Oneida vs. Pennstate cyclones
I am researching cyclone dust collectors for my smallish one person shop. I have gone back and forth between Oneida and Pennstate – each seem to have selling points. Oneida has a new line out -“V” System which is geared toward the small or hobbiest shop – it is reasonable, fairly powerful and comes with an integrated stand.
I am considering clustering the machines to save on ducting (apparently ducting can cost more than the cyclone!)- one cluster with the TS, planer and jointer and ductwork out to the second cluster of BS, miter saw and sanding area -with blast gates for each machine.
Another possible consideration is that I am renting shop space – so I don’t want the fixture to be permanent(as in immovable).
Does anyone have first hand knowledge of both of these cyclones?
And what is the latest on PVC vs. metal ductwork?
Thanks!
Replies
I went through these gyrations a few months ago. In the end, a sale on one of the older models of the Penn State series tipped the balance in their favor. It's been working just fine, and the air and general atmosphere in my shop is much cleaner now.
The cyclone came with a little shipping damage - the weight of the motor had crushed in the shell of the top part of the cyclone. I called Penn State and they were very quick to offer to send a new part. However, I told them to let me bang on it with a hammer a bit to see if I could straighten it out. I did and got it back into shape with little trouble. When I called Penn State with the news that they didn't need to send a new part, I was complimented on my "can-do" attitude. A nice touch..
You're smart to consider clumping your machines in order to reduce duct runs and to save on ductwork. I did that too, and when I ran the final figures pertaining to CFM's, static losses and other exotica, I realized I could get by with a smaller unit that I had originally thought I'd need. That saved some space and a little money.
So, overall, I'm happy with what I bought (be sure to get a remote control - a very handy device!), but I'm sure I'd have been as satisfied with the Oneida. My impression is that the Oneida is a slightly higher end machine, though Penn State has recently upgraded their line so maybe there's not much difference.
Prepare yourself to empty the chip bin more often than you'd think. It's amazing how fast that thing fills up. But then, when I look back on the huge mounds of chips my planer and jointer used to spew out, I wonder why I put up with all that mess for so long. It probably was a fire hazard on top of the dust factor.
The cyclone and duct system work so well that I only see a rogue chip or two escape the planer and once in a while, maybe every 2 minutes or so. Except when I forget to open the blast gate! Then stuff flies all over...
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
I do not have experience with both.... but I did recently replace my 2 dust collectors, a Delta and a Jet, with an Oneida cyclone. I bought the 2.5 HP model and it is wonderful!!! I have 11 drops to machines in my basement shop and the cyclone is in one corner of the basement and the longest run is about 40'. I did use metal piping. I have great suction everywhere. The piping starts out at 7" and reduces to 6" and then to 5". I followed Amy's directions at Oneida on how to space the different diameters and on running 6" all the way to the table saw before splitting to smaller pipe. I do have 5" tubing going to the base of my Unisaw with a 4" branch reserved for a future (soon) overarm guard/collector. Previously a lot of chips stayed in the inside of the ts and spewed out on to the saw top. Now the interior is spotless and the top side chips are greatly reduced.
The piping is expensive and I bought some fittings from Penn State and blast gates from Blast Gate Co. in Michigan. I couldn't believe cast metal blast gates for less than $7 for 5" gates. The elbows and spiral pipe I purchased locally as I got a good deal on elbows with a rubber gasket that seals the spiral pipe 100%.
To say I am happy with the Oneida is an understatement! I smile every time I turn it on and make a dust free cut. I was tired of my dust collectors only catching a portion of the dust produced and leaving the rest for me to breathe. I have a Performax 22/44 drum sander and while the old dust collector would collect all the dust (about all) the filter stopped up quickly and took a lot of cleaning, and it was a canister cleaner. The Oneida gets all the sander dust and virtually all of it ends up in the dust bin. I recently did a large sanding project and combined with some jointer chips I filled the 35 gallon container. Checking the collector at the bottom of the filter, designed to collect everything that the cyclone did not separate, I had maybe 2 teaspoons on dust and no chips! You can't get any better than that. I have a ceiling mounted air filter and it has not been turned on since the cyclone was installed.
