I have seen several ask this question on various forums.. but few responses with the exception of the Kamal #10 rabbet. I don’t think many others have been sold and probably because of the bad responses about the standard Anant.
I can answer the question about the Kamal #7 jointer at this point. The Highland WW header says it is better machined and a step up from the standard Anant with a thicker iron. And.. the thicker iron resulted in a tighter fit and less gap in the throat opening. But.. not much more than that as to any significant detail.
I was given a new #7 as a gift and told to exchange it if I didn’t like it by my FIL and BIL who know little about hand planes. They had over-heard me mention I needed a #7 jointer and owed me a few markers.
So… the sole was flatter than the Anant’s I have had my hands on. The biggest discrepancy was about .003 and the sides had as much as .004 at the top. That good news and improvement but… the machines marks were deeper than the standard Anants I have en-countered so…..
The Kamal has nicer wooden handles and a brass adjuster knob as opposed to the zinc on the standard A. The iron is thicker even though I cannot say at this point if it needs to be replaced with a Hock. Just how good the grade of steel is in the iron is questionable.
But… the buck stops there as I see it!
With the throat opening on this plane, it was so tight I was not able to take a medium shaving. I prefer to be able to take both fine and medium with a jointer. This was a problem to me as the fix is not as easy as an LV with an adjustable throat. But.. I can’t afford the LV jointer.. so the challenge was faced in lieu of returning it.
This plane had a relatively flat sole but… the machine marks were deep and I prefer polished. $15 worth of 80 grit adhesive sand-paper got it to the point of moving up the steps in grit to 1200. I did the same with the sides but could not get all the machine marks at the top out which I left. This took about 7 hours of push and pull sanding on a tempered glass plate. Another hour to go through the remaining grit. Whew…
I had to square the inside of the rectangle that receives the fore-aft adjust bar. About 15 minutes. The Bailey style frog had to be filed to flat to take out a few high spots and machine marks to mate properly to the back of blade. The same with the rear throat on the sole to ensure a continuos bed. Another 45 minutes or so.
Another 45 minutes to flatten and polish the iron back and the same with the bevel. Put it together to run some shavings as I suspected it would clog with medium shaving as the throat was that tight. You guessed it if you guessed I was correct. Another 45 to an hour to file about 3/64″ off the face of the throat. The chip breaker and cap iron needed another 30 minutes to flatten.
That was yesterday and today is today. Would I recommend it to someone in need of a cheap plane? NO.. Time invested would put the cost of the plane beyond an LV IMO. And I would not recommend it to anyone who doesn’t understand the importance of how the frog.. throat.. chip-breaker.. cap iron works in conjunction.
Will I keep the plane as my keeper? Yep.. as today it is as good as any other with the way it cuts. But… only after I basically re-surrected the plane from the “dead” with over 12 hours work. It was free and now it is useful as opposed to useless when I took it out of the box.
Fine shavings… medium shavings are illustrated below.. after a lot of work. That’s all I would have ask for in any plane. Sometimes you just have to weigh the value of the journey.
Hope that helps anyone considering getting a Kamal that is on a budget or just beginning.
Sarge..
Replies
Sarge,
I understand that the big advantage of having a Kamal, is its ability to take you from oasis to oasis. Does yours have one hump or two?
Ray
It had two fairly large humps in this case. I took then off as I like to ride bare-back and don't need anything that would add baggage. But.. you are quite correct in your thinking as it has not ask for a drink of water yet. High mileage between fill-ups is a plus and it is good in sandy shop conditions.
Get to work.. would ya? .... :>)
Sarge..
Edited 5/28/2008 6:49 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,
Wait a minute sir.
I see that plane once, it's been properly fettled into working order generates multiple shavings! Now that's just way too clever. Did you install multiple blades to make that happen or is the Kamal multi talented?
You just may have created THE next generation of handplane! The multi shaving Kamal - without the spit!
:-)
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 5/29/2008 9:45 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
I think it's the "deluxe" Kamal which comes with a depth adjuster right on-board. That adjuster was pointed out to me back in the 70's after I spent two years thinking that brass knob was there to hold onto while planing.
I never could figure out how to do that with my left hand on the front knob and the right on the tote. I figured it was maybe put on there in case a Siamese Twin bought the plane. But some European fellla named Frid told me what it really did in a seminar in the early days of Highland Hardware which is now Highland Woodworking. He seemed to have a few tricks that I wasn't aware of at the time.
But.. even so, I bet he didn't have a Kamal. :>)
Regards...
Sarge..
Sarge,
You have way to much free time on your hands. You need to build another bench.
Does it spit at you?
John
I had to take a day from a TV stand partially assembled to fix that thang with a chest on chest sitting on the wood rack. But.. I needed a #7.. so a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do, even if all the carbon stains haven't come off yet. I'll try some Tide and a wire brush to-nite.
