Replies

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 19, 2003 07:47pm | #1

   Vals

      I just bought the Hitachi C10FS as Lowe's was clearing it for $337. The C10FSB with taller fence is now out at $479. I like the Hitachi as it has dual bevel capacity and a block you cut into behind the blade to let you know exactly where the blade will make contact.

      I did quite a bit of homework on all the SCMS's, and you won't find anyone that will knock the Makita most likely. It is one of the best on the market. I slighly favor the Hitachi for the reasons mentioned, but would be proud of the Makita also. In the case it was a deal I couln't refuse.

      BTW, I spoke to about 20 everyday users of a SCMS. It will be a task to get anyone that uses one to knock the Makita, DW (which is 12") or the Hitachi. The Ridgid probaly would fall into this category also.

   Luck with all...

   sarge..jt

1. 
   Tag | Feb 19, 2003 07:55pm | #2

   Sarge is right - I have the Makita and I love it.    I assume you're talking about the dual bevel model for around $500.  Makita also offers a single bevel slider, which I've used and is also very nice if you're budget doesn't allow the dual.  They have depth stops, and other nice features that are easy to use.   I highly recommend the dual bevel, though.

1. 
   Elcoholic | Feb 20, 2003 12:50am | #3

   I have the LS1212 and have no complaints.  You should be very happy with the 10" version.  Well maybe one complaint and one warning.  The price of the horizontal workclamp is ridiculous, but I bought it anyway.  Watch out for the flip-over fence extension.  Despite the big yellow warning sticker, I managed to bury the blade in it when doing my very first compound scarf joint.   My helper and I caught a little aluminum shrapnel and the fence was really tweaked.  On the up-side it was reasonably cheap to replace and neither of us were really hurt.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking

   Life is tough.  It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne

1. 
   mitch | Feb 20, 2003 05:16am | #4

   i'm not exactly hard on tools but very particular about accuracy and quality of cut- my ls1013 is a dreamboat.  it may not be perfect for everything- what is?- but i have really been pleased with it.  try harbor freight for a factory reconditioned one- about a hundred bucks or so cheaper than new.

   m

2. 
   plinthe | Feb 20, 2003 05:42am | #5

   I have the 1013 and I love it. It's quiet and smooth, table is extra big, factory presets are dead on and adjustments are a breeze (one-handed). Blade cuts well, but looks a bit on the cheap side. I recommend it.

3. 
   TomFerreira | Feb 20, 2003 06:24am | #6

   Vals,

   I have an old LS1011 thats about 10 years old and I love it. Great machine even though the old ones don't do dual bevels. One thing to be aware of is that the cut depth varies alot between manufacturers, especially in the 12" saws, so be sure to look at the specs. I think you'll be surprised to find that in the makitas you don't pick up alot of cut depth from 10" to 12", and the 12" dewalt has a significantly deeper cut capacity than the makita 12".

   TDF

1. 
   corners | Feb 20, 2003 06:41am | #7

   I'm looking at the new Makita 7 1/2 inch slider. Tiny little thing, tuck it under your arm and walk away, great for those finishing jobs away from the shop. And it cuts 2 x 6.

4. 
   Glendo | Feb 20, 2003 07:29am | #8

   I had the Makita, briefly. I returned it because when the saw was set to 90 degrees it cut 90 degrees, and when the table is then set at 45 degrees, it cuts 44 degrees. I also thought the hold down was lame.

   I've heard good things about the Hitachi's.

   Good luck, Glendo.

5. 
   alanplanesaw | Feb 20, 2003 07:40am | #9

   I have the 10" Makita.  Absolutely love it.  It will cut almost as deep as some 12" brands.

   As others have mentioned, you will have to decide which brand offers which features you want.  Makita has to quality on this one.

   Alan / Planesaw

6. 
   dirtstirrer | Feb 20, 2003 06:20pm | #10

   Vals,

       I've got the LS 1013, reconditioned for a lot cheaper, and it is wonderful.  I spent a lot of time doing research before I could afford to buy it, and at the time (2years ago) it was the best one out there in my opinion.  After using it for 2 years, I like it even more then I thought I would.  Cross cut 12" @ 90 with a 10" blade!  Its sliding mechinism is solid as a rock.  It's become my favorite power tool.