It is a fixed mounting and is impractical to move, but I am very happy with my Oneida!
Bruce
Phoebe:
I don't think you will find many unhappy Oneida customers. I have the 2HP Super Gorilla. I have seen a few negative comments about fit and finish, but these are purely cosmetic concerns and do not affect the functionality.
Hastings
I was faced with the same dilemma about a year ago and went with the 2.5hp Tempest from PennState. I've been very pleased so far - another plus for me was that it was UPS shippable so delivery to my residence was not a problem and all components were easy to move with a hand truck. My collector is permanently mounted in it's own closet and the only downside is the smallish size of the waste barrel. I opted for the heavy gauge metal duct and it did indeed cost about as much as the cyclone.
You might also want to take a look at the new freestanding cyclones from JDS (http://www.jdstools.com). Their waste barrel setup looks to be very user friendly.
Lynn (wishing he was going to Bele Chere)
in Concord, NC
Phoebe, several Knots members have PVC as their ducting. You can get tons of DC information by reading Bill Pentz's web site. He used to recommend S&D pipe (Sewer and Drain) but is now recommending HVAC if the buyer is trying to conserve $$ (see Section 5 on this web page). I guess the costs of PVC is going up along with gas prices. Here's his take on the so-called dangers of static with PVC.
Take a deep breath and grab a cup of coffee or a beer before sitting down to digest all that DC info, it's extensive to say the least!
I wanted to update my original post to say that I used cheap HVAC metal ductwork for my cyclone installation. It might be 30 gauge. And it works just fine. I've even turned the cyclone on a few times with no blast gates being open and it suffered none of the "crushing" injuries I'd read about.
I've got about $300 into ductwork and about $650 into the cyclone, so about a grand overall. Worth the money; well worth it.
Zolton
If you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Same debate about a year and a half ago. I have my TS.. 8" jointer.. 20" planer.. BS clustered around the Penn State 2 1/2 HP Tempest "S". A short run (6') of PVC from the clone over a dead spot and back down the wall to 3' above the floor on an outside wall.
Then I purchased 14' of the clear heavy-duty 6" plastic hose with re-enforced wire. No ducting period from that wall outlet to the machines which I connect one at a time. I opened the ports on all those large machines to 6" and have 6" pipe all the way from the cyclone to the machine. with a run of no more than 24'.
I was told the clear plastic pipe would reduce cfm.. it may somewhat but don't let you cat go near the sucking end with only a 24' run. I was told that I should have separate piping and gates to all machines as it would take to long to dis-connect and re-connect. I work in the shop 6-10 hours a day switching which takes me less than 30 seconds with a quick connect on the out-bound end of the pipe from the cyclone.
So... I read and read and read all the scoop poop then decided to defy some of what I was told. The result was excellent collection without a zillion ports.. down-turns.. reductions at the machine.. etc. etc.. So I took a gamble and decided to "run against the wind".
Whatever I did must have found a magic formula to slice through the wind I was told would stop me in my tracks as the whole thing works like a charm and I couldn't be happier.
BTW.. heed Zolton (I think Zolton without going back) about empty the bin often.. especially planing. I made the mistake once and spent 4 hour blowing out fine filters where the chips had no place to go other than the fine dust bin and up from there. I planed 1/8" off 50 board feet for drawer sides the other day. Doesn't appear to be much if you look at it compressed on a piece of stock.. but it filled the bin once and half filled it again after I emptied. It will fool you until you realize just how much space it takes in it's new form of shavings.
I cut a hole in the side of my bin about 2/3 the way up. Installed a metal blast gate but replaced the metal door with a piece of clear plexi-glass. An inspection window no less. I simply glance down through it while planing and when it gets even close to the 2/3 level.. I stop and empty it which takes me about 10 minutes max.
Good luck and don't be afraid to run against the grain occasionally.. you might be rewarded IMO.
Sarge..
