I am trying to make more room in my shop and I plan to sell my Craftsman RAS and buy a CMS. I am looking at the Makita 1014 and the Bosch 4410. I would like comments or recommendations
Edited 2/26/2008 9:38 pm by WH1105
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Edited 2/26/2008 9:38 pm by WH1105
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Replies
I did a quick search of the net and couldn't find anything on the Makita 1014. I assume that it's a ten-inch slider like the Bosch 4410.
I have the Makita LS1212 12" compound miter saw (no slide) and it is amazing. The stock blade is very good quality - I will likely buy another Makita blade when this one is expended. The accuracy is dead on, right out of the box. The 12" offers 8" crosscut capacity and will cut 4" thick stock. It's not everyday I need to cut 4" stock, but when I do, it's a lifesaver. I feel that a sliding saw offers less precision than a non-slider due to the inherent play, as little as there may be. Anything wider than 8" is often wider than 12" as well and is cut on the table saw.
I have no experience with Bosch's miter saws. They do have the bevel locking lever upfront. I might have used the bevel feature once so far.
Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Try to look at them both in person. I did, and then I bought the Makita. The slide mechanism is built like part of a bridge. I could visibly move the head of the saw with my hands on all of the others. Hundreds of thousands of trim carpenters couldn't have been wrong for all of this time.
Rob
Rob...
Thanks for your trim carpenter comments. I want a good solid saw that will give me good cuts for a long time.
Wayne
I have the Bosch 4412 and love it, but Bosch has replaced that line with the 5412L (useless laser) which is identical except for the laser. I imagine all this applies to the 4410 as well.
Being able to make all the adjustments from the front of the tool is well worth the extra few dollars. I'd say go for the Bosch. The laser makes a nice paper weight.
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Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.net
See some of my work at AWorkOfWood.com
Edited 2/27/2008 2:11 am by Ted W.
Ted..
Thanks for your comments. I wasn't sure about the lazer. Apparently you are not very impressed with it.
In general, laser alignment devices work perfectly well when your tolerances are +/- 1/16" or so. They're pretty useless for Fine Woodworking.
-Steve
I tried the laser once and tossed it in the "Useless Tools" bin. All it did is obscure a perfectly good pencil line with a glaring red streak. Also, it only marks one side of the blade. If you're cutting from the other side, it's useless. Another also is that you can't turn it off, as it kicks in when the blade is spinning.
I guess the laser is okay for rough framing. My tile saw has a laser, which is handy. But these are all cuts within a certain fraction. But you can't split a pencil line if you can't see it. --------------------------------------------------------
Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at AWorkOfWood.com
I'll stand up for the laser too. I have the Delta 12" double laser and have it finely adjusted to show the left and right kerf cut. I can split a pencil mark. And, due to the design, it works when the blade is beveled and/or on mitered, and if the blade is up or down. Love it for doing crown trim as it always show the "actual" cut, regardless of angle.
I bought the 12inch Bosch with the laser a few months back. I upgraded from a 10 inch Bosch SCM that served me well for years.
It is an outstanding tool.
As for the laser. I hear a lot about the accuracy. Maybe I have the only good one but mine is pretty darn good. The laser is designed only to be accurate when the blade is all the way up. This is because the beam has to make a slight slight angle from the arbor, across the diameter of the blade, to clear the edge before projecting to the stock.
If the laser is set on the cut line with the blade all the way up, the kerf will cut the line and the waste to the right of the line. As you move the blade down toward the stock, you will actually see the laser line move off the cut line to the left. This, of course is all covered in the manual.
I've attached a photo showing the cut line on a piece of 5/4 poplar where I set the laser line right on the pencil line.
When cutting stock from about 1/2" to 1-1/4" and setting the laser on the line, the cut will be accurate to around a 64th or so in my experience. If the stock is much thicker the geometry stops working so well and the accuracy diminishes.
All this said, when the need is for an extremely precise cut to a measured length, the laser should only be considered a guide. You're going to want to err to the waste side and sneak up on the scribed line at that point.
Frank(Sticking up for the laser!)
Accurate to around a 64th is not accurate enough for me. Another poster mentioned he can split the pencil line by using the laser. That's more what I consider accurate, and I keep my pencil sharp. I think he mentioned he's got a Makita.
But anyway, accurate or not, I just don't care for the glaring red line. I've never had a problem splitting the pencil line without the laser, so I see no need for it now. Just a useless gimmick, in my humble opinion. I have found the Bosch 4412 and the 5412 to be dead-on accurate and easy to operate. To me, that's what a miter saw should do. --------------------------------------------------------
Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at AWorkOfWood.com
OK then, Ted.
Just don't ask me to do it with a hand saw, I'm not quite that old fashioned. :)
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Cheap Tools at MyToolbox.netSee some of my work at AWorkOfWood.com
The laser is enormously useful in remodels and old house construction.
