Hello there,this is my first time here and I am very new to woodworking so please pardon me for not knowinga whole heck of a lot just yet.
What I’m trying to find out is how to bend small pieces of wood…such as perhaps a 4″x12″ piece of poplar or asp or whatever the basic Home Depot type brand is. I’m trying to start out fairly simple, building nice boxes (jewelry,keepsake,etc) and maybe even a bird house or two. But so far at least two of my designs require bending some wood.
Someone please help….I’ve been looking for answers for quite a while now and have only just found this site (very impressive by the way) a couple of days ago.
Thanks,………zen
Replies
Zen,
There are many ways to bend wood depending on your specific application. Here's a reference page of articles on different methods: http://www.woodweb.com/KnowledgeBase/KBBWGeneral.html
Here's another one: http://www.popularwoodworking.com/features/fea.asp?id=1068
I built a vacuum press for my bending applications. That's only one way to bend wood and is not always the best way depending on the specific application.
Regards,
Bill Arnold - Custom Woodcrafting
Mensa Member
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Food for Thought: The Ark was built by amateurs; the Titanic by professionals.
wow thanks! I never thought I'd get such a quick response.
I'll check out those sites/articles right away.
Many many thanks again!
zen
Welcome, Zen,
In addition to the links provided by Bill, you might want to check out Lon Schleining's book, "The Complete Manual of Wood Bending" (Linden Press).
Making a set of oval Shaker-style boxes can teach you a lot about the bending characteristics of different wood species. John Wilson (406 E. Broadway, Charlotte, Michigan 48813; telephone [517] 543-4325) carries all of the materials, tools, and supplies needed to engage in this activity.
If you use the advanced search function for this [Knots] forum, you will find valuable information on steam bending, glued laminations, kerf-cut bending, and using a vacuum bag to bend wood.
Good luck,
-Jazzdogg-
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right.
WOW........this place rocks.
Now I've got so much information on how to bend wood, I don't even know where to start! why I rekon it's enough to make a fellow go plum loopy!
Can we get psychiatric help in here too?j/k
Anyway.....thanks to Brent and Jazzdogg for your help.I look forward to becomming more and more involved here as time flies by.....hopefully I'll be giving advice to some young splinterhead in the future.
ZENPIG
"Can we get psychiatric help in here too?"Zen,
Sure. How long have you had this problem?
Tell me about your mother...:-)Mark
Measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, cut it with an ax.
Zen,
Woodworking is psychiatric help. :)
Welcome to the ward.
Doug
Zen,
I my experience, the best woodworkers have been thoughtful, and giving, problem solvers. If that doesn't count as psychiatric assistance, I don't know what does!
As I'm sure you must realize, your comportment, the way you ask your questions, etc. are directly proportional to the responses you receive - you can be your own doctor!-Jazzdogg-
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right.
As Doug said, welcome to the ward.Leon Jester
please pardon me for not knowinga whole heck of a lot just yet...
I have been woodworking for years!.. I still know nothing!
EDIT: I forgot.. I use alot of poplar and not the best for bending.. Only way I found to bend it is cutting alot of kerf's almost all the way through... Not a pretty sight... I like poplar alot for many things I do BUT I think for pretty boxes I'd use a different wood..
Just me...
Edited 6/21/2005 1:04 pm ET by Will George
Bending Wood ..
I just put a planned stick of wood on the floor.. I told my grandkids... DO NOT TOUCH OR BEND this wood...
We came back home and it WAS bent!
would you be willing to rent out your grandkids?
Zen -
I'm only a physician's assistant to the local shrinks here, so don't know a whole lot more than you. What I do know, though, is bending wood depends not only on the technique but the wood. Some woods just seem to "want" to bend, others break of you look at them wrong.
Then, too, the 'bendy' woods like ash and oak need to be selected with care for bending projects. You don't want any grain "run-out". That's where the grain of the wood is not parallel with the lenght of the member you intend to bend. Soaking, steaming, heating, even swearing will rarely prevent boards with grain runout from coming apart at the seams.
