Personal feedback on Steel City
Do you have a Steel City tool of any kind? I am soliciting feedback from owners of these tools. I stopped by the only tool dealer on my side of the water Thursday, and found they had considered carrying SC (they now carry Jet, Powermatic, General and Shop Fox) but claimed they had heard “horror stories” and were hesitant to jump in.
These guys are always full of “horror stores” about one tool or another — the ones they don’t carry. They seem to firmly believe that if they trash the competition, it’ll help their sales. That aside, I’d love to have a place 10 miles away that carries SC, instead of having to take an expensive ferry ride, and then drive for 40 minutes to get to them. I suspect they hear said stories from the management of the big three, LOL.
So! If you have a SC tool (that’s you Sarge, of course, and others), please write me a succinct description of your opinion of the tool, how it performs, how you consider it better than the competition and/or why you chose it over others. Thanks!
forestgirl — you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can’t take the forest out of the girl 😉
Replies
Well, ...does a Steel City owned Orion made Craftsman hybrid count? It's nearly identical to the SC hybrid, and I've been very pleased with it since it was new ~ 32 months ago.
The 22124's owner's manual tech support line is the same as SC's AFAIK, and they were very helpful when I called with an assembly question. If this doesn't count, just change the text to white on white so it won't show... ;-)
Edited 1/5/2008 12:36 pm ET by Knotscott
FG,
I own the SC 18" BS and the DP, both for over a year (bought about 6 months apart).
I found them to be well made, well calibrated, and properly packed. I bought both from a local Woodcraft, and loaded them on to the back of my pickup, so I don't know about drop shipping. When I uncrated each tool, they were undamaged.
As it happens, both tools had rebate offers. Both rebates arrived in ~30 days, without any additional calls on my part. I have not had to contact customer service at SC- both tools arrived undamaged without missing parts, the manuals were fairly well written, and set-up was uneventful. Nothing has gone wrong since, so I can't comment on CS at all.
On the other hand, both have a 5 year warranty, that tells me that SC is standing behind their product. There is nothing that I have noticed with either tool that I would consider a limitation. On the contrary, they seem to be beefy, well thought out and designed, without a lot of marketing junk.
I am more satisfied with these tools than I have been with either Delta or DeWalt. I think they are good quality and good value.
Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
Jamie
Happy New Year. I own two SC tools--14" bandsaw and the benchtop mortiser. I am pleased with both. The bandsaw was purchased with the riser kit, and I had a little trouble with some of the installation. SC's customer service was spot on and very helpful. I've had a couple of questions about the mortiser, and they have helped there as well. Both tools are very well made, run great and I am going to purchase the SC 1.5 hp dust collector in a few weeks. Minor gripe with the bandsaw--the magnetic light doesn't have a strong enough magnet to hold it steady on the upper wheel housing--that and the stamping in the door housing doesn't provide a good flat place to put the light. Also, the upper guide requires holes to be drilled, but they didn't provide the drill bit. That was a little annoying, but both of these are minor gripes. Great company and great tools. I'm sold. Tom
FG,
I own 2 SC tools - the 8" jointer and the DP. Both tools were purchased from my local supplier whose customer service and attention to detail exceeded my expectations.
The 8" jointer was already assembled, all I had to do was connect the electrical cord when I got it home. The drill press was boxed up and required assembly, which went without a hitch.
The SC jointer is the first one I've owned so I have nothing to compare it against except a 16" large commercial machine used at a shop I bought "shop time" from. The SC jointer works as hoped, it makes boards flat and square. The machine starts smooth, works smooth and has a 5 year warranty - one of the main reasons I bought it! Price wise it was in the middle of the pack, but the local SC supplier's willingness to answer questions and patience with a "rookie" made me feel secure in my purchase. I have no regrets and as a result I bought the DP.
I have plans to buy a 10" 5 hp table saw when the granite riving knife version hit the market in early spring in Canada. Price was only a minor concern in my decision process, parts and service was more important!
Hopes this helps!
Bob
"I have no regrets and as a result I bought the DP." What's your take on the Steel City drill press, Bob. I looked at it last year and, though I hardly need such a beast at the moment, it seems like it had very good features. What are your likes/dislikes about it?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I have had a smaller 10" Delta benchtop and it has served me well for almost 13 years. While reassessing all of my machinery the drill press came up on the radar screen.
1) How many times did I need a larger sized drill press over the last several years? At least 2 projects forced me to use a hand held drill because the Delta 10" drill press could not handle the job. The result of using a hand held drill was poorly drilled holes that required more accuracy; hence, I had to clean up a sloppy set of holes and plugs.