Edited 6/29/2008 10:40 am ET by SARGEgrinder47
Hey, and thanks everybody.I finished the Pentz site and my mind is boggled. Sarge- you say you bought 14' of duct but then you have a 24' run. Can you spell this out for me? Sounds likes you hook up each machine one at a time with the longest run being 24' Does this mean you have shorter duct for the close machines? And how do people make the machine ports bigger (dare I ask?) And which quick connect system did you get?
No.. same length clear plastic duct of 14" feet. From machine on ceiling about 6' in PVC.. then an L down wall with PVC about 4' (which I didn't mention in haste as drawers await in the shop)... then 14' of the clear plastic.. flexible duct pipe.
Something else I didn't mention is I kept my 1 HP Penn State DC in lieu of selling it. I put it beside my router table and SCMS which I do all cross-cuts on with extensions that support 14-16 feet. It is better suited as you don't need a full 6" for these and the run is about 12' max. I hook my spindle sander.. smaller 12" BS.. belt disc sander.. directly to a 6 HP Shop Vac. For ROS sanding and hand held routers I use a small portable 5.5 HP Shop vac with a 20' foot hose that I hang from a bungy strap from the ceiling to avoid snag when moving the machine.
I find a large system is not always the best suited for the smaller machines as a smaller Shop Vac which directs suction to one spot as needed on those machines in lieu of air flow on the larger.
Sarge..
Thanks Sarge, - nice shop. I am sure I'll let folks know what I finally end up with. The man I am (about to) rent shop space from is an industrial engineer who loves to tinker - I could tell by the "inventions" laying around the place and the way he jumped right in when I brought over my new in the box Rikon 14" deluxe BS yesterday and put it together with hardly a glance at the directions.I wonder if I bought all the parts for the Pentz cyclone and just sort of left them out with the instructions casually laying nearby...
Phoebe,Reading Bill's site was one of the most informative things to do regarding dust collection. There is information there that is indispensable in making a decision about the machinery you want to buy.Do yourself another favor and look at this site:http://www.clearvuecyclones.com/ for equipment based on Bill's designs.Rich
Thanks,
I have a call into clear vue right now. I am not exactly sure what they are selling- components? the whole shebang? I think my brain is on overload trying to cover most of Bill's site and not being particularly mechanically inclined...but still health conscious and quality conscious enough to be willing to put cash towards a decent system.
Phoebe,They sell all the components. Most in one group of major items. It takes a little thought to go through the Web Site and "accumulate" all the "parts" needed to put together a complete unit.It's definitely more of a "DIY assembly project" as opposed to almost a turnkey operation from the bigger manufacturers.But I think it's worth it. The owner of the company answers the phone himself and is extremely helpful about what you'll need.I have no connection to the company. I've just researched this topic for quite a while, as I have been on hold regarding my own shop (over a year). I'm about a month away from getting set up and I can't wait to place that Clear Vue order!Rich
HI Rich.
I'd love to know what your plan and cost is (what size shop, drops etc.) - What components and all.
Phoebe,I'll be going with the CV1800 5 HP combo (either a right hand or left hand version - don't know yet) $995. Then I'll need 2 Wynn filters and associated ducting about $350. I don't think the cyclone comes with a collection drum, but I'm not sure, so that may be an additional cost.My equipment consists of a Hammer sliding table saw/shaper and a Hammer joiner/planer/slot mortiser. Each of these multi-purpose machines has a single dust port, so that's 2 duct lines for all that equipment.I haven't gotten my bandsaw yetr, that wil be a 3rd duct. Since I'm a one-person operation, only one duct line will be open at any time.All the machines will be quite close to the cyclone so my ducting will not be elaborate. I haven't finished designing the system yet, so I don't know the final configuration or cost.Do you have prices from the other equipment you've looked at in the 5HP range?Rich
Edited 6/29/2008 8:57 pm ET by Rich14
I am only now exploring the 5hp as Pentz says that is the only way to fly. I was looking at 2hp actually -the claims of what it could do were adequate for my needs. According to Pentz these claims are not realistic with that low of hp. I really wanted the DC to be less than 1,000- though...Clear Vue will cal tomorrow and I'll check out the options.
