sled for bandsaw for cutting short logs
alanplanesaw
| Posted in General Discussion on
I have some short logs that I want to cut on my bandsaw into short boards.
Anyone know of some plans or concepts for a sled to hold the log sections for cutting on a bandsaw?
Thanks,
Alan – planesaw
Replies
What are the dimensions of the logs? I've taken short (less than 4') logs that aren't too big in diameter (less than 12") and first cut them down the middle lengthwise with a chainsaw (strike a chalk line to help keep the cut reasonably straight, and use wedges as necessary to keep the kerf open). I then cut the two halves down the middle on the bandsaw so that I end up with a quartered log. From that point on it's just a matter of cutting boards. I just do it by eye, sometimes with the help of a chalk line, but a sled with a runner that slides in the miter slot might help you keep the cut straight.
Of course, with this technique, you don't get the widest possible boards, but what you do get is mostly quarter- and rift-sawn.
-Steve
24ish inches long
12 to 18 inches in diameter.
Yes, I want to cut some quarter-sawn boards about 5/8ths inches thick. Maybe thinner.
I thought, and it was also suggested, to build some sort of sled. Lookin' for ideas.
Alan - planesaw
The most important use of a sled when resawing a log is when you want to saw the wood in such a way that you can't have a flat face resting on the bandsaw table (for example, when you want to saw the log through-and-through). It's primarily a safety issue.
If you quarter the log first, then you'll always have a flat face on the table, and a sled is more or less superfluous (with the caveat that you might get a straighter cut with a sled, although I personally think that the ability to steer the wood as it goes through the saw gives better results overall).
-Steve
Alan,
Here are a couple for ya:
http://www.woodcraft.com/articles.aspx?articleid=347
This one is several pages:
http://www.americanwoodworker.com/userdocs/articles/200008/main/index.html
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob,
I am also figuring out a way to resaw on my 14" bandsaw. I have some nice mesquite logs, 4 to 6 ft long and about 14" diameter and a 10 footer that is about the same.
I had considered chainsawing one edge to give me somewhat flat surface to start with. Then using outfeed tables on both sides to support the wood. From there, I think I need a wider table and a rip fence, but it seems I might need a sled to attach the log to so that it is really square and has flat side to ride against the fence.
I am looking for 8" wide material from the logs, and can run them through the 8" jointer or my thickness planer when they dry out.
Any thoughts?
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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AZMO,
I have some nice mesquite logs, 4 to 6 ft long and about 14" diameter and a 10 footer that is about the same.
If it were me facing that task I would seriously consider looking for a local sawyer or sawmill to cut them for me. I have a sawyer friend who has sawn well over 5,000 bf for me over the years and when I see all the work he does; and he's very well equipped machinery wise, it becomes very clear to me.
Now bear in mind that I'm somewhat over the hill but I just can't see me trying to wrestle with those logs on my 14" bandsaw AND maintaining a reasonable amount accuracy. I say this as first of all my 14" BS has a blade capacity of ¾" which is not what I would consider the optimal size for resawing logs. Think about how much time this will take and what is your time worth? Will you need multiple blades to cut it all?
Also, if I'm not mistaken, mesquite is not the easiest wood to cut. If you haven't already done it, I would suggest some research:
http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Sawing_and_drying_mesquite.html
Better yet, go out there and cut off a 2' section and resaw that on your 14" bandsaw; keeping track of the time and work involved. I think you'll find your answer.
And, don't forget that Just when you think you're finished, there are two more things to do....
:>)
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 4/2/2008 8:45 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
Bob,
As usual you have some solid thoughts. I have looked for a local sawyer, but you need to remember we live in the Desert, and when my visitors pass the sign Tonto National Forest, they refer to it Tonto National Bush... The closest Sawyer I have found is 4 hours away, and he works Mesquite in Southern AZ. I have placed some requests around., and will continue to look.
Now at 55 I am not the best log wrestler in my class either. I will cut a log in half and give it whirl and see. I do have a chain hoist in my shop which does make vertical movement better. Every sawmill system I see, the log stays put and the saw moves. I saw a guy do fancy cuts on beams at job sites by putting his bandsaw on wheels and moving it along the floor with the beam fixed. Worked very slick. My plan is to rough saw at 3", Dry it (it gets to 110 to 120 here real soon), and then mill and resaw this fall when the weather shifts. I have cut my logs this winter, when the trees are dormant. The good part is the wood is free, so maybe just a chainsaw and deal with the waste is fine also.
The wood so beautiful, it justs demands a look at how to salvage this lost resource. Now contrary to the link you sent, my arborist just gives me the trees that have a pretty straight trunk. We have Argentine and Chilean mesquites here that outgrow the position at peoples homes. So they are grow as vertical as posible and are staked and guyed to stay that way. I have a metal detector to check them also...
