The Discovery Channel program Time Warp had a segment featuring the SawStop tablesaw. It was pretty cool to watch the high speed photography of the mechanism in action, but the highlight was the demo of a real finger being used to test the saw.
PS- yet another feature that is sorely missing from FWW’s forum software, the ability to embed video.
Replies
Man, it was all I could do to watch that until the end. Even though I knew the outcome would be OK, it totally freaked me out watching a guy willing put his finger in contact with a table saw blade!
If only it were the case that all CEOs would be willing to put their finger in front of the saw blade as a measure of confidence in their own products...
In the case of table saws at least; I'm sure all other CEOs would be confident that they would have one less finger!
That's fantastic! I've downloaded it to my computer, gonna show it to my friend who cut off the tip of his finger a couple months ago.
yeah that will make him feel better... "see what you could have avoided if you just..." :)
His lady-friend (my dressage trainer) tried to talk him into a SawStop. He has no idea how it works, doesn't delve into these things. I think he'll be interested. He already know that how he cut his finger was a dumb move, so I doubt I can make him feel any worse, LOL!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
AND - he has seven more fingers and two thumbs still at risk.Frosty"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
I am NOT going to watch it. Can't do it!
Rich
You and me both brother! This is just like the QA guy drinking the effluent from a wastewate treatment plant to show how "pure "it is. Don't care, not me. This tool is a wonderful invention, however, I have no plans to ever buy one. I think of it as a rather complicated high tech guard. I hate the idea of getting sloppy in my safety procedures on the chance that this saw will save me from a stupid mistake. What if it doesn't. I'm OK w my old Craftsman and new Grizzly old fashioned saws.
Two things I noticed.
1. The saw used to cut the steak was the same saw. There is an on/off switch for the saw stop. Could be very bad if you turned it of to cut wet wood and forgot to turn it back on and had become to dependent of the stop.
2.He didn't run his finger through the blade as they described, he very carefully and slowly came in from the side. He may be confident but he's not stupid.
Jack
I was wondering about the steak.He still gets credit in my book for sticking his finger in a spinning saw blade.
All saws should have this. Still, I haven't traded my PM66 in yet but the Sawstop cabinet saw looks really good... too bad it's made in China....
So freakin' what? Actually, to be precise, it is manufactured in Taiwan. A subtle difference politically, maybe, more of a difference in terms of average quality of manufacturing I suspect. I don't think there's any doubt that the SawStop is an excellent saw, brake or no brake, so country of origin doesn't have any relevance.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
c, Would it be any easier for you if the Chinese built a plant here in the states and made them in your home town ?
Don't get me wrong I know that soon the health risks and problems associated with defective C###a products will come to an end as the U.S. sets some restrictions or rules would even be nice . I think the SS is built to strict standards more so then just any others made there because it is made to SS specs .
I use a fair amount of sheet goods , and hardwood plywood but , I will NOT use any C###a ply in my product . Let's hope the price of transportation will make those products no longer economical , maybe a few domestic plywood mills will re open or crank up production once we get commerce back .
dusty
I'm not sure what the fuss over sticking your finger in the blade of a Sawstop is all about. The blade break makes the action absolutely safe to do as it is "fool"-proof. No high tech computer chip has ever been defective and no reason to think that one could be manufactured that is. Just ask NASA... Brilliant....!
Or would brilliant be better described by using a completely covered blade that would not allow you to be able to stick your finger into a spinning blade to test? I suppose I'm just old fashioned in my thinking and not in touch with the real world as we know it. Yep.. that must be the case. ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Sarge...
who is out of touch with high tech but yet didn't fall off a turnip truck yesterday..
Edited 11/24/2008 5:20 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Bet you don't wear seat belts either...won't even ask about air bags.Cheers,Peter
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
And I'll bet that you wear yours and crash your car into trees and bridge abuttments regularly to test them.
................................................
Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
Thank you sir... I could have paid consultants to say it better.
Sarge..
Sarge & Don,I wisht to be your paid consultant. Please send lots of dollahs and I will send you some good advice in the form of circumloquacious and even flowery prose. Of course, it may on a subject in which you have no interesst; and the term "good" is relative, as you know.I need the money for Certain Objects concerning which I have developed a fetish. Happily they are safe and require no airbag or electronic brake, although it is wise not to wear one's slippers in the shed, as I often do. (I am a forgetful old phart). I forget the rate of acceleration due to gravity, for example; (it may be 981 cm/sec/sec though - a strange brain-circuit just mentioned it). In all events, whatever it is it's is sufficient to transfer a lot of kinetic energy from the dropped fetish object into one's second toe on the left, should it topple from bench to the region of the slipper. Them objects have a great deal of mass and hence momentum, when dropping. They are best left with the potential energy unrealised, unless it goes horizontally across a plank.Incidentally, all the above seems like good advice so I may expect the fee any minute......?Lataxe, looking to see if you have a watch on to borrow.