                    Steve

1. 
   MIKEBUETTNER | Feb 21, 2003 01:23am | #11

   I have the Makita LS 1013 and love it. My first miter saw and I am glad I bit the bullet and bought this one. However... Amazon has the Hitachi C10FSB 10" Dual Bevel Slide Compound--Includes 10" 72 Tooth Carbide Blade a $69.99 Value for $479 plus free shipping and another $30 off with the discount code below:

   $30 off Hitachi tools purchases over $199 - code: MAPPHTACH234 Exp: 3/9

   bit

   Edited 2/20/2003 5:24:06 PM ET by Bitman

7. 
   diver | Feb 21, 2003 07:28pm | #12

   I have the 1013 and use it almost everyday as a trim carpenter.The saws strong points are accuracy,fit and feel of the controls,flip stop depth adjuster,and reliability.The only complaint I have is that when using the bevel feature alot the bearing surfaces make metal to metal contact.I have had to remove the arm of the saw and add grease to the joint to continue working.Compared to the other saws I've tried (Hitachi-Dewalt) the Makita works much better.                

8. 
   ian | Feb 22, 2003 02:54am | #13

   Like many others, I also love my LS1013.  I've had it for about four years.  One thing to be aware of is the blade sold with the saw.   Mine was a Makita branded 80 tooth TC blade with a 2.8mm (about 7/64) kerf.   I'm very happy with this blade, rarely does a cut need any further clean up.  However, it's my understanding that different blades are fitted to meet particular price points - so beware.  Depending on the blade offered with the machine you're looking at you may want to consider an upgrade.

   Ian

9. 
   RW | Feb 22, 2003 04:49am | #14

   Part of the bonus of having worked with another indie for the last few months is tool comparisons. We're using each other's stuff all the time, and formulating some opinions. His SCMS is the 10" Makita. I'd be inclined to agree that getting an owner to knock it might be a challenge. It's smooth and accurate. He's got it on a (relatively speaking) cheap Iowa stand that, for as good as it performs, is one heck of a great buy. For anyone looking to complement their saw with a stand, Iowa makes a couple that are nearly identical. The one thats $20 more is a lot sturdier, and still half the price of a Delta. I own a Delta and a Dewalt saw, 10 & 12.

   " To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 22, 2003 07:34am | #15

   RW

      Thanks for info Iowa stand. Have you ever seen a Woolcraft and if so, what's your opinion.

   Regards...

   sarge..jt

1. 
   RW | Feb 22, 2003 11:28pm | #16

   Sorry, haven't seen that. Thus far only tried out the Iowa, the Delta with the big wheels, and the DeWalt. Oddly enough, the Dewalt and Iowa designs are REAL similar. The Dewalt stand works the same, looks almost the same (more "aesthetically" pleasing) - but in use, they're the same animal. Dewalt is $229 here, the Iowa price I got was from Tool Depot in Sioux City for $129.

   outa curiosity, you were a Ranger, huah?" To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 23, 2003 03:01am | #17

   RW

      Thanks for that input. My SCMS is mainly confined to the shop. I have a chop saw already set up between 2 4' cabinet top counters on each side. The SCMS has too big a foot-print to go there. I do have an additional 700 sq. ft. back in the half basement assembly area. I thought I might place it there on one of the portable stands.

      Prices are same here in Atlanta. I ususally go through Tool-Crib (amazons source) in ND direct to save tax. HD has the Woolcraft for $99, but they don't have one set up. The DW gets rave revues as it will extend 16'. The Iowa is at Tool-crib for $129. You caught me off-gaurd when you said it is as sturdy as the DW. DW seems to over-price, but it looks pretty sturdy in this case. I would definitely consider the Iowa if you say it is just about the same with maybe less extention. This is very helpful as even a dummy like me can figure the difference between $229 and $129. ha..ha..( I checked with my wife who is considerably smarter, just to be sure)

      Yes, I served with P Co. 75th Ranger Reg, attached to 5th Inf. Div I Corp VN from 68-69. I was LRRP until I think Jan. or Feb. of 69. Everybody that was LRRP at that time was consumed into 75th Ranger Reg. when it was re-activated. A company of Rangers were assigned to each Div. or in some cases Brigade (196 Airborne Brigade as an example). It's still going strong down at Ft. Benning just down the road. I went to a re-union back about a year ago.