I will post you some pics of some efforts.
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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I want you to know that I wasn't trying to rain on your parade. Been thinking about your situation and was wondering what size projects you have planned for the wood? If you have smaller ones perhaps cutting them down to rough size first might make the logs more manageable.
Finding a local sawyer/sawmill seems to be a bit on the long side of help for you. Sounds like drying should be a cinch though but might want to consider stickering and strapping 'em down to keep 'em straight.
Looking forward to seeing the pics. I've read several articles and have seen some really nice pics of pieces made from mesquite.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob, you never seem to rain on anyones parade, and I value your opinion.
My initial projects this fall are for some bed side end tables. I will use the mesquite for the tops, and a contrasting wood for the legs and shelf under it. I am designing in Sketchup, (more learning curve) and will make some prototypes this summer in some pine or willow. After that I am looking at a coffee table, with some longer pieces, 5 ft or so, depending on if I can this stuff to work. So in answer to your thought, using some 3 ft logs might work fine to get some top material.
Thanks again
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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"My plan is to rough saw at 3", Dry it (it gets to 110 to 120 here real soon), and then mill and resaw this fall when the weather shifts."
That's generally not recommended, as resawing thick, partially dried pieces invariably leads to warpage. It's always best to saw the wood fairly close to the thickness of the final boards while it's still green.
-Steve
Saschafer
Yes I have read that also, but my experience is 0. This stuff is going to move, warp bow twist etc. If I rough saw at 1" and it does all this wonderful stuff, what am I left with. My initial thought was a 3" thickness, then saw it in half, and resticker and dry. and then mill it to get some 3/4 stock? If the log is nicely centered no problem, but that will be the rare piece.
I will try it both ways, this going to be a steep learning curve.
Thanks for your suggestion.
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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The difference is that if the piece is 1" thick, both sides of that 1" piece will dry at approximately the same rate, so the stresses are more or less balanced. There's still a lot of pent-up stress in the wood, but because it's balanced the overall deformation is less. The outside 1" slice from a 3" piece, on the other hand, will not have dried evenly--the inner face will be much wetter than the outer face, and so further drying will result in uneven stresses and more deformation.
Having said all of that, I understand that mesquite is exceptionally difficult to dry, so I think you're going to have to sticker the planks in a way that allows for plenty of air circulation, and put some heavy weights on top of the stack to keep the wood flat as it dries.
-Steve
A quick back of the envelope calculation indicates the weight of an 8' long, 14 inch log (couldn't find mesquite so assumed it is close in density to sugar maple) is about 600 pounds. The reason that both chain saw mills and small hand held bandsaws exist is that it is much easier to move the lightest weight instead of the heaviest. I have resawn 4' maple logs up to about 10" in diameter on my 18 inch bandsaw using the sled described in the American Woodworker article. However, anything larger than that I slab with my used RipSaw using my small tractor to lift it onto short saw horses. I'm 66 and I can still manage the 70 pound bandsaw but it is very difficult for me to lift a 100+ pound log on a sled onto the bandsaw table to resaw it keeping it level even with infeed and outfeed supports. You can buy a chainsaw mill adaptor for about $200 to resaw logs but you still need the chainsaw (preferably a relatively large one). The caveats about sawing thick slabs, trying to dry them quickly, and then splitting them again are the voice of experience. Also, the ends need to be sealed with either a good coating of paint or Anchor Seal wax to minimize the splitting and warping. I can cut 4/4 cherry and maple that has been end coated, put it in my barn attic and have it dry to <10% moisture inside of 6-9 months (a summer and winter in NH). However, I have never been successful with 8/4 slabs trying to do the same thing. They just dry too rapidly and inevitably twist and split. You should go ahead and try some of your ideas. We hope they will work but there is a fairly steep learning curve here. By the way, there is a website at Arborist.com devoted to small milling operations including chain saw mills. There is a lot of good information there.
AEW
Sage advice. I will check out the arborist site, your chainsaw mill sounds like a much easier idea. A couple of questions, you have a log mounted onto your sawhorses, but I can't quite picture how the mill travels down the log with out cutting the sawhorse. Most of the mills I have seen mount on top of the log and run the saw blade vertical. Does yours work horizontal? What type of chain do you recomend?
The nice thing about this web site, is avoiding dumb mistakes. Dumb questions are a lot easier to lift :>)
Thanks for your reply
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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AZMO,
Check this out: http://www.granberg.com/
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob, that is the ticket. More tools to buy!
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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If you are hoping to use this would soon (in a year or less), I would concur with others to not cut 3" slabs, I would cut 4/4 or 5/4, sticker and clamp, weight or strap (racket straps work great, keep tightening as it dries)it down on a level surface. As mentioned you have plenty of heat, but I would recommend that you stack it out of the sun (I a guessing you have not risk of mold that is a problem in the east if there isn't enough air movement). If you look around this site, you will see mention of what happens to wood that dries too fast.
Don't let any of this scar you off, making your own lumber isn't that hard, and besides the risk is low (free wood and your time) vs. the reward (making furniture with lumber you also made) is very high.
You might check out this forum, for info. on chainsaw mills and other milling.
http://www.arboristsite.com/forumdisplay.php?f=62
Have fun.
Randy
My RipSaw is actually a portable, hand held bandsaw mill which uses a chainsaw power head to drive it. It is arranged so it cuts horizontally. Google "RipSaw" and you will find the information on them. I bought mine used for half the current price. It was in perfect shape having been owned by a older fellow who had cut cedar with it to build canoes. I don't think he used it much.In any case, it cuts on the horizontal plane by riding on an aluminum beam that is fastened to the top of the log. You take off the first slab, turn the log 90 degrees, take off the second, and doing so again, remove the third and fourth to prepare a square or rectangular cant. Then it is easy to begin to resaw at whatever thickness you need. Once you have a flat side to reference, you no longer need the aluminum beam, the RipSaw will ride on the flat surface of the cant. If you arrange things correctly, the log is arranged on a slight angle and you saw down hill to get some advantage from gravity. On the Arborist milling site, search on "Woodshop" who is located in PA and has posted pictures and much excellent advice on a small hobby operation he has to resaw urban and suburban logs that he gets for free. He is a very smart and ingenious man who has taught me a lot about resawing on the cheap. He actually uses a chainsaw mill to prepare the cants and then uses the RipSaw to resaw; his argument being that the bark and dirt in the bark cause quick dulling of the bandsaw blade. He is right of course but since the bandsaw blades cost about $16 and can be manually resharpened once or twice, I haven't invested in another chainsaw. For my purposes, the RipSaw works fine. I have a 90 acre woodlot in NH and have access to all the cherry, maple, ash, and birch I will use in my lifetime. Be aware that once you start doing these kinds of things, it is very addicting and it is easy to justify a lot of equipment. After the mill comes the kiln, a bigger mill, etc. But so what?
Alan,
This reference is for a store-bought rig, but it may give you some ideas.
http://www.woodshopdemos.com/bs-3.htm
Hope this helps,
Harry
I always just make a sacrificial sled from the scrap bin. A couple of plywood or mdf scraps screwed together with some braces to forma right angle. You can then screw through the upright wing of the sled into the log to hold it in place for the first cuts. The edge on the table is guided by your fence.
Alan
I don't know if someone mentioned this already, as I haven't read all the posts. So, if it's redundant, then ignore it.
Assuming you'll cut the log into sections that will fit under your guide (resaw height), I used to use two pieces of plywood, and make an L shaped jig. Screw the log section to the vertical piece of this jig, and set your fence, allowing for drift, to desired thickness. Now, using the flat part of the jig to reference against the fence, start slicing. The jig references against the fence, giving you a well sliced board, and each cut you make removes the same thickness of the jig, exposing fresh plywood to ride along the fence, and so on, and so on.....until you get to the end of the log.
Don't forget to remove the screws from log before getting to the last board so you don't destroy your blade.
The jig is consumed, but hey, plywood is cheap compared to nicely prepped lumber.
Jeff
Jeff,
That was suggested and some nice sites that show this being done. I am trying to do this to a 500lb 9 to 10 ft 14" log. I am going to give your method a try on some shorter logs.
The RipSaw seems to be a solid answer for a guy with a wood lot, at 2K I am going to need a few more logs to justify the investment. Need to see if this mesquite wood is worth the effort. I suspect it will be and there goes more of my retirement fund...
AZMO <!----><!----><!---->
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AZMO
You can forget about pushing a 500 lb 10 foot log through a woodworking bandsaw. It's no designed for it, and you'll probably hurt yourself and the saw.
You should try and find a local sawyer with a bandmill saw in your area to take your log to. An experienced sawyer with a sawmill will whack that log up into boards in quick fashion for you. No need to buy a sawmill unless you know you'll be sawing thousands and thousands of board feet.
Jeff
Jeff,
That's how I first converted a log into lumber. That was back in high school. I build my resawing jig just as you suggested and screwed the log in so it wouldn't roll. Then through the school's 20" bandsaw it went. As the cut progressed, other students started watching. Cutting a log into boards was a first in shop class, as most of the wood used is already slabbed. When I finished cutting, I asked one of the others if they thought that what I had done was impressive. His reply was: "Not so much, but you almost had a fire going there." I had been so concentrated on sawing straight (which I had done splendidly), I forgot about the screws I drove in and cut right through them. Fortunately, it didn't hurt the blade.
Ah, good times...Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
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