Yes,I've gone over all the data. It's frustrating trying to understand how units are rated. But it appears that 2 HP would be sufficient only for a single machine and would need to be connected with a very minimum amount of ducting - literally just a few feet.Let us know what you find out from Clear Vue.Rich
Hey guys, I just installed a 2hp Grizzly cyclone in my basement shop this spring and used metal HVAC lines. Had to hunt a bit for "y"s, but now that everything is hooked up it works great. Plenty of power for multiple machines. I have a permanent 6 to 5" line to the TS and another one to my jointer & routertable. No problem running it wide open - in fact I have never closed the TS line, and get lots of suction on second one. Cyclone is loud, but well constructed and efficient. Having a remote control is a real time-saver. I had narrowed my search to either the 2hp gorrila or grizzly. Ultimately, price and previous experience with Grizzly swayed me. Would recommend the muffler, though. I love the steel bin on casters, and like knowing that I can convert it to 50 gallons later, if I get a bigger shop. My ceilings are 7' so it'll have to wait.
Nathan
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Nathan,
What gauge HVAC duct have you used? Where did you get it? How long are your runs? And what size particles can your filter handle?Thanks for the photos-
Hi Phoebe, Specs say .2-2microns 99%. All I can say it it's a lot better than my 1micron 1HP bag machine. Duct work was 28g for fittings and 32 for straight pipe. No concerns with collapsing. The cyclone itself seems to filter most of the fine particles, as I have done a couple kitchens since and have very minimal dust in the filter bag. I like the cage protecting the filter as well.http://grizzly.com/products/2-HP-Cyclone-Dust-Collector/G0440Note: my prime concern with sizing getting a cyclone was being large enough for a future smaller wide-belt or double drum sander (24"). I think this one will do great, and am glad I didn't go for the 3hp. As it is, I expect that this machine will cost a lot to run. It literally heats my shop while it is running. I think the 3hp would have cost that much more $$ to run...
Edited 6/30/2008 8:14 am ET by Nathan Barnard
Nathan,Thanks. I've had very good experience with Grizzly and I looked hard at their cyclone equipment. Would you mind telling us how much you paid?
Rich, I paid $840, shipping included. Also had to pay some Canadian taxes at the border, as I live in New Brunswick.
Nathan,Thanks. That's a significantly lower price than the Clear Vue 5 HP machine. Something to think about.Rich
Nathan,How's the noise level of your Grizzly? Do you have the "muffler" addition?Rich
Rich, it is pretty noisy. I always wear hearing protection with it running in the same room. My 1HP was definitely quieter, and didn't need hearing protection. I didn't get the muffler, but regret it, and plan to in the next order... I think this article helped me make my decision for Grizzly. Had the 2hp oneida been the same price as in 2006 I might have gone with it. I never bought into the clearvue story. One man making plastic cyclones out of his shop didn't do it for me. Anyway, good luck. I am very happy with my 2HP unit and don't regret not going with 3hp. http://oneida-air.com/documents/AWW%20article%20jan%202006.pdfNathan
Rich, as I replied to Phoebe earlier, I have a 2.5 HP Oneida with a max run of 40' to one of the 14 drops. That is split for a lathe that I use for small turnings and a router table. I have more suction at that drop than I had at the inlet of the 1.5 HP Jet canister dust collector used previously. The horse power ratings are confusing and hard to compare from a normal dust collector to a cyclone. The cyclone is much more efficient. My table saw is about 30' from the cyclone and the cabinet is totally clean inside. Previously it always had piles of dust in the corners of the Unisaw cabinet.