The time saved lining the saw up to random angles is huge!
But this being a Fine woodworking forum I'd have to agree.
What good does it do if you know what your aiming for anyway? By the way the accuracy just depend on how well you tune them up.
I feel I have to reset mine far to often, but it is right on.
I've had some hard times with the Makita.
The miter lock is a very poorly designed mechanisim. I've had to rebuild it several times, even called the company .
They suggested I buy a new base (No they didn't give or even discount it). After a couple of hours of rebuilding the whole dang saw-no better.
Started working with a new partner who has the same saw- same problem.
Also the compound lockout knob jams constantly,and hits the table surface so you can't tighten it.
I've been hearing how great these things are for years, I don't get it.
I'd get a slider. I had a 10" Makita CMS for years, but recently got a 10" Hitachi SCMS. The 10" CMS won't quite cut 6" stock, but the slider will. Either one excels at quickly cutting large numbers of boards for face frames, etc.
Look at the new Rockler table sled, or make your own miter table for your sears RA. The "Sliders" are a waste of money.
Got a question for everyone.
How many of your folks use a shooting board to trim your mitres for a perfect fit after cutting them on your mitre saw?
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
I made one of them, but always used the sander disk to true them until I got the Rockler miter sled.
Which Rockler sled are you talking about, the mitre sled? I looked at their site and they have several. I like the one David Marks uses on his DIY show but am now considering making a variation for the RAS instead.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob its the new Table saw crosscut sled. I made my own drop off table to save $. I got it for 20% less on sale and it lives up to the advertised claims. You can cut any angle with it, and it is dead accurate. I comes with a great fence, a stop, and makes all my angled and straight cuts easy as pie.
Looks good except I'm not fond of the holdown. I'd rather use a Destaco but it appears that one could be mounted without a lot of hassle. Price ain't all that bad either.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
The hold down comes in handy on some cuts, but is the way on others. It is easly removed or slid out of the way.
Bob,
Shooting board vs miter saw, to me, is kind of like hand plane versus thickness planer. One is more enjoyable, the other is easier. Either works perfectly well if set up properly. I don't actually have a shooting board right now - it's on the to-do list. Somewhere.Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
I like my shooting board but it would be much better with a LA BU Jack as you're cutting end grain almost all the time. Now that I think about it, I don't recall seeing a shooting board used for anything else, not that that's a bad thing, mind. Mine is ala Dereks design with an adjustable fence for angled/straight shooting. Works really well.
Oh yeah, and a Lee Valley LA BU Jack is on the horizon. Life will be good then. I like the quietude, no dust to speak of and setup is just a step away on the bench.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 2/28/2008 8:23 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Bob,
While shooting boards for end grain are certainly the most common, I have also seen some designed to shoot edges - the guarantee straight and square edges on a board. I image that they are not common because most table saws do a decent job. A jointer will often work nearly as well.Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Hi Chris,
Oh yes, I have used mine for edges too, usually short edges in a jewelry box for example. Works very well.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob: I have a Lion miter cutter. It works like a guillitine (sp?). Razor sharp blades. Can set it for 45 deg or 90 deg. Take just a wee bit at a time, but it's dead nuts!!
James
James,
Great tool, wish I had one sometimes.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
I don't know if Bosch model you have listed is the same as the one I bought a couple of years ago(10 inch slider), but I am not satisfied with my purchase.
I had to file out the slots in the extention to the left of the blade to allow it to line up with the rest of the fence. The reason I purchased this saw was it's angle cuts are much more than the other saw I looked at.
The only reason that I kept the saw is because Bosch wanted me to pay the frieght back to them which was quite expensive.
I also have a 2 1/4 Standard/plunge base router kit from Bosch.
I like the plunge base alot but I cannot get the motor out of the plunge base without GREAT DIFFICULTY. Bosch said to send back the motor at my expense and they will ship me one with an aluminum housing that cure that problem.
In Dec 07 my wife purchased another Colt trimmer for me and first use just lately, I could not get the bit out. The shaft lock does not work and their is a vibration in the motor and it is not the bit. This time I told them to send me a Prepaid shipping label and they did.
My point here is I like some of the bells and whistles of the Bosch but I feel the many Makita tools I have/had are beefier and much more of a lasting quality and have never had to send a new tool in for repair.
http://www.superwoodworks.com
Garry,
I have the exact same problem with my router. Model 1617EVSPK. And I thought it was just me! I bought it because it got good magazine reviews, but haven't found anything about it that I particularly like.Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
All this talk of chopsaws and no mention of Dewalt? Its the saw of choice in my neck of the woods. I've used a 10" Bosch and wasn't happy with the guard raising mechinism, It takes away from the fluidness of the cut. In my opinion, if you need to use a shooting board after a cut, you need a new miter saw.
I'm with you on the Dewalts.
The most rock solid and dependable CMS out there right now.
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