2) How often did I need greater quill depth? The Delta had 2 7/8", which gave me some grief some times when using larger forstener bits - so I thought the extra quill depth would help. I drill a fair number of 1 1/2" holes with my Forstener bit and maybe the increased drill depth would be an asset. By the way I chucked in my largest bit (2 1/2" Forstener) and let loose at some 8/4 Purpleheart trying to stall the machine. The drill press slowed down slightly but it won and the Purpleheart lost! :)
3) The quill lock is a feature I don't currently have but an old machinist told me it was a definite asset and helps to keep the machine TIGHT in the future, and most machines I viewed did not have it!
4) The larger on/off paddle type switch is a nice touch when busy and all of my hands seem committed to other tasks - on occasion I have used my forehead to turn off the machine! :)
5) The table is nothing special so I added an larger one with a fence and holdowns!
6) The light is a standard machine light add-on and again nothing special.
7) Lately I have found a need on numerous times to have more room between the drill bit and the project resting on the table; therefore, a floor model drill press was the key. The SC 17" is similar to all of the other DP I looked at except the column to base connection used larger bolts that seemed more substantial than other models I looked at.
8) You can add the laser to give you one more button to play with. It works better than I expected so I find myself a little faster on repetitive tasks.
In summary FG my focus on machinery has changed over the years. Now I consider price, but quality of construction, parts and service are critical in my decision. A friend bought the SC 17" DP and had a small problem, the local rep grabbed a part off another machine in stock and had him using his machine the same day. That kind of service makes me take notice.
So in summary is the Steel City Drill press light years above the competition? No. IS it well built and has some good features? Yes! Is the price competitive for machine with similar features? Yes!!
This drill press FG will be my last in my lifetime. I feel confident that it will go the distance because it is well built. The price was fair and I fell good about the purchase.
On a side note, my 8" jointer had the nice logo on the front destroyed by a stupid moving of machines in my shop. My local SC rep had one in my hands within minutes!!!! I did not need this part for any other reason than my pride and feeling like an idiot. TO have my mistake fixed quickly proves to me that service is at the top of my local SC rep's mind and in the future he gets my business because he stands behind the SC product and I suppose SC stands behind him!
I use my machinery for personal purposes and build a few commissions per year. Machinery is maintained but never "babied". I spend my money carefully on machinery because I don't have any extra money to waste! :)
The SC 17" DP is a good machine and if I amortize $400 over 25 years, well hell it just makes sense! The warranty is nice too.
Good Luck.
"A friend bought the SC 17" DP and had a small problem, the local rep grabbed a part off another machine in stock and had him using his machine the same day. That kind of service makes me take notice."
I spoke to a one of SC's retailers and was told that one of the downsides of dealing with such a new company is that they don't have much in the way of a parts department. Therefore, if a part is needed, the only way to get one is to rob one off another machine. Please bear in mind that this is what I was told and not necessarily factual, though I do trust the source.Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Chris it is interesting that you would mention the parts supply issue, because it was one of my major concerns BEFORE I purchased my SC jointer.
My local SC supplier in Calgary is associated with a larger distribution parts center in Winnipeg, which sells FELDER equipment. When I visited the Winnipeg FELDER showroom and offices prior to buying my SC machinery, it impressed me that they had a decent parts supply for the Steel City line. I asked for some parts, which I refer to as consumables, for example a set of jointer blades, well low and behold they had both types in stock for the 8" jointer. As I enquired about other parts for the jointer, I was pleasantly surprised to learn that for most parts they had some on hand. No, I could not pick up a fence or outfeed table but I wasn't expecting it either.
The local SC supplier in Calgary does not have a huge supply of parts on hand, but it is only one day away from Winnipeg if it gets put on the bus or courier! I have noticed that trucks roll in weekly to my local SC supplier with larger shipments - those 8" jointer seem to sell like hotcakes! :):)
I have a larger Italian made bandsaw and parts for it are available but you can't walk into the supplier and expect to get anything immediately! They will order it for you and it does take time - so I have learned to keep some consumables on hand.
So to anyone considering buying a SC product, the machines themselves are good, well designed BUT it all revolves around your local supplier. Check them out and see if they have at least the consumable parts on hand such as a spare set of jointer knives! The horror stories spoke about regarding SC parts are no different than some of the other machinery lines that have been around for years, which seem to take an inordinate amount of time to have their local repair shops fix a popular machine because parts are on BACKORDER!!!! All I know that if I am in a bind regarding something I need to get my SC machines up and running the local supplier does not hand me a line of B--LSH--, he does the right thing by getting me parts ASAP and gets me out the door - what more can anyone ask of a supplier?