Bruce"A man's got to know his limitations." Dirty Harry Calahan
Bruce,That's good info. What does that equipment cost?Rich
Rich, the Oneida 2.5 HP Cyclone is about $1250 plus $149 shipping, I think, east of the Mississippi. I spent another $1000, approx., for the spiral pipe, y's, and all the other fittings for 14 drops. That is a lot of pipe and fittings and I have most machines with a separate drop, a couple are split, and a blast gate for each machine. I only have one blast gate open at a time normally, but I have tried it with two gates open at the same time and I still have great suction. I have a 22/44 Performax drum sander and previously the dust clogged up my Jet canister filter. With the cyclone 99.9% of the sander dust ends up in the cyclone dust bin! I was totally amazed at this! I do not want to drag hoses around from machine to machine, even though this is a way to save significant money, so I plumbed each machine as described. My shop is cramped and the machines are strung out along half of my basement so having them permanently connected to the cyclone worked the best for me.
I know that this is a significant amount of money to spend to collect dust, but previously I breathed a lot of fine dust, even with a ceiling mounted air cleaner, and occasionally had the dreaded brown discharge from the nasal passages. Not what I want. I realized that my health was the important thing and did what I thought I needed to do to correct the dust problem.
Amy at Oneida was very helpful in working with me on the phone to plan and size a system to meet my needs. I was very pleased with the attention and service I received. The system went together without a hitch and worked from the first push of the remote! Make sure to get the remote for any DC system, its the berries!!
Bruce"A man's got to know his limitations." Dirty Harry Calahan
Bruce,Thanks. I agree with your opinion about cyclone systems. I have been looking at the Clear Vue equipment and for just about the same price, they sell their smallest machine, a 5 HP unit. It's probably over kill, and it requires a bit of minor engineering to get it set up. But I don't think I'll ever be able to over-tax it.Rich
I would urge you to do some calculations on exactly what you need now and anticipate needing in the future as you shop for a cyclone. When I was going through this a year or so ago I originally thought that I'd just get a larger machine and skip all the math work.
But, I found that when I sat down and figured things out, I didn't really need a very large cyclone at all. If you're in a one-person shop you'll probably never have more than one blast gate open at a time, and that's an important factor. Even with a two or three person shop you could coordinate the timing on running machines in order to have only one of them going at a time.
The advantages to buying a "right-sized" cyclone - lower cost, smaller ducts (smaller ducts cost less money), smaller footprint in the shop (important to those with smaller shops), less shipping cost, possibly no new wiring needed to upgrade a branch circuit...
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
Hello All,Yesterday I drove to S.C. and picked up my 5hp clear-Vue cyclone. I got an extensive tour of the facility , viewed production and met the staff and the dog. I got demos and tips and they even started to put the set up together for me to ease the process when I got the components "home".I had called Ed @ Clear-Vue Monday this week and he recommended at least a 3hp to get the fine dust - the dust that ca uses health problems (Bill Pentz is recommending 5hp, I believe). Until then I had only priced the 2 and 2 1/2 hp units because that is what the specs were stating on the websites for my needs - but the 3hp units cost as much or more than the 5hp Clear-Vue!The cyclones I saw in action yesterday were housed in closets muffled with fiberglass insulation - but even with the doors open they hummed rather than whined and with all the blast gates closed it is actually very quiet. With the Wynn filters I will have 600 square feet of filter! I will use S and D pipe and some flex hose.I need to buy a garbage can for the chips, make a clean-out box /support for the filter assembly and a couple of 2"x4" wall brackets to hang the thing on. (and the simple closet)Now to be worthy of my dust collector...
How soon can I move my tools from Atlanta to "your joint" nestled in the Smokies? By fall before the leaves turn I hope! :>)
Sarge..
Phoebe,Sounds like you have a good set up.I have several weeks to go before I make my final decision and several of the posts here had me seriously considering the Grizzly unit.As positive as I am about the Clear Vue equipment, the need for considerable assembly, "engineering" of the mounting and the connection to the collection bin (which frankly is going to look amateurish with my sheet metal working skills) is a negative.The Grizzly and Oneida equipment looks so completely professional and "finished" compared to the "kit appearance" of the Clear Vue.None-the-less, I am still seriously considering Clear Vue based on recommendations of others. I'll be very interested in how you feel about it after you have gone through all the process of setting it up and getting it to be a complete, working system.Rich
Hey Rich,You gotta go with what feels right for you- I personally don't care what the thing looks like in the closet! And I really feel good about supporting this cottage industry of Clear-vue, the thumbs up from Bill Pentz is a big deal to me now too - after the research, I couldn't do anything else really. Like I said, Ed at CV told me that if I bought any cyclone I should get at least a three hp - he was supportive and non-manipulative with his advise. I was really wavering on the idea of a clean big pretty yellow or black thing in the corner that came nearly set up , but I am convinced now that the CV set-up is not a really big deal (it helped to see it in action)and they actually do look cool with the saw dust coursing around in a dramatic spiral. I guess if I didn't spring for what I perceived to be the best, I would always wonder - I won't have that little voice now.I'll be happy to update with my progress as I get it up.
