you take them out and replace with a tapered bit. Also, a pilot hole might not have to be tapered.

   When I drill holes for hinges I err on the side that will pull the hinge tighter.

   Also If you get two holes in the right place or a bit on the side that pulls the hinge tighter then put those screws in first. Then the others can go in and align in the holes without pulling the hinge over.

   There is a learning curve to it. Believe me, I fussed over this for a long time before I got better at it. It did help to get the vix bits. The problem is the grain moves your drill bit over from where you intended it to go.

   Even when I use the self centering drills I still push it to the tight side. There is always a little slop. 

   http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?FamilyID=2022

   http://www.mcfeelys.com/self-centering-bits

    

1. 
   ctsjr | Jan 03, 2009 08:03am | #4

   Thanks, popaWith your help and Mike D., tomorrow promises to be a better day. I'll get an awl or the vix bits and now armed with the knowledge of how to pull the hinge in tight to the mortise, I should be ok. I'm also a bit frustrated with my screwdrivers. All I have are Craftsman, but the slot heads are not my favorites. They have been fine for rough work, but trying to drive #4 brass screws requires a tip that fits better than what I have. Any recommendations? Thanks again. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"

2. 
   xmike | Jan 03, 2009 05:37am | #2

   OK, you should get a lot of help on this, but here's a start.

   1) Fill the screw holes with a round toothpick or a bamboo skewer plus glue and wait one day.
   2) use a Sharp chisel to bring your repair flush to the floor of the mortise.
   3) using a sharp awl, create a starter dimple just a tad off center, and closer to the side that will pull the hinge into the long wall of the mortise when you put the steel screw in - not much, just slightly off center towards that long wall.
   4) Using the starter dimple, and a fresh, sharp brad point drill, drill a starter hole, being sure not to slope the hole. Use a drill bit that is the size of the screw shaft (smaller than the threaded dimension)
   5) Then, use your steel screw to establish the threads in the hole.
   6) Then, with a little beeswax on your brass screws, insert brass screws - do not overtighten.
   Voila! Repaired screw holes with hinge drawn flat into mortise and tightly against the long side.

   It'll be interesting to see how others would do this.

   Best of luck!

   Mike D

3. 
   xmike | Jan 03, 2009 05:41am | #3

   If you go for the vix-bit solution, be sure that you aim the drill so that you are aiming slightly towards the back wall of the mortise - otherwise, the vix bit will start the actual hole off center towards the side where you ARE aiming.

   This is because the centering mechanism of the vix bit centers about mid-way through the hinge, leaving the point of the drill to move off center before it reaches the wood, if you lean the drill even a little. You WILL lean the drill, so might as well lean it in the direction that tightens the hinge into the mortise rather than not. But not much - a little goes a long way.

   Mike D

   Edited 1/2/2009 9:41 pm ET by Mike_D

   Edited 1/2/2009 9:42 pm ET by Mike_D

   
   

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   Edited 1/2/2009 9:48 pm ET by Mike_D

1. 
   ctsjr | Jan 03, 2009 08:04am | #5

   Thanks, Mike DI've filled the holes and trimmed them flush. I've got to get an awl--good excuse to travel to the local woodworker's supply store tomorrow. I appreciate the information--thanks to you and popawheelie, I should have a better day tomorrow. What are your recommendations for a wood screw driver? I've got Craftsmans, which are fine for rough work, but not too hot for #4 brass slotheads. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"

1. 
   davcefai | Jan 03, 2009 09:12am | #6

   I've always thought that those screws were "designed" by somebody who never had to use them. An electrical screwdriver seems to work fine on them.

2. 
   xmike | Jan 03, 2009 04:59pm | #8

   Hi Tom,I have the complete set of Craftsman screwdrivers as well. Got them for Christmas years ago.For stuff that I can't afford to have buggered up, I have a set of gunsmith's screwdrivers. These are quite a bit nicer - hollow ground so that the tip part that interfaces with the screw is straight and not tapered, and there are about 8 sizes so that you can pick one that nearly exactly matches the slot. On a more practical note, I've noticed that Woodcraft sells what they call a "Cabinet Makers" set of screwdrivers. These might be what you are looking for. You will find them here: http://www.woodcraft.com/product.aspx?ProductID=148105&FamilyID=20354Mike D

1. 
   RalphBarker | Jan 03, 2009 07:46pm | #9

   I have an old set similar to those sold by Woodcraft. While the fit is much better than general-purpose screwdrivers, the blades are still tapered. For fine work (and small screws), the hollow-ground, gunsmith-style drivers are better, I think.

