Replies

1. 
   dgreen | Jul 19, 2008 07:33pm | #1

   Sounds like the centrifugal start switch is not closing. You can try giving the motor a solid whack with a rubber mallet but if that does'nt work or if the problem reoccurs you'll have to take the motor apart and examine the switch.

   Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys.
   -- P.J. O'Rourke

1. 
   alanplanesaw | Jul 19, 2008 08:09pm | #2

   Thanks Don.  I am taking a few more covers off, vacuuming, blowing, whatever I can do in a non-technical sense.

   Where is the centrifugal switch on the motor?

   Alan - planesaw

1. 
   dgreen | Jul 19, 2008 08:19pm | #3

   Usually inside the motor case at the rear end of the armature. You will have to remove the rear end plate on the motor to get to it.

   I would try the mallet first, the switch may have just hung open and a good whack may close it.Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke

1. 
   alanplanesaw | Jul 19, 2008 08:39pm | #4

   Not being an electrician in much of any sense of the term (other than very basic outlets and switches) I was reluctant to start taking much off.

   However, after the switches, and your first reply, I took off the cover to something mounted on the side of the motor and found it to be a capacitor.  Turns out it may be leaking, if that is something they can do and if that is an indicator of anything, good or bad.

   The wires from the capacitor go straight inside the motor housing with very little excess wiring.  Certainly not enough to do anything with.  So, wherever they go, it would mean going into the end of the motor and I am relucant to do that as I don't know what I will have on my hands if I do that.

   Figure I'll just take the motor off and find someone who knows more than I do.

   Oh, and whacking it didn't help.  Should have mentioned that right up front.

   Thanks Don for your advice and your honorable attempt to help me.

   Alan - planesaw

1. 
   dgreen | Jul 19, 2008 08:51pm | #5

   A leaking capacitor could certainly cause the problem you are having. The capacitor usually has either screw terminals or spade lugs for attaching the wires. I have never seen one that required opening the motor to replace. Is there possibly a cap on the end of the capacitor concealing the terminals?Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke

2. 
   alanplanesaw | Jul 19, 2008 09:57pm | #10

   Don,

   BINGO!  Thanks.  Not ever having dealt with a capacitor, I just saw both ends were covered with not an easy way to take the end caps off, and left it alone.

   However, your comment about the cap concealing the terminals prompted me to go back and look more.

   Sure enough, I could slip the cap off (there is a hole in the cap that the wires go through) far enough and, you betcha', there were terminals.  Unscrewed them and come Monday I'll be lookin' for a new capacitor.  All indicatiions are is that the capacitor is definitely bad.

   Thanks everyone!

   Alan - planesaw

3. 
   BruceS | Jul 20, 2008 02:41am | #11

   To test the capacitor.  1. Use a multimeter,  set it on OHMS,  place the two leads on the Capacitor spade terminals and note the needle deflection on the meter.   2.  Reverse the leads and touch the terminals again.  The Needle deflection should be double the first test.   If not,  get a new capacitor.

   So simple when you know how. :-)Work Safe,  Count to 10 when your done for the day !!

   Bruce S. 

    

4. 
   alanplanesaw | Jul 20, 2008 02:47am | #12

   Bruce,

   The fiber top on the capacitor is somewhat twisted with part of it being out of the cylinder.  Looks like it got hot as part of the plastic shrink wrap that was on the cylinder is melted, along with the top being disfigured. 

   Not sure what heated it up as there was no heat source near it, other than the motor itself.

   Will take the capacitor to an electrical suppy house on Monday and see what they say.

   Alan - planesaw

5. 
   dgreen | Jul 20, 2008 02:48am | #13

   It's leaking, no need to test this one... it's bad.Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke

6. 
   BruceS | Jul 20, 2008 03:03am | #14

   Agree, it's probably bad.  But, I gave good info to keep in the memory bank.  Somebody will remember and save themselves a lot of grief.Work Safe,  Count to 10 when your done for the day !!

   Bruce S. 

    

7. 
   dgreen | Jul 20, 2008 03:11am | #15

   That is good info, every woodworker that uses power tool should own a multimeter and know how to test and troubleshoot their tools.