Ash and oak are my two favorite woods for bending. If pressed to give a reason I'd have to admit it's because they're the only two I've tried.
From Beautiful Skagit Co. Wa.
Dennis
"woods like ash and oak need to be selected with care for bending projects. You don't want any grain "run-out". "
Dennis,
Boy, are you right about that! Given the choice, I'll use riven wood for bending every time!
-Jazzdogg-
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right.
Hickory bends pretty well if it is not to thick.. And if it has good grain as you stated...
Oops! I guess I should have mentioned.....I'm just making small stuff like boxes and such. Not trying to bend for furniture or airplanes or anything like that. :@)
I would think small bends the hardest to make! Just me though..
As a note.. If I have to make a really tight bend.. I 'split' the wood.. I do not cut it...
Split.. Plane to size.. Bend...
A 'split' follows the grain and usually more forgiving.. AND stronger!
hmmm.....this is pretty neat stuff. I just want(ed) to make a small box, like maybe cigar box sized with a bend on the front side, and I'm finding out alot of usefull info for all kinds of other possible applications.
I must say though....I feel a little bit out of place......partially because of my limited knowledge and zero experience in woodworking but also because I get the feeling that this forum is populated primarily by furniture and cabinet makers and the like. Which is something I can only dream of doing. I much admiration for you folks who are masters of the craft and experienced tradesmen. Whenever I see a really beautiful piece of well made wood furniture (antique or otherwise) or a really nice carved wood sculpture, I always think 'I wish I could do that' or sometimes-' I'm going to learn how to do that!'
But I am a diferent kind of artist in that I am a graphic artist who does alot of font/type based design work, such as posters and sign painting-which is where I first started noticing real nice hancratfed woodwork.
Anyway....I like to think of myself as well rounded (figuratively....not literaly-L) so now I'm gonna' learn me some woodworking.
Which is something I can only dream of doing...
I'm OK at 'stickin' wood together.... BUT Carving IS 'something I can only dream of doing'.. I TRY.... Ya talk about fire wood!
So the grain essentially acts like billions of little kerf-cuts? <---- (pretending I know what kerf-cut means) lol
All right cool!
Now I'm gettin' somewhere!
Thanks to all of you for being so helpful. I needed to hear your opinions on which woods tend to bend better than others. Also you touched on a point that I apparently really need to be aware of, and that is the direction of the grain in relation to the bend.
So let me see if I understand this 'Grain Runoff' concept. And again forgive the ignorance. Let's say I've got a piece of Ash that is 1/8" thick. 4" wide, and 16" high (tall? I don't even know the proper terminology). I want to bend the bottom half or maybe third back to a gradual slope. hmmmm.......like the shape of ....ummm.....a slide I guess. Or like the shape of your tongue-stuck out and hanging down. Ha!.....I'm an idiot....sorry for this....it's early for me. So.....I'd want the grain running left to right parallel to the 4" length? Is that correct?
If your willing to help me with this, I've got another completely random, yet important to me question about dovetails.