3. 
   flairwoodworks | Jan 03, 2009 08:49pm | #10

   I think that the screwdrivers are more the problem than the screws. Most slot screwdrivers today have a tip which is tapered in thickness. This "wedge", in theory, fills the slot head snugly. However, as you apply rotational force, the wedge works against you, pushing the screwdriver out of the slot. The best slot screwdrivers have tips whose faces are ground parallel. Some recommend putting a burr on the end too.I bought a bunch of 1/8" dowels which are very handy. They are accurately milled and plug mis-drilled holes quickly. I use them often for pre-aligning glue ups.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)

    - Success is not the key to happines.  Happiness is the key to success.  If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer

1. 
   7Joel | Jan 04, 2009 04:10am | #15

   2nd the gunsmiths screwdrivers -- these really fit the slots as they have parallel faces and come in several thicknesses for a given width. Either get a handled set (from Brownells or a local gun dealer) or a Chapman set which is a handle and a lot of "bits" that fit into it -- mine cost about $30. Very different from the run of the mill screwdrivers.

1. 
   flairwoodworks | Jan 04, 2009 09:31pm | #17

   Joel,I belive you 100%, but still favour my Robbies.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)

    - Success is not the key to happines.  Happiness is the key to success.  If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer

4. 
   ring | Jan 03, 2009 09:20am | #7

   Using the Vix bit will help a lot. In addition, I usually set hinges using one screw only on each leaf. (A mortised butt hinge will sit very well using only one screw). After I'm sure its position is OK I drill and set the others. So if the first try is off a bit, you've still got "virgin" wood to set a different screw in a changed position.

   Finally, if you've already drilled the piece to death and it still isn't right: Use 5-minute epoxy to set the hinges in place with the doors in closed position. After it has set, drill and add the screws.

   David Ring

   http://www.touchwood.co.il/?id=1&lang=e

5. 
   sapwood | Jan 03, 2009 09:52pm | #11

   I have to disagree with others regarding the Vix bit. While the Vix is a good tool and is most helpful in many situations I find that it is simply not accurate enough for the purpose you describe. I prefer to center punch the hole using a sharp awl. Using only my eye, I can accurately mark and punch exactly where I want my pilot hole. If the wood grain is uncooperative (as it often is) the awl will tell me and I can compensate. Whereas the Vix will simply slide off to one side or another and I won't know this until the hole is drilled.

   Additionally, when drilling for small butt hinges, I use a small hand crank drill in lieu of my electric one. It takes more time and concentration to use it.... two critical components to getting the hinges to set just right.

   As to screwdrivers... I find that the loose bits, like the ones that fit into a magnetic holder, work the best. They come in a variety of shapes and sizes and they are hard steel. Use a hand powered bit driver with them. Don't use your 18volt dewalt! Alternatively, one of those small Milwaukee battery screwdrivers that works very well for subtle screw driving.

1. 
   ctsjr | Jan 04, 2009 12:16am | #12

   Thanks sapwood and everyone. Is your crank drill an 'eggbeater' or a small brace? Here's what I've done: I placed an order today with Lee Valley for a centering bit--it wasn't a Vix bit, but it was half the price of the Vix bit. I also ordered an awl--always needed one and now I shall have one! I also dug out my Craftsman multi bit screwdriver that has hollow ground slot head bits, and it works MUCH better than the tapered tips of the others. I'll keep my eyes open for a gunsmith set of screwdrivers. Again, thanks for the help. I'm confident now that the next attempt will be more successful. I'll post back when I'm done. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"Edited 1/3/2009 4:17 pm by ctsjr82

   Edited 1/3/2009 4:18 pm by ctsjr82

1. 
   sapwood | Jan 04, 2009 12:33am | #13

   I use an eggbeater style drill.

1. 
   ctsjr | Jan 04, 2009 12:39am | #14

   Thanks. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"

6. 
   WillGeorge | Jan 04, 2009 04:26am | #16

   Just me and you mileage may vary.

   Look for a set of transfer punches. Many different sizes and prices. Ever shop should have a set! Maybe a few sets! Crazy glue the hinge down and find the best fit punch.

   And then you HAVE TO drill your pilot hole at a 90 degree angle. I would say, NEVER EVER rush drilling holes for small hinges.

   Some suggested filling the old holes with toothpicks. I would suggest a 1/16 inch bit in a router and glue in a NEW strip of wood in the groove for a fresh start.

    http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/fow72-482-028.html

   
   

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   Edited 1/3/2009 8:29 pm by WillGeorge