   I did'nt mean to belittle your tip, it was a very good one. I wish the forum had a section for advice such as yours.Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke

8. 
   dgreen | Jul 20, 2008 03:58am | #16

   I would add to your excellent tip to short the terminals on the capacitor before performing the test.Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke

9. 
   BruceS | Jul 20, 2008 04:14am | #17

   That's for sure!  I forgot about that! Haven't had to test one in years.   In AC/R  school we used to charge them up and  ZAP  each other, or just let them set (charged) for the unsuspecting prey and play dumb.  They can Poke!!!!!!!!!!Work Safe,  Count to 10 when your done for the day !!

   Bruce S. 

    

10. 
    alanplanesaw | Jul 20, 2008 06:48pm | #18

    Bruce & Don --

    Thanks for the info.  Although I hope to not need the advice you have provided again, that is one of great things about FWW and Knots Forum -- there is always someone who knows more than I do.   And, people willing to help and be of service.

    By the way, why does a motor need a capacitor?  Is there some advantage to it?  Do all motors use them?

    Alan - planesaw

11. 
    BruceS | Jul 20, 2008 08:46pm | #19

    Electric motor operation could end up being a full volume.  Google Elec. motors and read the basic description in wikipedia and you will get the basics.

    Work Safe,  Count to 10 when your done for the day !!

    Bruce S. 

     

    Edited 7/20/2008 1:48 pm ET by BruceS

12. 
    alanplanesaw | Jul 20, 2008 10:49pm | #20

    Capacitor Start

    This motor has a capacitor in series with a starting winding and provides more than double the starting torque with one third less starting current than the split phase motor. Because of this improved starting ability, the capacitor start motor is used for loads which are hard to start. It has good efficiency and requires starting currents of approximately five times full load current. The capacitor and starting windings are disconnected from the circuit by an automatic switch when the motor reaches about 75% of its rated full load speed.

    Uses

    Common uses include: compressors, pumps, machine tools, air conditioners, conveyors, blowers, fans and other hard to start applications.

    Thanks.  Great info and education.

    Alan - planesaw

13. 
    Tinkerer3 | Jul 21, 2008 03:39am | #21

    "Why does a motor need a capacitor"? Not a motor expert here but I think the capacitor determines what direction the motor will run and starts it in that direction.  Incidentally, you can remove that capacitor and give the motor a start, by hand, in either direction and it will run just fine.

    "Do all motors use them?"  All capacitor motors use them.  Hence the name.  Note:  There are many types of motors.

    Edited 7/20/2008 8:40 pm ET by Tinkerer3

    Edited 7/20/2008 8:41 pm ET by Tinkerer3

2. 
   THintz | Jul 19, 2008 08:57pm | #6

   You might want to look inside of the impeller housing just to be sure it is clear. a vieer of mine had a motor that was pronounced dead by just about everyb ody but when he was taking it apart to replace it, he found a little wedge of wood that had gotten sucked up. Apparently when the impeller was winding down the last time he ran it, it fell into the impeller housing and got stiuck between a blade and the housing, Took that wedge out and the dead motor returned to life.

   I suppose the chances of that happening are pretty small but it is free to look.

   Tom Hintz

   Because there is always more to learn!

1. 
   alanplanesaw | Jul 19, 2008 09:34pm | #8

   Tom,

   That's actually the first thing I did -- access the impeller and make sure it turned freely.  It does.  I tried to think of all the "logical" things it might be.  Including plugging it in directly to make sure it wasn't the remote.  It wasn't.

   Thanks,

   Alan - planesaw

1. 
   THintz | Jul 19, 2008 09:43pm | #9

   bummer. Bypassing the remote was a good idea also. It's not sounding good for something with the motor itself, capcitors all that stuff. after "it's not stuck" I start looking for electrician types.

    

   Good luck!

    Tom Hintz

   Because there is always more to learn!

3. 
   SawdustSteve | Jul 19, 2008 09:16pm | #7

   The first things I do is to take an air hose and give the switch and the motor a good blowing out. (the unit should be unplugged for safety reasons)

   If you're using a 'remote' starter switch, disconnect it, plug the DC directly into the wall outlet and see if the motor starts.

   UNPLUG the motor, disconnect the hose into the impeller area and see if you can turn the impeller blades EASILY. Sometimes a small piece of wood wedges itself between the impeller blade and the housing.

   And... if you say the motor starting capacitor is leaking, THAT is probably the problem. You may have to take it to a 'motor shop' and have them check the motor out.
   SawdustSteve