      I was reffered to as gunny in a very recent post. I believe that would be reserved for the Marine Corp. I did work closely with 3rd Marine Div. scout-snipers and recon on many occasions in I Corp on joint operations. If a gunny heard anybody from the Army reffered to as gunny, he would have back-handed the person speaking immediately and made the correction as they were lying in the prone position. ha..ha..

      I did not correct the poster as I was a little intense on the main content of our discussion. Another story in itself. If you have any questions concerning Ranger and it's re-activation in 69, feel free to ask. I will answer them to the best of my ability, sir.

   Thank you very much on the Iowa stand info, got a feeling that might just show up in the shop...

   sarge..jt

1. 
   RW | Feb 23, 2003 05:32am | #18

   Well the stand isn't sitting in front of me, but it will also support long stock. It's based on their Stablemate sawhorses, which are about the heaviest that I've run across, anyways. I would estimate that fully extended your supports span at least 10'. Believe thats the same with the DW. It doesn't span 16, but can support stock that long. I think the 16' is a little arbitrary, other than letting finish carps know their typical long stock fits it. One actual advantage (geez, now I'm sales pitchin the thing) over te DW is the rails that fit the bottom of the saw, which allow you to pop it off when you don't want it on the stand, are longer by about 4", thereby letting you attach a wider variety of models to it. You won't fit some SCMS on the DW since their bases exceed the dimensions of the mounts.

   Wasn't a ranger. USAF Security Police, just shy of 6 years. Very glad I never had to endure an experience as challenging as Vietnam had to have been. Since our training was set up to mimic (and I say this with the broadest latitude of that term) much of what rangers went through, and for some time was even taught by them at Dix, there's a little soft spot in me for what they do.

   Utmost respect

   RW" To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

2. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 23, 2003 06:41am | #20

   RW

      I think the DW will extend to 16', but I agree that 10' is enough. I rarely work with more than 6' carcasses and rare to use over 12' raw stock. I bought one of those Ridgid swivel top adjustable supports. That would suffice for anything unsupported over 12'. BTW, those things are great with the flip top. I went back and got 3 more. I use them on the jointer, thickness planer and I was ripping 16' stock for a company project ( 40' parts counter) using them as a friction out-feed on the TS. I much prefer them over rollers.

      Don't want to run you to death, but check your Iowa and see if it is model XWC-36. I think you or another poster mentioned there were 2. Just get back when you can. I would be most appreciative, sir. The XWC-36 is the one Tool-crib has listed in the cat.

      I was impressed with the DW. I have a Hitachi C10FS and am not sure it will fit. I could retro-fit it with a ply base, I'm sure. But, were talking $100 difference. Sounds like a winner to me.

   Thanks and have a good evening...

   sarge..jt

3. 
   RW | Feb 23, 2003 09:06pm | #22

   Don't think it is. Its listing for $99, which is what the lower of the two sells for here. Here's the easy way to spot it. The cheaper of the two has two rails on the top for support, and that's it. It is decidedly less sturdy. The one I've tried and liked looks like it started life as a sawhorse. The top has metal all the way across, probably 3 1/2" wide down the sides. " To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

4. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 23, 2003 09:19pm | #23

   RW

      Gotcha... Thanks for the reply. I need to do some homework and find it.

   Have a great day...

   sarge..jt

5. 
   RW | Feb 23, 2003 11:08pm | #24

   http://www.bobstools.net/Store/28XWC36.html

   Ta Daa! $149

   " To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

6. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 24, 2003 02:11am | #25

   RW

       Now that's a good picture on the site. Gets you up close.

   Thanks for all the help...

   sarge..jt

7. 
   RW | Feb 27, 2003 03:09am | #27

   Found out even a little more . . .

   The DW goes to 106". The Iowa makes two varieties, two sizes each. The short version goes to 78", the long goes to 106". The newer version of the DW has a stop on each side, the Iowa has one, you bolt it in on the side you want it. If you want to move it, grab a wrench. " To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

8. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 27, 2003 04:18am | #28

   RW

      You do your homework. Thanks very much as that's less I have to do. I guess I can go out and play. Nope, forgot my wife grounded me. ha..ha..

      Seriously, that pretty much drives the nail in the coffin. Sounds like the best deal for my particular needs. I really appreciate your foot-work.