> ..... Let's say I've got a piece of Ash that is 1/8" thick. 4" wide, and 16" high (tall? I don't even know the proper terminology).16" long would be more accurate way to describe it.> ... I want to bend the bottom half or maybe third back to a gradual slope.You need to define these things, Zen. Gradual to me may be something totally different than what you have in mind. Is this a constant radius as in an arc or more of a variable curve? Will it be the single thickness of 1/8" or will you be laminating more than one piece to build up a thicker section?> ...So.....I'd want the grain running left to right parallel to the 4" length? Is that correct?You want the grain running 'around' the curve. I have to assume from your descripting that you want one end of the 16" length curved to whatever specs you have in mind. That being the case you need the grain running parallel to the 16" dimension, the length. Grain runout (not runoff - not trying to be smart just getting terms correct) refers to whether the grain is straight and contained, so to speak within the confines of the board itself. Imagine laying several sheets of paper in a stack representing the grain of the wood. This is totally straight grained wood. No grain runout. Now imagine the stack of paper is thick enough such that you could cut a section out of it so instead of the edges of the paper all ending up at the end, they terminate along the face of the paper 'board' instead. This is the infamous runout. If you bend the first stack of paper, all the sheets bend together (neglecting the compression and tension on the inner and outter faces for the moment). There are no loose edges to fly away. Now imagine bending the second stack that's comprised of sheets lying diagonally across the length of the paper board. Unless some means of restraining them is provided, the loose ends along the outter face will fray out. The paper board splits.In wood the internal cohesion of the wood molecules or whatever (some more knowledgeable wood person can supply the answer) hold the layers of wood grain together when the wood is not being stressed. Under stress of bending, the outter face of the board goes into tension and the inner face goes into compression. Something's gotta give.With straight grain wood, the fibers on the outter layer will stretch, to a degree, and the inner layers will compress, also to a degree. All this within the elastic limit of the particular piece of wood, of course, which can be extended by soaking, steaming or, as in my case, swearing.With not so straight grained wood, the outter layers feel compelled to part company with their neighbors and split off from their companions. The wood splits.This is why it's been suggested to use what's calle "riven" wood. Riven wood is split from the log rather than sawn. This produces a board in which the grain is truely straight, or most nearly straight from end to end. Given, of course, that the log was straight in the first place.Don't go down to Home Depot or Lowes or even your local building supply or lumber dealer and ask for riven wood. You'll have to buy a large piece of lumber and hand split it yourself if you want to go this route. Obviously you'll select a board with the straightest grain you can find within the stack available. You'll probably have to go to a specialty hardwood lumber yard to find ash or hickory. The big box places do handle oak but who knows what you'll find there. The specialty outlets have larger pieces that are described as 4/4, 6/4, 8/4 and so forth. This describes the thickness where 4/4 is (more or less) an inch thick and so forth. You'll find it in what's called either S2S (surfaced two sides) or S2S/SL (surfaced two sides, straight line sawn with one side or edge having been sawn reasonably straight. Not necessarily straight with the grain, just straight in relation to the length of the board.We could go on for days like this but if you could do a simple hand sketch, scan it and upload it to the gallery I think we'd get a better idea of what you're trying to do............
From Beautiful Skagit Co. Wa.
Dennis
Yikes!
Lots and lots of info. This is a good thing I suppose. Actually it's a great thing!
I'm really glad you explained the whole riven wood thing to me, 'cause knowing me I probably would have gone down to Home Depot and tried to convince some poor kid trying to maintain his summer job that such a thing really exits!
But......I think that going the riven wood route is a bit much for me as I am working with limited space as well as tools. I'm thinking I'll try my luck with finding a specialty yard or shop to purchase the best piece I can find. I had also planed on or was at least looking at some places I found (that were recommended) online to by small pieces of specialty woods to use in decorative boxes. However that obviously eliminates the option of checking things out myself,ie.. grain, color....etc.
As far as the bend I'm shooting for is concerned, it's a single width of 1/8". Although I actually do know what laminating is, it's not something I'm ready to tackle just yet. And the bend is more of a variable curve. Actually not an exact radius or an exact anything else for that matter, meaning I am not limiting this particular project by any pre-conceived plans other than rough ideas at this point. I figured I'd bend the wood getting it as close as I can to what I have in mind....then I'd cut the side and rear panels.(it's essentially a rectangular box running vertically.....standing up.The front (bent panel) is supposed to bend back and meet the rear (straight) panel at the bottom edge. I'll try to upload a sketch a little later in the day.(it's 2am here and I'm beat)
Once again thank you so much for your patience and the willingness to share your brain cells with me.
type at y'all later!
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