I have an older model PM66 that worked flawlessly for years. Had to pick up and move into a new shop. After setting it up in the new shop, and making sure that the miter slots are aligned, did a test cut and now the saw is pulling the board forward on the cut into the blade and throwing it forward. Measuring with the same tooth on the front of the fence and the back shows the same distance. Even replaced the complete arbor assembly with a brand new one to rule out the arbor. Anybody have any ideas?
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Replies
Wow, what direction is the blade turning?
Blade is installed correctly. That was my first thought.
Sounds like the blade is spinning in the wrong direction.
Is this a 3 phase motor ?
3 phase, but I'm in Europe so no issue with the phases.
Yes there is, the 3 phase motor rotation is dictated by the wiring of each phase and can be reversed.
+1 for Gulfstar's explanation.
Given: Everything was working until PM66 3 Phase was moved to a new shop then problem occurred. As others have surmised physics of motor running backwards resulting in wood being "pulled towards outfeed".
Occam's razor: focus on simplist cause. Table saw and motor are the same as prior to move. Table saw was working until moved to new shop. Wiring in new shop is different.
Did you move south of the equator? ;-)
Can you post a YouTube video?
Not to insult your intelligence, but have you tried a different blade?
I would go through another complete alignment check.
Not it, but many recommend setting the fence .003" wider at the back of the blade rather than parallel.
Not something funny like a reverse on the motor, is there?
Changed blades, same result. Shimmed it so that the fence is out about .003 in the back. Same thing. I’m beginning to wonder if the motor shaft is bent. This thing is driving me crazy.
You say that it is pulling and throwing the work piece "forward". I assume by that you mean toward the out feed side of the table. I can't think of anything that would cause that except for the blade rotating in the wrong direction. I have no idea how that can happen except something about the motor that has caused it to reverse direction. Is that even possible? Was the motor removed when the machine was moved? Was it properly re-wired?
There is no way to reverse a single phase(can't speak to 3 phase) AC induction motor through connections to the AC supply. Unlike DC current there is no polarity in AC so reversing motors is no easy task and involves reversing some combination of the the starter windings and or capacitor wiring depending on the style of motor and is not likely to have occurred in a routine move.
That is what I thought, but I can not think of any other cause for what the OP seems to describe. The questions you ask below will hopefully help clear it up.
Your description of the problem leaves much to interpretation so maybe we can clear up some of the terminology.
"the saw is pulling the board forward on the cut into the blade"
Does this mean the blade is grabbing the board and throwing it out the back of the saw away from the user?
---Or---
Are you really saying it is grabbing the board and throwing it to the front of the saw as in traditional kickback?
Is this occurring using the rip fence? Miter gauge? Both?
You never mentioned aligning the rip fence. Have you also checked that the rip fence is parallel or slightly open in relation to the blade?
To clarify, it is not traditional kickback.
It is grabbing the board as it is being fed and shooting it forward from the infeed side (away from the user). I'll have to test it with the miter gauge since I didn't thing to test it with it. The rip fence is aligned with the blade with the back of the fence being slightly out (.003) according to a dial indicator. The miter slots are parallel to the blade (at least as good as I can get with a starrett square.
I've tried with several blades and the same thing happens with all of them.
The only way that can happen is your blade is spinning in reverse. I just can't see how a blade spinning in the correct direction could defy every law of physics and pull a board in a direction opposite of its rotation.
You say it's and old PM66 is there a splitter or riving knife installed?
How much of a breakdown of the saw was done for the move? Was the motor removed at all? Was the power cord changed? This defies all logic but there must be a cause.
MakeItYourself,
Others have said it above ^^^^^^^^
Your 3 phase motor is spinning in reverse.
It's an easy fix.
Mike
Curious.
The problem is not very well described in that it lacks lots of information about various physical basics of the situation that the OP could easily observe. Here's a description from the OP's own posts:
".....now the saw is pulling the board forward on the cut into the blade and throwing it forward".
"To clarify, it is not traditional kickback.
It is grabbing the board as it is being fed and shooting it forward from the infeed side (away from the user)".
"I've tried with several blades and the same thing happens with all of them".
Additional required info that the OP could supply:
* Is the blade going backwards?
* Is the blade mounted the right way around on the arbour (teeth facing the sawyer)?
Does the blade cut the wood as it "grabs" the board?
Does the board go up and over the top of the blade or through the blade (remaining on the saw table top)?
It would be startling if the OP hasn't noticed the blade going backwards or being mounted the wrong way on the arbour, eh? If neither of those is the case ...........
Lataxe
You guys are getting punked.
You are probably right. Solution? Switch feed sides. There, all better.
I agree that this is probably a joke, the simple physics involved would not allow any explanation for wood being pulled away from the operator feeding it into the blade except if the blade was spinning the wrong way. Doesn't matter what blade you use or if it was mounted with the teeth facing the wrong way, whether you are using a rip fence or miter gauge, or how anything is adjusted - there is simply no force of any kind to push it away from the operator.
If it was truly the case that the change in the 3-phase power source was the culprit, it's hard to believe anyway that any reasonably experienced woodworker owning a Powermatic table saw wouldn't see the blade coming to a rest while spinning in the wrong direction. If this isn't a joke, it's scary to think that this person is operating power equipment.
Issue was solved, see post # 17
Finally resolved it. Believe it or not, it wasn't the saw. New workshop with 3 phase outlet already installed. The phases were switched in the outlet itself. Something I never thought to check. Thanks for all of the assistance guys.
Great that it is fixed! Thank you for posting the resolution.
Enjoy your new shop.
Just curious, you didn't notice, or check, that the blade was spinning backwards? ;-)
Honest to God, didn't think about it until it the light bulb went on reading a comment. It also never dawned on me to check inside the breaker panel for a swapped wire for the phase...
I moved and re-started numerous 3 phase machines and having all 3 phases re-connected correctly has always been left to luck, somehow electricians have never really mastered the color code and more often than other, all wires were the same color so when we hit it right the first time we would call it our lucky day. Your problem was lack of commissioning , first thing we do after wiring the machine is bumping the start button to see if we have the rotation direction we need, it’s hit or miss.
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