Replies

1. 
   BruceS | Apr 10, 2008 03:04am | #1

   If it were me the bull dozers would vanish.  Those crooks must have come back and picked them up !!

    

   Work Safe,  Count to 10 when your done for the day !!

   Bruce S. 

    

1. 
   Napie | Apr 10, 2008 04:02pm | #3

   And if they were still there they would not run....

2. 
   [email protected] | Apr 10, 2008 07:12am | #2

   Me, if they cut down trees, and clogged a stream would call the Corps of Engineers, and file a complaint that they illegally damaged a stream in the waters of the United States, in violation of the Clean Water act.   

   The Feds have far more money to pursue such scum than local law enforcement. 

1. 
   smslaw | Apr 14, 2008 09:33pm | #17

   Me, if they cut down trees, and clogged a stream would call the Corps of Engineers, and file a complaint that they illegally damaged a stream in the waters of the United States, in violation of the Clean Water act.   

   The Feds have far more money to pursue such scum than local law enforcement. 

    

   Too true- I have been having twice weekly chats with EPA trying to resolve a Clean Water Act case. They really do have all the time and money in the world and are very aggressive towards accidental stream discharges.  Intentional ones often get referred to the Justice Dept. for prosecution.

    

3. 
   troys | Apr 11, 2008 03:55am | #4

   Appalling, makes you wonder if the Sheriff and the prosecutor are related to the thief. I would have been really tempted to destroy the bulldozers that where left behind.

   Troy

4. 
   andyfew322 | Apr 11, 2008 06:07am | #5

   that's just low. first copper, then trees, what's next water?

    

   There's enough youth in this world, how 'bout a fountain of SMART??!!

5. 
   johndl | Apr 11, 2008 06:41am | #6

   He should allow the thieves to return and get the bulldozers they left behind.

   After all, the dozers are their property.

   And he should sweeten the deal, like 5 pounds of sugar in each fuel tank.

    

1. 
   troys | Apr 11, 2008 10:26pm | #7

   Kero syrup might work better, already liquid:)Troy

2. 
   [email protected] | Apr 12, 2008 08:25pm | #10

   Actually, the spray can foam does wonders on disabling/destroying mechanical devices.  Just shoot a can or two in the intake manifold, and/or the exhaust pipe(s). 

   Much better than sugar in a fuel tank, or the old bananas in the tail pipe. 

   On a dozer engine with a vertical exhaust stack polyurethane glue in the stack will destroy the engine.  It will fill the turbo, ($500+labor), exhaust stack ($250+), and if you use enough, get all the way through the exhaust into the cylinders on the block with the valves open.  When the engine tries to start and hits the solid lump things break. 

1. 
   dkellernc | Apr 12, 2008 08:39pm | #11

   From the stanpoint of the bulldozers, the land owner is perfectly within his rights to call a salvage company to retrieve abandoned property (the dozers).  THe salvage company then auctions them on the open market, takes the usual %30 cut, and return the rest to the landowners,  The key for these landowners is immediately get a lawyer to file a "quit claim deed" on the two dozers and any other equipment they left behind, they're then the landowner's bull dozers.  Same for a logging truck, a front-end loader and any equipment (such as chainsaws and skidder they left behind.

   Without equipment, they're out of business, and the mills aren't going to lend the heavy equipment to steel logs if they know it's going to get stolen.

   Finally, the cut logs they left behind can be loaded up on the logging truck, taken to the mill, with the landowners getting the hole take.

   After that, make sure the local newspaper has the whole story so that it's widely publicized, which will goose the State Legislature to face scrutiny on why this form of grand theft is treated so much more lightly than grand theft auto.

   If the landowners are willing become activists in the area, you could fairly easily shut down the whole illegal logging operation in the entire State.  Just takes a leader.

    

1. 
   Ron01960 | Apr 13, 2008 06:43am | #12

   It would get quick legislative support if the trees were on an elected officials land.

2. 
   WillGeorge | Apr 14, 2008 10:35pm | #18

   Jigs sounds like you did that a some time!  LOL.. Taters just mess up the grill of the car parked in back!

3. 
   frenchy | Apr 13, 2008 07:42pm | #13

   johndl,

    Sorry sugar in the tank are a myth.    one won't disolve the other.  (same applies to karo syrup) I would simply file a lien against the machinery and demand payment for the trees value as standing as payment.. Standing value far higher than the price of a log boll.  White oak is around  35 cents a bd.ft. standing at most.  Inaccessable areas the price drops accordingly.  (remember the measure of board feet is done at the narow end rather than the wide end) 

1. 
   troys | Apr 14, 2008 03:04am | #14

   Very rational and well thought out, not nearly as fun to talk about though:) does sound like good advise.Troy

6. 
   colebearanimals | Apr 11, 2008 11:03pm | #8

    

         It won't bring back the trees, but if I was the land owner, I would consider those bulldozers now mine!

                                                                     Paul

7. 
   JLMCDANIEL | Apr 12, 2008 07:12am | #9

   Lets see, shotgun, dozer to dig hole.....

    

   Jack

8. 
   Tinkerer3 | Apr 14, 2008 06:04am | #15

   In West Virginia, Trees that are cut on someone else's property are worth twice as much as the trees were worth standing - State of West Virginia law.  It is the foresters responsibility to have permission and to know who the trees belong to.  And of course some trees have sentimental value.  But you need to attach those machines while they are available.  I had a friend who retired as a professor of forestry at WVU.  He could go through a cut area and evaluate the value of timber by the stumps left.  This was recognized by the courts in the state.  He once met a widow land owner who had sold trees to a company that were worth five times as much as they paid her.  He told her "I will get the money that they are worth for you if you will let me."  She wouldn't let him do it and the shysters were rewarded for their deeds.

1. 
   frenchy | Apr 14, 2008 06:45pm | #16

   Tinkerer3

     I do know some honest decent guys working for landowners have been caught between landowners over boundry issues.

      They were told the line went through here and see that stake there?  etc..  trees on the boundry were all marked well prior to cutting and all normal precations taken short of getting a survey done.. (normally not done)..

      They are cutting away and suddenly wind up in court.. There goes the money they earned on the job and many other jobs as well. 

    My point is not all lumberjacks are deliberately crooks..

1. 
   Tinkerer3 | Apr 15, 2008 03:54am | #20

   "My point is that not all lumberjacks are deliberately crooks."

   And my point was to only point out West Virginia law.  I know that not all lumberjacks are crooks, but some are and therefore laws are made to control them.  These law don't fit each situation and are abused by crooked land owners and unfair juries and the cycle goes on.  I was a landlord for apartments.  Lots of crooked landlords, and so laws are made to protect the tenant.  A lot of states have been adopted laws that way overprotect the tenant.  Luckily West Virginia so far, is not among them.  Lots of crooked tenants.  I suppose that in the twenty five years of landlording that I lost between fifty and one hundred dollars in unpaid rent.  I think a good portion of the tenants have the mindset when they move in that they are going to gyp the landlord before he gyps them.  I always tried to go a little further than fair and many of the tenants appreciated that.  I got several thank you cards showing appreciation.  A couple of Chinese doctors wrote a nice note saying that I was the best landlord in the whole world.  But I also had complaints.  It is impossible to please everyone.

1. 
   frenchy | Apr 15, 2008 04:15pm | #21

   Tinker3 well said, 

      There is a lot of complexity in the world and whenever one side seems to be getting all bad media I look at the other side. 

     It's absolutely true that some people are crooks and bums. It's also true that the vast majority are hardworking decent people.

9. 
   boschvaark | Apr 14, 2008 10:37pm | #19

   Hey,

   Thanks for the post, and all the replies. I have wanted to buy a piece of property for a few years now, with the specific idea of protecting future woodworkers by controlling the resource. Seems like I'll have to be pretty vigilant. I like the idea of selling the bulldozers for fair market value (an inadvertent "trade" on the part of the timber thieves), and the bit about the Clean Water Act... Oooh, Federal crime. As my Mum would say "Cruel, but fair.".