Lataxe,
Your numbers are all wrong. This side of the ocean it's 32ft/sec/sec. These are the numbers real scientists use. I know this from my uncle, who served in a British Thermal Unit, back during the war.
Ray
edit to add: I understand your predeliction for offering your foot as a sacrifice to prevent various shiny, brass and steel fetish-objects from getting dinked by hitting the shed floor. I've done it mesel' betimes. Dented feet will heal eventually, but those dents and gashes in the brass are a painful reminder forever.
Edited 11/26/2008 10:04 am ET by joinerswork
Ray,Wisely, you remark: ".....offering your foot as a sacrifice to prevent various shiny, brass and steel fetish-objects from getting dinked....".Yes indeed! My advice to new sprogletts joining the cycle club was always: "If you should fall off (and you will, quite soon now) you must thrust your nice squashy little person between the expensive Campagnolo and the nasty gravel. Gravel-rash is character-forming and soon heals, perhaps with an interesting scar that will enamour the ladyfolk. Also, the Campagnolo costs many pound notes and any damage requiring another trip to the bike shop will displease even your doting parents, who will give me dark glances as though I caused you to wobble or catch that back wheel you were grovelling on".Naturally, being callow youths, they took no notice and would crash bike, body and all into a drystone wall instead.I imagine you would do the same with that Injun? (Gravel-rash yersel not drystone wall-it, I mean).Lataxe, careful of the machinery.
Lataxe, o wise one,
The instructor at my 'cycle safety class said, among other things,"There are two kinds of motorcycle riders: those who have already fallen off, and those who are about to fall off.
I have some o' those scars you mention, (I keep most of my scars in a c'gar box). Indeed I acquired some of that road rash whilst falling off the Chief, along with a broken wrist, and other assorted physical bad things. Whether it was intentional or not, I cannot say. Like the snail said about being assaulted by the tortoise, "It all happened so fast..." As I recall there was a faulty side-stand, a sharp curve, and a guard-rail involved. An Injun-stop--that's what was needed.Truth to tell, tho, in my life story my psychic scars are far worse than the physical ones. But that is another tale, for another time.
Cheerio,
Ray
Edited 11/26/2008 6:48 pm ET by joinerswork
>> who served in a British Thermal Unit, back during the war.
That must have been in the Cold War?
Ben,
I stole that line from the late great Steve Allen, he used it during the cold war, so who knows?
Hey Steverino, how's yer bird?
Ray
Checks in the mail but I'm not sure why? The blade brake is merely a fix for a problem that basically didn't exist until someone decides to take off the shield and splitter that they find in-convenient to hurry and create a problem of large proportions.
The theory appears... take off $50 worth of equipment and exclaim that you have a very dangerous situation. Blame in on the manufacturers lack of concern and creativity. Then fix it with a solution that cost only $1500 give or take with a high tech moisture meter. One that is so fool-proof (?) that you can stick your finger in it all day long a $150 a pop (blade and brake guessing) without any concern at all. Not to mention the torque placed on bearings.. casting caused by the abrupt jolt that incurs when tripped.
Now... if you want to earn your money.. invent a safety device that would be more geared for a real problem. The worst injury I have had in going on 39 years is I bumped an Ashley Isles off my work-bench and instinctively tried to catch it. Even though the duct tape and gauge pad held well until I could finish my work before driving off in the sun-set to my local health care provider for the 6 stitches.
So.. how about you coming up with a chisel that will defy gravity and float around harmlessly until you retrieve it. Or.. I have several other ideas that might be suitable so contact me if you run out of fresh idea's of your own. ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
I know... SS folks hate me but.... it's OK.
Have a good day my friend...
Sarge..