You're preaching to the choir!Enjoy.Rich
Sorry! I thank you for all your good tips and would be happy to be a resource if you decide to go CV. Hey, you could drive up and get yours too - I see you are in Florida (cuts that learning curve way down and saves on shipping!)
Phoebe,You chose well. Mine is still in the crate. A good friend of mine built his own to Bill's design. Makes makes a tom of cabinets so buys his plywood by the lift. He lives in the country so doesn't need the discharge filters, it just goes out on the ground. His shop is clean, and it is simply amazing how little dust is outside. Most of what is there is a result of what Sarge talked about - letting the waste can overfill. You just don't want that experience.One other word of caution. Don't be watching the waste going through the cyclone while you are cutting. Stay focused on the work.Don
Sarge,
I did a similar thing with my older 1 HP Jet dust collector when I upgraded to my Penn State cyclone. I hooked it up to my sliding miter saw in a different part of the shop. That enabled me to keep the duct runs from my cyclone to the bandsaw, tablesaw and jointer/planer relatively short. Now the Jet is a stand-alone unit hooked up to the sliding miter saw exclusively.
On the Jet, with a run of only about 3 feet to the sliding miter, it works superbly. There's a Tee and another blast gate on it so I can extend a run to my lathe, but I'm still deciding on how that should work. So for now the blast gate to the lathe remains closed, and the suction at the sliding mitersaw station is tremendous.
As you know, these are difficult saws to get good dust collection on, but now I don't see dust in the air and - more importantly - can't "taste" it either.
One upgrade I did to the older Jet collector that you might consider if you haven't already done so: I bought a Shaker felt upper bag for it from Highland Hardware. It was about 25 bucks, and is a low-micron unit (forgot the exact specs, but maybe 1 or 3 micron). The original bags that came with the Jet are very porous, maybe 30 micron.
After consulting with Highland Hardware a few times (they're very helpful) I decided to try just replacing the upper bag. The Shaker felt bags are said to allow more air out than the original bags, yet collect finer dust. In practice I found that to be the case, though I have no way to measure it scientifically. So, I put a plastic bag where the lower bag goes - and then put the original bag over that to contain it. Everything works just great, and when the time comes to empty the bag, the dust is already contained in a plastic bag, so into the trash it goes.
I was worried at first that effectively cutting the "outlet" for the air sucked into the collector would harm it in some way. But it doesn't sound as though the motor is straining and, again, the Shaker felt bags are said to be more efficient than the original ones, so I think I'm good to go on this set-up.
ZoltonIf you see a possum running around in here, kill it. It's not a pet. - Jackie Moon
The Penn State 1 HP comes with felt 5 micron bags top and bottom stock. I do now use plastic on the bottom so I can see the level at all times. I don't just tie it and put it on the street for pick-up though. I carry it down to the compost bin to turn back into mineral elements away from the house and then dump it as I do the cyclone bin. Gives real meaning to "cherry tomatoes" that I use compost around my bushes. :>)
The DC is one run with blast gates to the router then SCMS beside it. No more than about 10' max. Y'ed off to router with blast gate and then Y'ed at the SCMS to give a 2" feeder direct to machine port and one to a large scoop (about 10" x 8" mounted to left of blade on mobile cabinet top. Both work very well.
Regards...
Sarge..
Phoebe,
I had a PSI 'conventional' DC and was very satisfied with it- but I found emptying the bag a major dust emitter. So I went to a cyclone.