Price cannot be the only consideration when buying a machine - SERVICE and QUALITY are key issues. Even good machinery breaks down, the key factor is how are you dealt with by the dealer!!!!
Have a GREAT DAY!!
"Therefore, if a part is needed, the only [emph. added] way to get one is to rob one off another machine." That seems a little extreme. I think the "local rep" just wanted to have a happy customer as quickly as possible, and did what he could to get there. He could fix up the now-defective floor model later. Funny that the customer thought that was great Steel City customer service as, in reality, it had nothing to do with the manufacturer and everything to do with the local store.
Steel City's customer service was excellent in the one occasion I've had to use it, and that did involve replacing a part -- the motor on the second mortiser I bought. The capacitor was bad on the mortiser, but they don't replace that separately, they sent the whole motor, immediately, and shipped it directly to my friend who was buying the mortiser from me.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Edited 1/6/2008 11:11 am by forestgirl
FG
I expect my local rep to handle the machinery problems on behalf of Steel City. If Steel City has given the local rep a franchise or product line, then they have given them the power to act on behalf of the company that made the machine.
Having been invloved with large companies and automated inventories, it takes time for any system to intuitively "learn" what inventory levels are required to meet national and regional demands. This is especially trying on a new product intorduction let alone a new company launch.
I have no respect or patience for that matter, when some of the larger machine companies give me the standard line that parts are on order only to be told one week later that parts are backordered from Asia, Italy or ...
Customer service starts at the local store or retailer and those local managers that go the extra distance to make a customer's day a productive day wins the business in the long run. When I was young and foolish I DID NOT appreciate that statement, but I sure as hell do now. My machinery purchases are based on product quality, service, parts availablity and price - price is last!
So if I have a machinery down and I go into the local rep or supplier only to see 6 new shiny machines on the floor and I am told "sorry your part is on backorder and it will take 5 weeks" - NO GOOD ENOUGH!! Every where in a supply chain I have ever been associated with, it is not the computer that dictates customer service it is the local manager and the company philosophy. The computer tells me how fast I can satisfy my client's needs, but if parts availablility is too long for reasonable customer satisfaction, then you have no alternative except to strip a machine and meed the customers needs. Those companies that will not strip a new machine on the floor or warehouse cannot speak of SERVICE - they have no right to use those words.
If any company builds a product they have damn well better back it with service OR sell on price only and screw the customer! Sorry for the rant but I get real upset when companies do not meet customer demands for parts and service. There is simply no excuse!
IMO the local rep is the Steel City Company in the client's eyes. And I suspect that just like other top rated service companies such LV and LN, Scott Box expects the customer to get action and not verbage - that is the only way to keep customers satisfied!!
I better shut up because I am repeating myself.
Have a great day!
Bob
And Questtools has nailed the philosophy of Steel City. With start up of a new machine line.. you are going to have fast moving parts (belts.. knives... bearings... etc.) that can be stocked now as there is no doubt they will be necessary in the near future.
But.. can you tie up major cash in keeping inventory with fences.. etc. etc. that would not normally be an issue unless a factory defect or damage in shipping. The answer is no with such a large line of tools. So.. how does Steel City deal with say a cracked table top on a machine that was dropped in shipment?
They rob one from inventory and then order a replacement from the factory which will take time to get from Asia. They replace the part in inventory when it arrives after they ship the robbed one to the customer. And they note what part it was and if it becomes a consistent issue, then that part becomes a fast moving part and it will be stocked. If it is by defect.. the design team has a definitive look and changes the design to avoid the issue in the future.
But.. Steel City distributors are aware of the situation and if robbing their floor machine can be done to satisfy the customer Today... rob it from one in stock if there is one.. and then turn around and call Steel City who replaces the part they robbed.
The customer is satisfied and he comes back as a repeat. The distributor is happy as Steel City backs them and replaces on the robbee. Steel City is happy as they don't have to strap cash flow with expensive parts that are not considered to be fast moving that are going to wear out.
A win-win-win scenario is created all the way from the customer who is relied on to exist to the top of the company who gambles in a very competitive market that they can take a piece of that market share.. recover initial capital investment and expand their reputation and profit in days to come.
I like Win-Win-Win... What do you like is the question?
Ya'll have a good day...
Sarge..
I've bought three SC items from various woodshows and have been impressed for the most part with them.
In October '06, I bought their variable-speed midi lathe (2 two-step pulleys and electronic variable speed). It was a good deal at $400 cdn. I've put it to good use and have had a few minor problems and complaints. When you open the door to access the belts, the door grazes the variable speed knob. The toolrest and live center are both locked by repositionable gyratory locking levers which were cheap. They were unable to adequately secure the toolrest and were quickly stripped. SC did provide me with another which met the same fate as the first. I think I'll have to buy an aftermarket locking knob. Just now the on/off switch has stopped working. It's probably just dust in the switch - I don't know why it wouldn't be sealed!