Does it spit at me? I think it would have but I loosened the throat up and it appears to only be able to slobber at this point. A good spit requires more velocity than a slobber and I have my doubts after the surgery that it can. :>)
Regards...
Sarge..
Never know 'bout kamels.
They kiss you n' then spit. Doc
That one is probably related to Joe of Kamal fame. :>)
Regards...
Sarge..
I recieved an Anant plough plane as a gift. Like you I appreciated the gift, but was left disappointed when the plane required a tremendous amount of tuning / tinkering to make it work. It was so poorly made.
I wrote Anant explaining what was wrong with it and why I was so disappointed with it. I recieved an e-mail back stating that they would look into my concerns and would send me a "fresh" plane. No surprise to me, but it never came.
Someday, I will replace in and put it into the trash can where it belongs.
In this case SW... once all was said and done, the plane cuts as well as the two LV bench planes I sold. They don't have the adjustable throat and side screws to lock in lateral movement which I love as the LV. But... after doing that amount of surgery... I really should not ever need another #7.
So.. not a good start, but an OK ending in my case. That could vary under various circumstances I realize. :>)
Regards...
Sarge..
Hello Sarge,
I think your experience is not unique. I have the LN #7- and like it very much. I also have LVs, and old Baileys and such.
The Bedrock style frog that is sweet to adjust is found on the LN. You could also look for a 607, but Bedrocks are collector's items, and command a price akin to LN. So... might as well buy one new and not have to fettle. For a jack, the Bailey frog works fine for me.
Yours is the sweat equity approach- that I have also done, but not on an Anant or similar. After all that suffering... err, honing, you must be better person. Think of what your saving on psychotherapy...
Best,
Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
I have been looking for a bed-rock since I sold my LV #6 fore, Doc. As you stated... they are not easy to find local as like you, I am not that keen on e-bay as I look the gift horse in the mouth. I ran into the same scenario looking for a used PM floor mortiser for 4 years. I have all but given up when Curt Wilke's last industrial model (750 lbs. of cast iron)was offered to me new $250 less than a new PM.
My father left me a #7 and 5 bed-rock when he died just before my 13th birthday. It was given to him by his uncle who was a carpenter that built houses all his life when he passed. My dad's entire collection of tools in two tool boxes were stolen from my mom's garage while I was in VN, so I never got to use them or several other good tools.
The Anant's are fashioned after the original Stanley's with the standard Bailey frog. That solid surfaced bed-rock frog was an improvement and that's why LN uses it I would imagine. I have a couple of LV's and actually personally prefer them with the throat adjuster and the two side screws to lock lateral.
The selling of the LV #6 just left a void I couldn't gap it seems. I could have used it about 3 weeks ago on a new work-bench top I built over the week-end. I had to borrow a #7 from a friend to take care of final flattening. I have sweated over a standard Anant #4 smoother and #5 jack and they are fine after the sweat labor which I don't really mind.
As you know I won't hesitate to tinker or improve on a tool. A day lost but a tool gained as it will most likely serve till the lights in the shop go out for the final time.
Regards...
Sarge..
Edited 5/29/2008 1:06 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,Sorry to hear about the theft of your Dad's tools- even after so long a time it must leave you wistful. My grandfather started out as a carpenter [interesting guy- drop dead handsome (wish I'd gotten some of his looks), lightweight boxing champ of the USN North Atlantic Fleet in WWI (a good way to get out real work, he would say, is to get your face pushed-in in the ring once a month), dated starlets in Hollywood during the silent film era (my grandmother didn't like to talk about this period of his life), a carpenter who started out working in the trades in NYC (on the Chrysler and Empire State Bldgs), survived the depression, became a contractor and developer after WWII and lived to 91...]- I still have his tools- although no handplanes.Some unsolicited advice: your Dad bought the best- you owe yourself a good #7. Get a LN- it's even better than his Bedrock. If not now, tell Santa or one of his helpers... do it in August, as they tend to get back ordered. End of unsolicited advice.Best,Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
The theft does bother me Doc.. but then any theft bothers me. Fortunately I learned to face reality just after his death in 1959 as I had to take a part time job after school. But all went well and the experience came in handy latter.
I may at some point pick up an LN. I have used several but not the #7. I am not in a hurry or feel deprived really. I used my Camel just to-night to square up a 8/4 piece I was going to rip down for chest guts. Wasn't off by much but it was not square.
Two strokes with the Camel on all four sides which I have set for ultra fine at the moment and paper thin curls came running up the chip breaker. The same plane that two days ago that would barely allow the iron to go through the throat so any iron edge was below the bottom of the sole.
This is my third cheapie at this point and it appears I've developed the touch for taking a wild Camel and turning it into a well behaved and steady ride. Saddle up and take me to the "promise land' little fella. The forest awaits us just beyond the sand dunes... ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Regards...
Sarge..
Edited 5/30/2008 12:35 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
Edited 5/30/2008 12:36 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
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