The 2 HP Oneida is a dream! Great fit and finish, quality all the way through. Now the hooker -
the decision was based on the OVER-ALL HEIGHT of the units. Better check to see which unit will fit in you shop.
Frosty
"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
Dear Phoebe,
I have had an Oneida 3 hp cyclone for six or seven years now. They designed and provided all the materials for the ductwork as well. Very nice system. Well made, it will stand unused in an unheated/cooled barn for six months and then I will run it for seven or eight hours at a clip for a month. Never a hiccup, no problems what so ever. Well worth the $
Best,
John
I am just finishing going through the same upgrade. I decided on the Oneida 5 hp Dust Gorilla because of the shape of my shop. It is long and narrow and I wanted to put the DC in one end of the shop and the machines in the other to reduce noise. This gives me a very long run, which is not efficient design for dust collection but good for noise reduction. I would put the DC it in a separate room if I had one to use. Penn State and Grizzly didn’t offer a 5hp system that would fit in my basement shop. I was pleased with the service from Oneida and the DC is a monster. Very well built, looks like something that should be in a commercial shop instead of my basement.
After looking at all three and reading up on them I am not sure there is a lot of difference between the major vendors as long as you get one of the new designs that incorporate Bill Pentz’s ideas. I read that he has consulted with all three vendors on there new DC designs. I would go for the best price on the size that works for you.
I do want to comment on wingdoctors post about Blast Gate co. After a lot of looking I also ordered my fittings and blast gates from them. They were less money and a heaver gage than what the other vendors were offering. They also custom build them so they can provide anything you need. They saved me money by combining two Ys into one double Y. They also reduced the input size from the output size in the fittings so I didn’t have to buy additional reducers. There metal blast gates cost less than the plastic ones I have been buying locally. One of the bends was damaged in shipping, I called them and had a replacement in a couple of days. They were very helpful with the design, great service and a good product. I did end up buying my spiral pipe from a local HVAC supplier because it was less expensive do to the shipping changes. I could also buy 13 ft sections instead of the 5 ft sections.
Bob T.
Phoebe.. Don01 touched a point I already made earlier but with so much to read, sometimes we hurry and discount the words of those that are not as well know as Bill Pentz.. etc. etc.....
I suggest you install a view window on your catch can and don't be timid about taking the time to empty when it reachs a 2/3 level. From experience I can tell you that letting it go to do tomorrow may result in hours of cleaning your fine filters. And regardless of how high tech your system is.. or how much fine filter space.. horse-power.. etc., if that chip bin over-flows the chips and fine dust will all back up into the fine filters and clog it.
So... the degree of efficiency has been nullified to useless as when that happens.. fine dust has no place to go but back in your shop. And that it will. Another important point regardless of how good the equipment you use... you will never get it all from the stand-point of the cyclone itself. The quality of "how you set up on the collection end" is as critical as all the other factors as make up the unit itself.
Some tools as a SCMS or miter saw are beast to conquer with dust collection and no system.. repeat no system will get it All.... period. So... don't think that your dust mask is now obsolete as it is just as important as it ever was IMO. That opinion stems from actual usage of a cyclone 6-10 hours a day six days a week.
I'm not Bill Pentz nor do I have a web-site... but I am not fool and I fight a battle with dust almost everyday. So.. I believe that observation from the trench where you get down and dirty and live the results of your efforts everyday has it's own merit just as extensive testing and theory on paper.
BTW.. love the scenery in Asheville as I am a mountain boy at heart...
Regards...
Sarge..
Thanks -All. The research and improvement will never end I suppose. I know the SCMS is a big offender. I saw Ed Morgano's system for his radial arm saw and that looked pretty darn efficient. It looks like a few machines will have to have two collection sites.One step at a time... outlet, garbage can (with peep hole)and duct!
Good luck though I feel you will handle the task without breaking a "perspire". Should be a great set-up when all is said and done. Just get it done before the leaves start changing as it it just too nice to be inside where you are in the fall. >)
Sarge..
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