   Drop by any time, I leave the door open...

   sarge..jt

9. 
   RW | Feb 27, 2003 06:41am | #29

   Drop by any time, I leave the door open...

   Careful, I drove to Texas once on just such an invite. Boy was she surprised (but what a weekend!)" To the noble mind / Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind" - Wm Shakespeare, Hamlet, III,i,100

10. 
    RANGERP75R | Feb 27, 2003 10:48am | #30

    RW

        I guess the only question I could generate on that one is: Did you bring her home or leave her there? ha..ha..

        Come to think of it, might be wise to call in advance. About a year ago, my wife heard something in my shop downstairs. She went down and someone was ducking under the garage door. She opened it and they were standing between the cars in the drive-way.

        Instead of taking off the perpetrator turned and started back toward her. He changed his mind after the 1st round went over his head. (just like I trained her) He didn't stick around for the rest of the chamber. I believe *sshole and elbows would be the proper expression. ha..ha.. That's my girl.

    Have a good one, RW...

    sarge..jt

11. 
    dirtstirrer | Feb 27, 2003 06:10pm | #31

    Sarge,

        Good training!  Just got my wife a SIG.  Can't imagine anything scarier for a perp then her looking down that little barrel!

               Steve

12. 
    RANGERP75R | Feb 27, 2003 10:34pm | #32

    Steve

       Take her to the range and train her well. What you need to know that if you actually get in a live situation, adrenaline takes over and even with extensive training you will point and not aim. So, the winner is usually the one that can control the adrenaline. Or, whoever gets lucky first. Trust me. You won't know until that situation occurs for real if you can.

       Hopefully, the good sense of the perp will create the *sshole and elbows effect we mentioned. Nothing worse than getting your own weapon taken away from you and used against you. Make sure your wife is psycologically (sp) prepared to use that weapon if necessary. The alternative is foam pepper spray, which would be a better choice for most.

       Didn't mean to deliver a sermon, just fuel for thought. Been there, done that..Got the T-shirt

    Have a great day...

    sarge..jt

13. 
    dirtstirrer | Feb 28, 2003 02:55am | #33

    Sarge,

         Thanks for the advice, its much appreciated coming from you.  I too hope its never needed, but at least she can defend herself if need be.  Luckily we live on a 3000 acre farm/range, so we get to shoot a lot.  Unfortunately we are close to a highway, so we get questionable visitors periodically.  I had to move a group of suspectious men along with the help of a visible rifle not too long ago.  Seems there are people bent on doing stupid things no matter were you live. 

           I think I'm going to get an Iowa stand for my saw now too.  Before you guys were talking about them, I was all set to build one but at the prices listed, I'll just buy one.

              Steve

14. 
    RANGERP75R | Feb 28, 2003 03:29am | #34

    Steve

       I just got an e-mail from RW, and he bought one also. He doesn't like his Delta and has several saws. I am going that route also. BTW, he says plan on spending an hour or so on putting it together.

    Keep in  touch and be very polite to the Mrs., she's armed and dangerous. ha..ha..

    sarge..jt

2. 
   Mach70 | Feb 23, 2003 05:59am | #19

   I have & love the LS1013. I recently bought the new Dewalt DW723 stand and the Makita fit perfectly. A great combination:

   http://www.wood-workers.com/users/mwg/1013and723.jpg

   I made a mounting base & roller supports for use with my planer & find the stand useful for that, too:

   http://www.wood-workers.com/users/mwg/733and723.jpg

   Still looking for other uses for this well-made stand...

   --Mark

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Feb 23, 2003 06:46am | #21

      And you got a good one Mark. I used a freinds and it is great. I cannot justify the price as I am not a trim carpenter. That's why I got interested in the Iowa when RW mentioned he had used one.

      Now, if you could motorize that base and connect a bush-hog behind it you got that high brush in the yard situation covered. ha..ha..

   Have a good evening...

   sarge..jt

10. 
    BobbyD10 | Feb 24, 2003 06:00pm | #26

    Vals,  I have one that I've had for years.  Use it to crosscut all my material (except large panels).  Chose the Makita due to an analysis of the various models done a few years back in one of the woodworking publications.  I had used a radial arm but the Makita has better precision.  Also designed a dust collection bin around the machine and supports so that I can cut long boards.  It's a great machine.  I've had mine for at least 9 years.