Replies

1. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 26, 2008 02:07am | #1

   Bri

   My eyes are getting worse by the year, but that sure looks an awful lot like cherry to me.  I have lots of cherry in the shed, and the boards close to the perimeter of the tree have alot of the colors that are in your board. 

   'Most' chestnut has wormholes in it from the blight, and chestnut also has a grain characteristic similar to oak, without the flecks.

   I'll quote, "The heartwood is pale brown in color with wide growth rings producing a pronounced figure on longitudinal surfaces.  It is generally similar to oak in appearance except that the absense of broad rays means that chestnut does not have the "silver ray" figure of oak."

   The smaller piece, with the crotchwood in it, definately looks the same as about 20 pieces of cherry crotch I milled up last year.

   Jeff

    

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 02:23am | #2

   Thanks Jeff. If it turned out to be Cherry I wouldn't be too terribly disappointed but I have worked with a lot of Cherry and this isnt like any Cherry I've ever seen. I know this is hard to do online.

   Thanks again, Brian

1. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 26, 2008 02:53am | #4

   There's black cherry, and then there's choke cherry.  Around here, choke cherry's get to be quite huge, and in excess of 24" in diameter.  The pinkish, yellowish wood you have is quite similar to some choke cherry's I have milled.

   Jeff

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 08:43am | #9

   OK, now that's one I hadn't heard of. Still thinking this is going to be American Chestnut. I just stumbled on something good. ;)

   Thanks Jeff,

   Brian

2. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 28, 2008 05:17pm | #34

   After seeing photo's of the endgrain, it definately isn't cherry.  Cherry end grain planes up smooth as glass with a sharp plane or chisel. 

   I hope you send a sample off to Bob.  I'm very curious as to what species you have there.  Good luck.

   Discovering the species of mystery wood is always tantalizing to me.  It must be boring around here!

   Jeff

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 29, 2008 06:54am | #39

   I will have it in the mail tomorrow and I will be sure and post the results. Thx again for all your help. Brian

2. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 02:24am | #3

   Oh ya, The point about worm holes is excellent. Don't think there are any. Hmmmmm.

   Brian

3. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 08:52am | #11

   Warren, my "wood Guru" told me that that smaller piece isn't actually crotch. It's compression wood from a heavy branch applying pressure over the years. Kinda cool.

   Later, Brian

2. 
   JohnWW | Jan 26, 2008 03:07am | #5

   American chestnuts large enough to cut into lumber are rare to say the least.  Did your source say where this tree turned up?

   John W. 

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 08:36am | #8

   No, but I'll be sure to ask. He recently showed me one of his "stash" trailers. Loaded with the stuff. I'm thinking of just slowly buying it up and storing it. Most of it is plank, 4"-6" thick 8"-10" wide and various lengths. About 10' being the max. Also plenty of 4/4 panel size.

   Thanks for your reply,

   Brian

1. 
   BobSmalser | Jan 26, 2008 08:44am | #10

   Chestnut that size would be reclaimed lumber. It is ring-porous and looks like oak, although often a tad darker in color. No rays like oak however, and it is significantly lighter in weight.

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 08:55am | #12

   Man  I love this site. I'm learning all kinds of stuff. Reclaimed from where do you think? Like logs from under water or something?

   I can't wait to call my guy tomorrow and find out.

   Thanks for the reply,

   Brian

1. 
   BobSmalser | Jan 26, 2008 09:17am | #13

   Chestnut is very durable. In the 1950's my family reclaimed downed logs from trees that died decades before and milled it into "wormy chestnut" trim. The farmhouse I grew up in had wormy chestnut as interior trim. Chestnut was also reclaimed from old beams and even by dismantling ancient log cabins.Look at the end grain. If yours isn't ring porous like oak, it isn't chestnut.There's only one sure-fire method to ID wood, and that's with a 10X hand lens, slices of end and face grain, and a basic book like Hoadley's Identifying Wood or one of the more sophisticated botanical keys.You can Amazon yourself a copy, or mail me a slice of end grain and I'll key it out for you under the microscope.

   Edited 1/26/2008 1:20 am by BobSmalser

2. 
   BriMcG | Jan 27, 2008 04:58am | #19

   Wow Bob, That's a really nice offer! I really don't want to put you to that trouble though. I am 99.9% sure it is actually Chestnut. Folks have suggested Cherry, Red Elm and Ash but this stuff matches what I have googled etc.

   Thanks again, Brian

3. 
   BriMcG | Jan 27, 2008 07:14am | #23

   Hi Bob, I took some closeups of the endgrain using Dan' advice and did a quicky uneducated comparison at a couple sites he sent me (above). Looks like Chestnut to me.

   I'll attach the shots here too. If your offer is still open and these photos don't quite fit the bill, I would like to send you a sample for comparison purposes.

   Thanks! Brian

   Edited 1/26/2008 11:15 pm ET by BriMcG

   
4. 
   BobSmalser | Jan 27, 2008 07:34am | #24

   As a forest biologist, I find myself doing a lot of this. Sorry, there are no warm fuzzies without the microscope and key. Way too many similar species out there.Here is a representative group of experienced boatbuilders in four countries dead sure this planking is Doug Fir....when it wasn't. And in that trade it's a biggie getting the replacement right because of differences in seasonal wood movement.http://www.woodenboatvb.com/vbulletin/upload/showthread.php?t=62354

   Edited 1/27/2008 5:17 am by BobSmalser

5. 
   BriMcG | Jan 27, 2008 10:13am | #25

   Thanks Bob, If you have an address you would feel comfortable giving me I would like to send you a piece. What..about a half inch of end grain?

   Thanks, Brian

3. 
   ohcomeon | Jan 26, 2008 06:43am | #6

   That is certainly not cherry.  In fact I think it is chestnut or at least a related species.  I have some small pieces that I salvaged from a stump when we lost a chestnut (American) in a hurricane and it looks very much like that.  The slight pinkish color is not the same, but the yellowish is, and the grain and figure is dead-on.

   American chestnut is not extinct; they are quite common.  The problem is that due to the blight that afflicts them they often don't get very big and they begin to fall apart.  Our neighbors have three that are starting to look pretty scraggly, but the main boles are consistent with the size lumber you have.

   I don't know how it will work out for your intended use, but the small amount I have seems to be somewhat unstable and I'd worry about the humidity in the bathroom.

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 26, 2008 08:28am | #7

   Thanks very much for the reply. I can understand how someone might mistake it for some poor quality Cherry I suppose but this is going to be Chestnut. It has an open pore system unlike Cherry I believe. But I'm sure no expert. 

   Not very stable huh? Even if it's sealed with a marine type poly? Sure would like to use it but won't if it's going to go haywire on me.

   Thanks again!

   Brian

1. 
   ohcomeon | Jan 26, 2008 10:11pm | #17

   The ring porous structure was evident from the pics and was one of the giveaways that it wasn't cherry (and looked like Chestnut).

   I may be off the mark with the wood movement since I based that on the short pieces I cut from the stump.  Lots of crazy grain and the length prevented me from stickering it effectively.

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 28, 2008 06:26am | #28

   Hi and thanks again. I posted a couple more closeups for Dan if you're interested.

   Thanks, Brian

2. 
   SteveSchoene | Jan 28, 2008 06:14pm | #35

   Compression wood and the like can be unstable if it's in applications where it can move. 

   Interestingly enough, marine spar varnish (all of the best single part marine spar varnishes use traditional resin, no urethane) isn't the best choice for sealing wood from the effects of water vapor.  Shellac is far better for that.  It's only problems with water come if it stands in liquid water for extended periods.  The things that marine spar varnish is designed for are flexibility and UV protection.  Water isn't the enemy on boats, UV light is. 

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 29, 2008 06:53am | #38

   Good to know, thanks. And I am going to have to be extra careful when cutting that one chunk and give it some time to adjust to what it wants to do before cutting it for rails and stiles.

   Thx again, Brian

4. 
   sleepydad | Jan 26, 2008 04:25pm | #14

   I have cut lots of cherry,oak, ash,hickory ... and I have seen red elm that looks exactly like that.

   the green yellow mustard and the grain pattern looks like a red elm branch.

    

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 27, 2008 04:50am | #18

   Thanks, Will look it up. Brian

5. 
   trialnut | Jan 26, 2008 05:51pm | #15

   I do believe you have the real deal. I have an 86 acre plot that has at least 100 American Chestnut trees on it, some of which are nearly a foot in dia. Most get the blight at about 4"~6" dia. An adjacent plot has one big old tree that is about 2 1/2'. I have cut some of these after they died and did not find worm holes. As long as the wood is properly dried before use you should have no problem with it in a bathroom as the heartwood is highly rot resistant.

   Rich

   The Professional Termite

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 28, 2008 06:44am | #29

   Sorry to take so long in replying. Appreciate the info. Where abouts are you located? I'm not sure where Chestnut grows.

   Brian

1. 
   trialnut | Jan 29, 2008 05:37am | #36

   I'm in the western end of New York State. Not very many places around here have much Chestnut left growing but my place is on one of the highest elevations around so the soil type is a little different. There are quite a few plant species that grow wild up there that are not normally found in this area.

   RichThe Professional Termite

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 29, 2008 06:49am | #37

   A little chilli right about now? I lived upstate (Ithaca) for a number of years when I was a kid and I can remember how cold it got. Brrrr. And I'm thinking of retiring in Maine...Jeeez.

   Later, Brian

6. 
   jquinn | Jan 26, 2008 08:29pm | #16

   the old pieces of chestnut I've bought off ebay don't have that pinkish hue.  its a solid dark tan - not that it can't change tones over the years like so many other woods when exposed to light.  it also has fairly large pores, and is about half as heavy as oak.

   I don't know if it could be chinese chestnut.  I don't think every tree will harge bore holes from worms (of the new ones anyways).

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 27, 2008 05:29am | #20

   Most of the plank Chestnut he had didn't have the yellowish and pink coloring. The wider pieces did. The planks were a dark tan, open pored and resembles Oak but lighter in weight/density. Think I have the real thing here.

   The only thing that bugs (pardon the pun) is I don't remember seeing any worm holes on any of it. I wasn't looking specifically for them because I don't know squat about Chestnut. Well not then, I have learned a ton from you folks.

   Thanks!

   Brian

    

7. 
   Daninvan | Jan 27, 2008 06:08am | #21

   Use a block plane to clean off a small section of the end grain. Take a photo with a macro lens, or your digital camera in its 'close up' mode (often indicated by a flower on your camera's controls). Compare the picture to end grain photos of chestnut, cherry, or whatever else you think it might be. Photos are available here:

   http://www.lib.ncsu.edu/specialcollections/forestry/hough/common.html

   and

   http://www.hobbithouseinc.com/personal/woodpics/chestnut.htm

   Good luck!

   Dan

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 27, 2008 07:08am | #22

   Thanks Dan! Well, I took the closeups and as far as I can tell it's Chestnut.The rings are a good match and the examples of the planks are pretty well right on. I've attached my shots, what do you think? Having trouble with IrfanView tonight, hope they come through OK. Do you use Irfanview?

   Brian

   
1. 
   Daninvan | Jan 28, 2008 03:50am | #26

   Yeah, I think that's a bit rough still. Can you clean it up with a sharp plane or chisel? The details will pop out a lot more clearly if you do so.Dan

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 28, 2008 06:23am | #27

   Hi Dan, This is the other end with a before and after shot.

   Thanks, Brian

   
1. 
   Daninvan | Jan 28, 2008 09:27am | #31

   Brian,Hi, I tried planing the end of a piece of chestnut I have and it wound up pretty fuzzy looking like yours. A piece of cherry on the other hand cut quite cleanly. I should have tried that first before I said anything!Dan

2. 
   BriMcG | Jan 28, 2008 11:18am | #33

   Could be the photographer too. Tried my best with a scary sharp chisel. Sending Bob a sample for a definitive answer.

   Thx again, Brian

8. 
   Tinkerer3 | Jan 28, 2008 08:41am | #30

   Some years ago, I was doing non-related research at a farm whose owner was building a new house - out of chestnut which had been cut years earlier before chestnut was really infected much.  A neighbor noticed what he was doing and said, "You shouldn't be using chestnut for framing a house.  Let me trade SPF for the chestnut."  The trade was made and and the farmer finished with SPF, only saving enough chestnut for the trim.

       I am very inexperienced in identifying wood, but what I saw didn't look like your wood.  In my humble opinion, the grain looked more like oak, only more so.  Suggest you take up the offer of the other poster in making a positive identification.

1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 28, 2008 11:12am | #32

   Thanks very much. Am sending him samples ASAP.

   Thx again, Brian

9. 
   ripleylynn | Jan 29, 2008 04:04pm | #40

   Brian,

   I just finished a bookcase made of chestnut, the beams were barn beams from about 80 years ago.  I have one small piece left.  If I get a chance today, I'll take a pic.   I've attached a pic of the bookcase, but as you can see it was stained.  But as others have said, it's sort of "oak-like" and does have wormy holes in it.  I'll try to get a pic of the last few pieces I have. 

   
1. 
   BriMcG | Jan 30, 2008 07:35am | #41

   That describes my stuff pretty closely. Really nice job on the bookcase. Looks great stained. What did you use?

   Brian

10. 
    BobSmalser | Feb 06, 2008 07:36pm | #42

    Referencing Pashin and DeZeew, your sample has the following:

    Straight grained, light in weight, moderately hard.
    Growth rings conspicuous.
    Earlywood pores exceptionally large, several pores in width.
    Transition between early and late abrupt.
    Latewood pores small and obliquely arranged. Vessels numerous.
    Rays very narrow and indistinct.

    Most likely reclaimed American Chestnut, complete with borers in the sapwood.

1. 
   BriMcG | Feb 07, 2008 07:42am | #43

   Bob...You rock! I consider that definitive. Thanks very much. I now intend to grab quite a bit more first chance I get.

   Thanks again!

   Brian