Replies

1. 
   jonsherryl | Jun 25, 2003 07:21am | #1

   Forestgirl, just off the top of my head, it sounds like carob (Ceratonia siliqua.) It's an Old World (Mideastern) species that's now well naturalized out there. Does the wood also have a soft tan heartwood color, possibly with rust red marbling? Is it comparable in density to yellow poplar, but just slightly coarser textured? Also, did the tree produce pretty red flowers and legume type seed pods?

   ...But we're just whistling in the dark here. If your friend would like to send me a sample, I'd be happy to take a look at it. There are some other options...but I can't think of any off hand that would meet your description of a wood with relatively low density. 

1. 
   forestgirl | Jun 25, 2003 07:49am | #2

   Thanks for the fast response, Jon.  He didn't get to see the tree while it was standing, and the small stuff was already ground up when he got there, so we don't know about the flowers or seed pods.  He's going to take a closer look and probably get a sample for you too.  Maybe you could drop me an email with your address.  Got a specific sample-taking technique you want him to use??

   In the meantime, I'll see if I can find a color plate of that particular wood.  Thanks again!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   Manchild | Jun 25, 2003 02:39pm | #3

   I was thinking Magnolia Grandia flora since the sapwood and heartwood is creamy. This is off the top of my head though. I salvaged some carob and still have a hunk that is 14" X 3" X 5". Beautiful wood and smells like chocolate when you mill it. In the Los Angeles they planted them beside streets for a while. Like I said off the top of my head.

1. 
   forestgirl | Jun 25, 2003 06:33pm | #6

   Thanks for the post David.  I'll pass along the info -- Ron can check for a chocolate aroma just for fun.  If it turns out to be the Magnolia, do you have any info on how it works?  I've Googled on the Carob and seen that it turns and carves quite nicely, and has that beautiful 2-toned appearance.

   When I asked him about heartwood vs. sapwood, I'm not sure but he may have guessed that they were the same colors.  I've asked him to drag it down from the shelf and take another look.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   jonsherryl | Jun 25, 2003 06:34pm | #7

   David, I think Magnolia grandifolia is a less likely candidate than carob, given Forestgirl's clues. Actually they offer pretty useful insights for being just verbal descriptions. Carob's bark in light tannish gray and sort of leathery...vaguely like beech only a little more bumpy and/or very finely, horizontally  fissured as the tree matures.

   The fact that she described the wood as "creamy" colored actually ties in with her description of the size of the tree (obviously immature) in that carob gets much larger; Carob trees up to 50 feet tall, with diameters in the 18" to 24" range aren't uncommon...If you keep your pruning shears in the shed and let the tree grow in a competitive environment, it's very capable of taking over.

   Until the warmer, sometimes rusty red pigments begin to develop, the wood's color transitions from more of an ivory shade in the sapwood to a light yellowish or grayish tan in the center. In immature trees, the wood is actually pretty bland and looks very much like some of the softer and lighter colored lauans. While it's not as coarse textured or as stringy as most of the lauans, it displays a similar abundance of slightly darker pore flecks, and is otherwise almost figureless in the anatomical sense. With age, the heartwood usually transitions away from this bland tan hue and takes on a progressively warmer tint...If you're lucky, eventually the heartwood may pick up some marble-like pigmentation...and, when it does, it's very attractive. In fact, cutting into a carob log can be a real adventure, in that until you pop it open, you never really know if you've hit the jackpot with good pigmentation.

   Anyway, we don't know if it's carob yet and there are a lot of other species with some of these same characteristics. After all, we're talking southern California here and It could be just about anything. The "easy living," balmy warm climate out there acts like a magnet in attracting strange fruits and noxious odd-balls from all over the world...and, once established they tend to spread out and make themselves at home...This has even become true of that region's now much manipulated and adulterated flora.  :O)

   If it is carob, your comment about the chocolate scent is another clue. The carob bean pods are edible and used as animal fodder. The beans themselves (and the sweet pod pulp) are sometimes ground up to make a chocolate substitute for human consumption...but the tree is not closely related to chocolate (cacao) which is in the family; Sterculiaceae. The irony here for chocolate lovers is that cacoa's family name traces back to the Latin word for dung (stercus), because the foliage of some of the Old World species in this family (primarily African) have a very foul odor. Even though carob does have a mild, characteristic (although much less potent) chocolate-like scent, it belongs to the Legume family: Leguminosae, and is more closely related to the locusts, mesquites and acacias. 

   Edited 6/25/2003 12:54:37 PM ET by Jon Arno

1. 
   Manchild | Jun 25, 2003 08:31pm | #8

   Thank you very much Jon. I had the feeling I was in deep water here. My piece of carob must be from an older tree because it is a beautiful red with streaks of darker red going through it. One side does have some creamy sapwood though. thanks again, David

2. 
   Lazarus | Jun 25, 2003 11:16pm | #9

   I only have one comment...

   WOW!LazarusRemeber, "Wisdom is the toughest of teachers! She gives the test first and the lesson after."

3. 
   JsHerbel | Jun 25, 2003 06:06pm | #4

   Do you really think that anyone could could identify what tree this is from the description you gave?

1. 
   forestgirl | Jun 25, 2003 06:19pm | #5

   I provided all the information I had.  I asked "Any ideas?"  Jon and others will provide some ideas, and we'll go from there.  Do you have anything constructive to add?  No.  OK, I'll proceed to get a sample of the wood and send it to Jon.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)