Edited 11/26/2008 10:52 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
Well Sarge,Being as how I yam perfect and never makes mistakes, same as you, I may not need that SS brake. Of course, my guard, featherboards and hold-downs are always on my saw (except when they're not). Well, they aren't there on very rare occasions, so you needn't be worryin' about me. :-)Now then. I have noticed that other humans are not so purfek as us two. Why, they take off the guard just because they can and also waggle the wood about as they feed it - with their great mit!! All the while they are thinking about the girl next door or possibly the bacon sandwich they hope to have for tea.So, we must allow them Sawstop men to sell the foolproof-brake saw to them fools, even though thee and me know we would never be so stupid (except when we are).Lataxe, just counting his fingers again to make sure.PS I am experimenting with helium-filled ballons and the chisels.
Discipline.. discipline.. discipline... if you ain't got it and can't seem to quite get a handle on it.. you probably need a SS. You should probably stay away from Marine boot camp and you don't need to gamble as gambling requires well.... discipline!
The difference between professional gambler and amateur is the amateur doesn't know when to quit either when ahead or behind. And that requires discipline....
Off to my shop under the main structure to build yet another safety device of low cost scrap while waiting for finish to cure. Regardless of todays task or tomorrows new adventure.... safety rules and discipline rules safety!... ha.. ha...
Regards...
Sarge..
Edited 11/26/2008 1:43 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge,Discipline, discipline .....? Is that something like "work"? I don't believe I care for either of them modes.Gambling. I yam too mean to gamble as I will want my money back even if it's just half a dollar. I spent a week in Las Vegas once an' nivver put one cent in a machine nor anywhere else. Is that discipline? (No, it is that mean streak). The fud was cheap and I enjoyed Red Rock Canyon and similar "countryside" round about.Marine Boot camp. Is this where poor innocent teenagers are abused by shouty men and made to run about a lot? I don't mind the running about, although a bicycle is more efficient. I am not good with shouty men, though, and would only find a way to have their vocal chords removed. Also, I might ask questions, which I understand is Not Allowed.****Now then: have you ceased to take all risks, no matter how pleasurable? I was going to offer to take you on the back of a tandem down Fleet Moss, having arranged to gamble on who would make a wild grasp for his brake lever first. :-)Lataxe, who only sucuumbs to the discipline of the ladywife, especially if she has the uniform on.
"Now then: have you ceased to take all risks, no matter how pleasurable?" .... Lataxe
Nah... not all risks. I did give up sky-diving after jump 389.. dirt bike riding and down-hill skiing but that was because of knees. So... even though I take smaller risk now as I have grown older I still take small non-injury risk every day to supplement the income. Along with WW it keeps me busy and out of trouble
Simply knowiing when to quit when either ahead or behind .. well along with a 100% knowledge of the game.. money management and a bank-roll set aside strickly for the daily chore. And without any one of those you will likely fail in the end... but you can have all three of the above mentioned but without discipline.. you are doomed from the very start.. :>)
Wager details for ticket number 51103458-1:
Wager Type:
Parlay (4 team)
Wager Status:
Win
Risk / To Win Amount:
5.00 / 60.39 (USD) Accepted 11/22/2008 9:58 PM - EST
Won:
60.39
Amount Paid:
65.39
Item #1
Wager Type:
Spread
Outcome:
Win
Sport / Period:
NFL Football / Game ( Carolina Panthers: 28 - Atlanta Falcons: 45 )
Line:
Atlanta Falcons 11/23/2008 1:00:01 PM - (EST)-1 -110
* Event Notes:
TIME CHANGE
Item #2
Wager Type:
Spread
Outcome:
Win
Sport / Period:
NFL Football / Game ( New York Giants: 37 - Arizona Cardinals: 29 )
Line:
New York Giants 11/23/2008 4:15:01 PM - (EST)-3 -120
Item #3
Wager Type:
Spread
Outcome:
Win
Sport / Period:
NFL Football / Game ( Indianapolis Colts: 23 - San Diego Chargers: 20 )
Line:
Indianapolis Colts 11/23/2008 8:15:01 PM - (EST)+2½ -110
Item #4
Wager Type:
Spread
Outcome:
Win
Sport / Period:
College Football / 2nd Half ( Texas Tech: 21 - Oklahoma: 65 )
Line:
Oklahoma 11/22/2008 8:00:01 PM - (EST)pk +100
* Event Notes:
TIME CHANGE
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
When in doubt... hedge at half-time...
Sarge..
who is a small risk taker looking for larger dividends... :>)
Sarge,
While at Parris Island attending my oldest son's graduation from USMC boot camp, I picked up a tee shirt at the BX that said:
"Dis.cip.line: n. Doing what you ought to do, not what you want to do."
