hello everyone. I have just moved to a new house in Owen sound. on georgian bay. My old shop was 16 x 22. my new shop is 12 x 20/ I cant keep all my tools as the space is just too small, I am looking for a layout that will fit my new space. Can any one give me some guidence as to what tools I should have in a space this small. I build small cabinets and benches and coffie tables. That sort of thing. My current tool invintory is.
router table, 48″ lathe, floor drill press, radial arm saw with 16 ft bench, 14 inch bandsaw, bench top mortiser, 6″ jointer, 15 in planer, 10 in table saw, 5ft workench. all the reg hand held sanders and drills and extra routers. I would also like to fit in a dust collector if poss.
If any one has a working layout that may suit I would be happy for your input.
I was thinking of letting The radial saw go as well as the lathe. as I havent used those in a while.
Does anyone else have a shop that small that works. I build about 6 pieces a year so it is not a production shop. Lumber is kept in another building untill about a month before I start a project. All of my lumber is air dried from my bush so i need the planer. any ideas?
Thanks sidecutter
Replies
sidecutter1,
My shop is about the same size and it is a challenge. Like you, I make about 6 pieces a year and would like to make more. My objective in shop layout is focus on organization and efficiency (I'm a lazy guy). Also, I wanna do stuff with wood so I try to keep the tools that give me flexibility. In other words, the bandsaw, lathe, router table, workbench are the things that allow me to shape the wood, some of the other tools less so. In making my space trade offs the shaping stuff is given priority. My planer is a table top, I have no radial arm saw or jointer and no mortise.
Recently I added the 1.5 DC and with its 10 foot hose is pretty convienent but does take up my last wiggle room space.
A few little things I've done to make the whole thing work is build cabinetry that attaches to the walls and convert dead space into storage. Above my workbench is a five foot cabinet with boxed doors. The cabinet holds the power tools and the boxed doors the hand tools. Also, I built a workbench for the lathe with nested drawers underneath and a cabinet above for the turning tools.
One of the handiest things has been a 7' high by 24x12 cabinet with doors to store all me finishing supplies. It allows for lots of stuff to be at a good level to read.
If I was starting all over I'd try to run 2-3 electrical lines in parallel off of different circuits around the room. The DC uses lot of amps as does many of the other tools.
Good luck with your issues.
My shop is about the same size as yours and I have just about the same tools that you have listed plus an Oneida cyclone DC. My solution, if that's what it is, includes these suggestions:
My router table is incorporated in the table saw outfeed surface. I purchased a custom-made router table top from Woodpecker's that makes the entire surface 5' x 5'. It doubles as the handiest workspace I have.
My 16" bandsaw is mounted on an HTC mobile base. I roll it out from the wall to place in front of the table saw which serves as an outfeed table for the BS. It takes less than 30 seconds to move into position. WARNING: A bandsaw is very unstable on rollers. Be sure to get a rolling base with "step-on" stability feet.
I purchased a MiniMax combo jointer/planer which gives 12" cutting width for both functions. It too is mounted on an HTC mobile base. I position it, easily, to accommodate the length of stock I am working. So I eliminate one machine and gain jointer width. I purchased the slot mortiser attachment for the combo and built a rolling storage unit that makes it easy to mount then tuck into a corner when not needed.
I keep all of my small tools, powered and conventional on the pegboard wall above the 16' RAS bench and in drawers under that same bench. Depending on the job, I set-up an assembly table consisting of a dedicated, poly-finished pc. of plywood that I mount on two Stanley (?) adjustable height sawhorses. The only place I have found these is a HD. (I ran in the buy them and then ran out as fast as I could.)
Frosty
"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
Edited 8/23/2009 9:25 am ET by Jfrostjr
I have a similar size shop with the same tools, except for the RAS which I couldn't possibly fit in. I have a midi-lathe which sits on a shelf -- not used very much , but not having one limits what you can make. BS, jointer, TS, and drill press are all on wheels, and the planer in a flip-cart that lives under the TS. I have a 1 1/2 DC also on wheels. I gave up on my router table, and bought a cast-iron router-table wing for the TS, which works well. There's a small fixed bench at the rear of the shop with drawers to hold routers etc, with mortiser and sharpening station on top.
Wheeling everything around is a great nuisance, the worst being the jointer which is always in the way because of its footprint, but I need it. The TS only ever gets moved at right angles to allow for long stock. The top gets used for minor assembly etc.
The workbench is fairly wide. With room for only one it has to serve also as an assembly table -- not a very satisfactory arrangement. It includes drawers underneath for hand tools, which I use a lot. The hardest thing about a small shop is finding a place for the piece you're working on, if it's a large one. When I make a tall piece such as a sideboard I have to finish the base and take it indoors before starting on the top.
Lumber for about 2 projects is stacked on metal shelves on one long wall. The other long wall has overhead shallow cupboards for glue, finish products etc. Underneath there are as many small drawers as possible to keep dust out of small tools and supplies.
Over the years I've tried a number of layouts, none without problems. The most sensible thing would be to build only pieces scaled to the room available, but that's way too sensible for me.
Good luck, Jim
I like your idea of eliminating the RAS. Break down long boards with a hand saw. I would strongly recommend making a scale drawing of your shop and then "paper dolls" of each piece. Play with the layout until you understand the tradeoffs. Consider space for infeed and outfeed to machines like the jointer and planer. Experimenting on paper will help you answer most of your questions.
Good luck, Tom.
A couple of thoughts, based on my experience in having a small shop area:
1. Mobile bases. Where possible, put floor machines on wheels, so they can be moved into position for use, and then "stored" more compactly.
2. Make space do double-duty, where possible. Your lathe, for example, might live in the space under the feed bench for your radial-arm saw. Add hinges to the back edge of the feed bench so it flips up, and you're ready to turn.
3. Use aisles as out-feed areas, where possible. For example, my table saw (contractor model with Delta T3 fence, on wheels) usually is against a wall. That works OK for most cross cutting. When I need to rip, I swing it 90° so the out-feed goes down the aisle.
4. Layout planning. It helps to make scaled cutouts of almost everything, and then move them around on a scaled outline of the shop on graph paper. Or, use drafting/layout software to accomplish the same thing. (I use Visio, but there are other programs available.) When I moved to my current home, I had to shoe-horn what amounted to a 3-car garage shop into a 2-car space. Doing so required some careful engineering.
My shop is 15x13 and I have most things on carts and wheels. The picture is standing outside the doorway. A 4' lathe and mortiser are to right of doorway and out of view in picture.
Edited 8/23/2009 4:10 pm by Doodabug
One thing a lot of people mentioned here are mobile bases. My shop is in my basement, and it's hard to move down there even with mobile bases, especially on something big like a table saw. Mobile bases come with two fixed casters and two movable casters (360* rotation). This is OK, but it means that if I want to slide my table saw perpendicular to the direction the fixed wheels face (either east/west or north/south) I basically have to drag the thing across the floor.
I have my bandsaw, jointer, planer and tablesaw all on movable bases. On all four tools, I replaced the two fixed casters with movable casters. This makes a huge difference, as any tool can rotate and roll in any direction. It is a little ungainly with the lighter tools (bandsaw, jointer, planer) as there are no locks on the movable casters, but I end up butting those tools up against either the table saw or my worktable for outfeed support anyways, so the tools don't get to move in the direction I'm pushing.
eric
I agree that the TS can be hard to move, but some (Delta, Steel City) have 2 fixed, 1 swivel wheel that makes the job slightly easier. You pay for that, though, with some instability. Personally I'd prefer the TS bolted to the floor, but a small shop just doesn't allow it.
Jim
I recently bought an older industrial ts which weighs near 1000 lbs., for it I bought a base from General tools that uses a cushion of air to move the base. I was skeptical but the first time I moved the saw it moved easy in any direction I wanted. My 5 year old boy can push the saw around! It truly suprised me.
I was interested in one of those, but the manufacturer stipulates a smooth floor. I didn't think mine would qualify. How smooth in practice does it have to be? BTW they're on sale at present if the OP is interested. Need to have compressed air, though.
Jim
I have a concrete floor fairly smooth but not polished; works fine. From what I remember somebody telling me is that if a suction cup even attempts to stick it is smooth enough.
Thanks. I have finished concrete, but the occasional rough spot. I think I'll give it a try -- should be more stable at rest than wheels.
Jim
Matthew Teague once had a shop that was smaller -- 9 x 18 IIRC.
There was a Fine Woodworking article about it:
https://www.finewoodworking.com/Workshop/WorkshopArticle.aspx?id=29505
I seem to remember that it had a good discussion about the choices he made.
I'm moving into a retirement unit, so your shop seems very big. My shop will be a closet that is part of a 9x17 sunroom (but the retirement community does have a fairly decent shared workshop).
Tom in SE Pennsylvania (until I move)
Mobility is the key in a small shop. Machines that are not used often can be rolled out of the way when not in use. If you can incorporate a router table into the tablesaw, either on the side or outfeed table, this will free up a lot of space. Combination machines were developed in Europe in response to the smaller shops over there. So a combo jointer/planer can free up a load of real estate. I got rid of a 6" jointer and 12" planer and replaced them with a 12" combo. Opened up a lot of room.
As for the radial arm saw; there are lots of methods of crosscutting a board, so I would seriously consider finding a buyer for this tool, eliminating all of its cabinetry, and then a lot of space can be found after its gone. A cross cut sled on the tablesaw, hand tools, or even a miter saw can be used for cutting boards to length. I put my mitersaw under the side table of the table saw when it is not being used, or space can be found under a bench.
This is the time to really consider what you really need and look at selling them off and use the funds for more lumber. Just my .02 cents worth. I have 16 X 24 now and could use double this amount.
here's what'll happen, if'n ya ain't careful....10 lbs of stuff in a 5 lb poke....
talk about cramped..... : )
but no complaints, I knew when I got into this, that I had limited space... FWIW, I use every tool I own, so I can't really eliminate any...my RAS gets used as much as my TS,if not more. if you have one, keep it.
I know these will draw laughs or sneers from many, but......
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/Bluburst135/shop0042.jpg
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/Bluburst135/shop010.jpg
Ayyyuuuuuh, and then ye hoe the place out. 'Bout every three months nowdays, find all kinds of neat stuff ye fergot ye had!
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Sidecut,
You've received some good advice from those who have already posted to this thread. "Mobility" seems to be the watchword - being able to wheel machines into place ready for use or out of the way quickly and easily. Those are good thoughts.
I'd also add that to maximize your space, put everything you can up on a wall and not stacked in a corner or alongside machinery. This especially applies to lumber storage and offcuts, which have a way of taking over your shop if you're not careful. Any space that is claimed by junk, or by something that could be hung up, is space that can't be used to move around productively in.
It is worth your time to plot out each of the walls of your shop, drawing in storage solutions - shelves especially, lumber racks, etc. In my shop the shelves and racks go floor to ceiling. There's not a scrap of wall surface that is wasted or doesn't have something on it. That gives my moderate shop more floor space, and I'm a happier and more productive woodworker.
Finally, if you can manage it, take steps to make your shop only your shop. If you've got yard tools to store, hoses or bicycles, build or buy a shed for that purpose. Those items don't belong in your shop and will rob you of working space. If you've got a lot of lumber, it might even make sense to build a separate shed - or maybe a lean-to type shed addition onto your shop - for that purpose.
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
I noticed that you didn't mention any type of dust collection in your list so am curious as to what you have or plan to get. I feel a dust collector in a powered woodshop is prolly one of the most important tools to have - without it you're literally killing yourself. I know that sounds harsh but it is reality.
You may want to consider, let's say partial retirement of the RAS and lathe; never know what you may be making in the future. There are many ways around a RAS but the lathe might be a different matter. Perhaps it's a candidate for mobility. You did say it isn't used much though.
Mobility in a small woodshop is sometimes overdone or can become a nuisance, especially the TS and dust collector. At least these two machines I'm finding work better for me if somewhat permanentized. I believe in bringing Muhammed to the mountain, not the other way around. I like mountains that stay in one place. :-)
The thing is what works for me may not work for you. Therein lies part of the enjoyment of this hobby to me; figuring out how to make it all work. I love puzzles which seems to come with the territory, right? I mean we're forever figuring out puzzles in just about everything we do.
Another thing is, things change. Your interests may change from making small cabinets, benches and tables to much bigger or smaller pieces.
There, that make sit all clear as mud, eh.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
I'm getting here a little late but...............
I have a lot of space. The cellar is mine although I have to share it with the furnace and the hot water heater.
I'm a weekender but have made some good sized furniture including 2 sets of kitchen cabinets.
In response to having a very small shop in the last house, in the new house I built a 7' X 8" table and integrated the table saw into one end. I have enough room in front to rip an 8' piece of ply and the outfeed is the table. Below the table is dust collection. One connected to the saw and the other a vacumn for general use with the other tools.
The main space of the shop is 13.5' wide and the table sits in the middle between the walls and cabinets around the edge. All of the tools are in a space not much bigger than your new shop.
The big table us also where everything gets worked on. It's a big enough surface to have lots of things going on at the same time and all the machines are stationary.
I guess my conclusion is that the big table with the table saw and oh yes, router table serves me well.
ASK
Build yourself a router table that replaces one of the tablesaw side extensions. Planned properly, you can use the existing tablesaw fence with a clamp-on jig for the router functions.
You might want to trade the radial saw with its 16' bench for a mitersaw and a fold-up stand.
The benctop mortiser can be mounted to a plywood base that can be clamped to your workbench when needed, and stored when not.
And you might want to think about adding an exterior shed or closet for the "shop utilities" like the dust collector, a compressor, and such.
I won't be laughing at the lies when I'm gone,
And I can't question how or when or why when I'm gone;
I can't live proud enough to die when I'm gone,
So I guess I'll have to do it while I'm here. (Phil Ochs)
Have a look at my machine shop here:
http://flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!2B3CECCE825F255A!807.entry
It's about 10' by 22'. Directly adjacent, I have a benchroom about 12'x22' where I do hand work and assembly. Also, my dust collector is located in a small room located to the back-right of the table saw. The only tools on mobile bases are my table saw, thickness planer, and thickness sander. The oscillating spindle/belt sander is just sitting on the bench and can be moved easily as required. My rarely used router table is in the TS wing.
and www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com)
- Success is not the key to happiness. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
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