About 9 months ago, I bought their 17" drill press. I really liked the idea of a 6" quill stroke and still do today. It saves me moving the table up and down constantly. My only complaint is that the belt tensioning lever is too close to the three arms (the things you pull on to move the quill downwards). If you are not careful, you can catch your knuckles. I contacted SC and they said that they are aware of the problem and that they are working on a solution.
Last fall I picked up their mini dust collector. The included 30 micron bag is useless. It just throws more of those harmfull dust particles into the air than without it. When used with a jointer, it clogs up in a heartbeat. I fixed it by removing the "grate", probably there to protect the impellor. It also has the whine of a router. But I am happy with it. I hook one end up to the machine I am using (jointer, planer or table saw) and the other end to a 4" hose leading to my dust collector. It works much better than the dust collector alone.
Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Forestgirl, I have their 1.5h dust collector and their shaper. Both are well made. The shaper tipped over while I was turning into my drive, and fell onto the front edge of the top, on the wooden floor of my trailer. After my heart started beating again, I inspected it, and the only problem was one of the fence hold-downs was bent on the screw shaft. I contacted my dealer, and had a new one in a few days.
I'd buy SC again with no hesitation.
Jerry
I won't go into any personal details as to the quality.. engineering.. fair pricing.. service after the sale.. warranty and innovation of Steel City and there machines as I have already chronicled those thoughts in the archives here and on two other web sites.
I had a question about something that someone asked me today and I had forgotten a detail. How good is the service after the sale? I called Scott Box (VP of Steel City) and left a message and the question on his cell phone as he was working the WW show in Baltimore. He called back in about 15 minutes with an answer and apologized as he had customers at the time I called.
My suggestion would be to ask your locals that told you they had heard "horror stories" pinpoint just what the horror story are. If you will do that.. send me a message or post them and I do believe that I could put out the fire in a moment without the use of a fire extinguisher or setting a back-fire. I have a strange feeling that if you do that.. the horror stories might just back-fire on them! ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Regards...
Sarge..
Edited 1/5/2008 9:10 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
I related the story of the Steel City hollow chisel mortise machine to you in a previous post. Definitely not a horror story, but, I really don't see that they are any different than the rest (Delta, Jet, Grizzly etc.). It's just the same ol same ol, if you ask me. I'm waiting for some real innovations and a step up in quality that is worthy of the high prices I'm paying for tools. I could be waiting a long time.
Bob, Tupper lake, NY
Edited 1/6/2008 8:45 am ET by salamfam
"I could be waiting a long time." Probably true, Bob, given your definition of "innovative." Their bench-top mortiser, at the time it was introduced, was head and shoulders above all the others in its price range. I think there may be one that's close to it now, based on what I saw at Summner a couple weeks ago.
Not saying the walk on water, just that based on what I've seen so far, they deserve a fair amount of credit for the direction they have taken.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
I purchased the SC 18" bandsaw about 8 months ago after reasearching the various brands off and on for at least a year. I have been very happy with it. I have had no problems with it, whatsoever. Any questions I had were quickly answered by their customer service people.
The only modification I have made was to put on an aftermarket fence. I adapted a Beisemeyer TS fence back when they were going for $80 at Lowes. It works great.
I always research heavily before purchasing a major tool and even duplicated some of the evaluation testing that was performed in the magazine BS reviews on the SC 18 that was available at my local retailer. It performed as well as, or better than, units costing very much more.
I would not hesitate to purchase from them again.
That's my two cents worth. Hope it helps.
I have a 18" band saw from S.C. Firstly it is an excellent machine. It was the best product for the money in my opinion, when I purchased (over a year ago) . The best part may be the customer service, I spoke with Jim Box directly, and he deliverd 14 kt. service. I previously had a Reliant 18"BS , which I practically re-manufactured, and prior to that a 14" band saw.so I was not without experience.
I live many miles from locations where I can easily shop and look at various brands to make comparisons. The SC had excellent quality of construction , and what appears to be a fairly hefty design. The guide system will not handle a one- eighth blade so I made my own gadget for this. It has the brake and tension unloader, they are a factor. The machine operates flawlessly
I would say that this and the 10" Jet cabinet saw (the blue one from when Jet was still Jet) are the two best power machines I have.
This is the only SC product I have, I hope this adds to your arsenal of information
And thanks for your previous help to me.
Russ
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