Ray
No other branch executes discipline to the degree the Marines do, Ray. You probably know that as your son was a Scout Sniper and from my experience working with them.. Scout Snipers probably execute discipline with even more intensity than any other group in that branch. It was either execute or "be executed".
Most would not understand the level of intense discipline I refer to here. So.. kudo's to your son achievements even in his short life span as that honor follows you to the grave. I assure you it was earned and cannot be taken away by death do us part.
Highest regards to your distinquished son and his distinquished family...
Sarge..
Edited 11/26/2008 8:28 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Thanks Sarge. Your words mean a lot to me.
Accept my best wishes to you and yours for a Happy Thanksgiving.
Ray
Now, how did you know that?
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
It was on the news and in all the papers.....
................................................
Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
I don't get out much.
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
Yes I do Peter but D. Green said the rest..
Sarge..
No high tech computer chip has ever been defective and no reason to think that one could be manufactured that is. Just ask NASA... Brilliant....!
One thing about the Sawstop that has always impressed me is the simplicity of the mechanism. Comparing it to a space shuttle, isn't a true representation...
Anyway, I've read all your threads and I believe if people followed your lead in table saw safety the drop in table saw accidents would be dramatic. You ideas also highlight that table saw safety need not cost us $4000+.
In the end I do believe that Sawstop has it place, but it isn;t the be all end all of table saw safety.
Buster
No matter how simple Buster.. anything with moving parts that was assembled by someone can be defective. And I agree that the Sawstop has it's place. For those that refuse to use any safety devices for whatever reason... and insist on passing hands close to the blade.. probably the best $4 K they ever spent other than getting a power feeder which is cheaper and will also eliminate kick-back injury which a SS won't.
And thanks for the compliments on saw safety but it is just plain old common sense without the need for high tech.l
Sarge..
The brake resets every time you turn on the saw, so you can't forget it. If you needed to cut a lot of PT or wet wood, or metal with the saw I suspect it would get tiresome.
Credit to the guy, but I also noticed that he does the hot dog demo with a lot more exuberance and confidence than he did with his finger.
based on the dialogue, it would appear that was the first time he stuck his finger in the saw instead of the hot dog.
To relax he goes home and plays russian roulette.
................................................
Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
All,
Some time ago, I saw the video where the guy who came up with the idea for Kevlar bulletproof vests put one on and took a pistol slug from about 10 feet away. Now that's confidence in your product!
Ray
Ray , Yeah it's like sticking your hand down the garbage disposal after you re wired the switch for the light and disposal and your wife wants to turn on the light . Did I do it right ?
dusty, was a plumber on his day off
Hey you are supposed to have finger in the light socket at the same time... Yur killin me Dusty, jus plain killin me.....
Why test your Air Bag unless you really need to?
Morgan 10 digits strong <!----><!----><!---->
-----------_o
---------_'-,>
-------(*)/ (*) http://www.EarthArtLandscape.com
I have a video somewhere (VHS) of ballistic vest demonstrations. The wearer takes multiple 45 rounds in the chest at point blank range with no harm. It also shows a vest with hard plates that they demonstrate taking a 308 Winchester, 7.62 NATO, round at 2 feet while standing on one foot. It takes a lot of faith in your product to do something like that. I do know that some of the lighter vests hit by magnum cartridge rounds at close range produce enough shock trauma, not penetration, to cause large bruises or even heart stoppage if you are hit in just the right location. It would be better to be bruised than dead!
Bruce"A man's got to know his limitations." Dirty Harry Calahan
JLMcD,I saw that, too (re: the Bataan death march to the saw blade) but I don't fault him at all. The usual hot dog demonstration was at a fair cutting pace, and the 'injury' was incidental. Were Mr. Gass to run his finger into the blade at the same pace as the hot dog, he would no doubt have been cut, the usual bleeding to follow. Visible blood, no matter how minor the cut, inspires zero confidence in the buying public, who are too used to grass stains magically erased from pure white soccer shirts.I do think it's shameful arrogance that Jet/Powermatic, Delta, et. al. have not negotiated licensing agreements with Gass. Yes, the history of Saw Stop is rooted in Gass's aggressive activist litigation (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5441114), not a nice way to be invited to a birthday party. The prevalence of crumple zones, seat belts, air bags and anti lock brakes is such that CEOs of tool companies would find the sitation unacceptable to drive to work in a vehicle that was engineered without these features. Note to tool companies - get over it.Cheers,Seth
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled