Replies

1. 
   davidweaver | Apr 01, 2010 12:14pm | #1

   For all but the 120, a 400

   For all but the 120, I'd use a 400 grit atoma with a rubber base.

   For the 120, whatever you can find that's coarse. I've never had a lot of luck with coarse stones, ceramic or otherwise (I have a shapton 220, and had a norton 220), but don't let what you use to flatten the 120 influence your decision on what to flatten with the others.

   If you google "Atoma 400 grit", you'll find a seller in japan (he's actually an aussie living in japan) who sells them from japan and takes paypal. Fish around on his site a little if you go there and find the complete hone with the base.

   You may also be able to get them from alex gilmore, who owns thejapanblade.com and who sells some superb natural waterstones (some of them being otherworldly expensive).

   I have bought from both and have financial interest in neither. Both are good guys who generally use their products and know what they're selling.

   Reason I like the 400 grit Atoma over a DMT duosharp is that I think it's just nicer, it's bigger, the diamonds are arranged in a way that makes sense for truing a stone (instead of being randomly arranged on an electroplate, they are arranged in rows with adequate clearance around each diamond).

   Cost should be about $100 with a base (and the base is *very* good), same as a DMT duo that's not on sale.

   I have a DMT, a couple of chinese copies of the koyama hones (not one of the cheap chinese ones that HF sells, but a good quality copy) and two Atomas. The atomas are my favorite by a good bit so far. They're just nicer (and they're a fraction of the price of the DLRP). I am a bit miffed that they aren't brough into this country in an organized way, but I'd guess if any of the popular japanese tool importers brought them in, they'd go up in price by a lot from the $100 or so that they are.

   If you're struck by the fact that atoma calls their hones "economy grade", they're doing so only because they are not sintered plates. Sintered plates are in the $150 to $sky is the limit range. The "economy grade" atoma hone is, in my opinion and experience, tougher than the DMTs and better at holding on to its diamonds, and also faster cutting.

2. 
   9619 | Apr 01, 2010 10:03pm | #2

   A DMT Diamond stone (Black = about 200 grit)

   Mel

3. 
   derekcohen | Apr 01, 2010 10:15pm | #3

   Hi Bart

   Firstly, return the 120 grit stone or, if already used, tuck it away at the back of a drawer and forget you own it! It is not a good stone to own and will bring much frustration and grief. Grind on something else. Just about any stone with a rating of 400 and lower will wear very rapidly and cause the steel to go out-of-flat. My first choice is a grinder (as I prefer a hollow ground edge) or a beltsander (if you want a flat primary bevel). Alternatively, I would rather use sandpaper than a waterstone for grinding. Much more reliable.

    

   I have Pro Shaptons for a some years now - 1000/5000/8000/12000 (Mostly the 1000/5000/12000 are used).

   To flatten these I first used a 10" DMT Extra Coarse diamond stone. This is rated at 275 grit and did a great job. Quick and flat.

   After a few years I had an opportunity to try out the Shapton diamond plate, which is also rated as 275 grit. For some reason this just felt more comfortable and easier to use, as well as quicker. I cannot say why. Anyway it was expensive and I really could not justify the cost when I had a successful system.

   A year goes by and I am offered a new, unused Shapton diamond plate at a deceased estate sale. The price was too good to pass up, and so I bought it.

   Its been a couple of years since the Shapton DP came to live in my shop. The more I use it the more I like it over the DMT. However, the DMT Extra Coarse would make 99% of users very happy. I recommend it.

   There is a belief amongst some that a diamond plate will wear out on water or ceramic stones. They most certainly will eventually wear out on steel ... but not on the Shaptons. The lower grit stones are more important to have flat than the high grit stones as they are the ones shaping the steel. The high grits just refine/polish the final shape.

   Regards from Perth

   Derek

1. 
   AZMO | Apr 09, 2010 03:52pm | #7

   Stones

   Derek,

   I am sure you have used some Norton stones. How do you think they compare vs the Shapton. Speed and durablity of the stone. I find my Nortons to be pretty soft, and need to be flattened more frequent than my old1200 King Japanese stone. The 8000 stays pretty flat but the 4000 wears quick.

   Morgan

1. 
   derekcohen | Apr 11, 2010 08:55am | #9

   Hi Morgan

   Sorry to disappoint - my experience with Nortons is minimal. I used Kings prior to Shaptons. I recall that others report Nortons are a little harder than Kings.

   Regards from Perth

   Derek

1. 
   AZMO | Apr 11, 2010 02:46pm | #10

   Thanks Derek

   Shaptons are pricey little devils indeed. I will wait until the Nortons wear out and then can write up an extremely biased opinion! Ha.

4. 
   noviceneil | Apr 02, 2010 03:51pm | #4

   Shapton stones

   I use the wet/dry sandpaper 220 grit, spray adhesive to make it stick to a piece of float glass (plate  glass)...inexpensive and works perfectly on my 4000 and 8000 Shaptons

   Neil

1. 
   Bouboubomber | Apr 07, 2010 05:57pm | #5

   I used the spray adhesive once.

   Then spent way too much time cleaning the glass plate with a razor blade.

   I just squirt a bit of water on the glass plate then put the sand paper sheet on it, it holds pretty well that way.

   But then again, I dont own shapton stones!

5. 
   noviceneil | Apr 08, 2010 10:05am | #6

   sticky mess

   I haven't tried removing the paper yet so if its that hard I'll give the water method a try...although I think there's a chemical you can use to remove adhesive gunk

6. 
   Bouboubomber | Apr 10, 2010 08:07am | #8

   well, you can "not" remove

   well, you can "not" remove the sand paper, the glued one will  grip prettywell any other sandpaper you put on top, the only thing, 2 layers of paper will be a littl "soft"

7. 
   auto | Apr 12, 2010 12:39am | #11

   Thanks for all the help everyone. I ordered the 10in dmt extra coarse on line for $90. plus free shipping hopefully this will do the trick.

   Bart