Replies

1. 
   danmart | Mar 06, 2009 09:06pm | #1

   Stumps: there can be good wood in the stumps. Some guys like me(rifle builders/gun stockers) love the natural curves you find in the tree trunks.

   Its a bunch of work. I have had my best luck working with a guy who owns a horizontal bandsaw. He works by the hour when he is doing this kind of thing for me. We spend most of the time rotating the stumps. (I don't think I would want to work the stumps up onto a flat bed and transport to a sawyer.) If you have room and a good tractor you can get creative.

   Tip: Get the stumps as clean as you can. The dirt eats up the blades. I usually slab cut them about 10/4 and 12/4 for stocks.

   Don't know where you are from your profile(NE), but the wood I search out is sugar maple and red maple when I get back up to Maine and NH. Even if the wood has no curly or birdseye figure, the natural crook is worth the trouble in my case.

   good luck and get a good pair of gloves

   dan

    

   
1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 06, 2009 09:26pm | #2

   thanks Dan,

   The pictures look awesome.

   It just so happens I own a portable mill and a full size backhoe, so as I said, I have the tools. I just wasn't sure if it was worth the trouble. By the looks of your pictures it certainly is better than paying to haul them away for pine bark mulch.

   I would seriously like to get some more advice on how to approach the situation though if you can help? Or if anyone has done this before.

   I know from looking at the stumps, some of which have been out of the ground almost two years now, that there are some rocks in the roots the tree grew around. I can pressure wash the dirt out of them and maybe cut the ends of the roots off, but I'm not sure how best to approach cutting the stumps themselves to yield the best looking lumber.

   Any help would be appreciated.

   Thanks,

   Pete

2. 
   danmart | Mar 06, 2009 10:21pm | #3

   Well it sounds like you have all of the stuff to do some nice work. You make some decisions based on the  wood, size of the stump and what you want.

   Here are some things I consider and how I begin cutting.

   1.     With large stumps, I center cut once I have the stump fixed to the base of the saw track. I do this with cargo straps not just the weight of the stump. If it rolls you are going to have surprises. I learned the hard way.

   2.     Once you open up the stump you will see the grain and all of the other surprises(good and bad) that come with sawyer work.

   3.     If the surface is large and interesting with a nice curve to the base, I begin cutting 2” slabs. If there is minimal checking,  you have the makings of some nice book-matched stock. Your call.

   4.     If you have a forked root base with 2 roots of a good size, you have a good crotch possibility if  cut with the roots going out to form a Y. Nice stuff and easy to spot. The tricky part here is getting the stump/log oriented just right for the cut.

   Some other things I need to mention. I cut my stumps as green as possible. I can leave the walnut longer than the others but I get em’ when they are green. I do not cut hickory logs or hickory anything else unless I do it the day I fell the tree. That’s that.

   Sawblades and dry hickory are not a good match in my view.

   Once you cut the wood, get it out of the sun and stacked well.

   dan

1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 06, 2009 10:56pm | #4

   Thanks Dan,

   All excellent information, and I will heed your warning.

   One question, you talk about strapping it down to the bed of the saw but I can't picture that without obviously cutting through the strap at one point somewhere along the line. Can you give a few extra details on this so I don't kill myself? :)

   The mill I have is a portable woodmizer LT40 if that helps at all.

   Pete

1. 
   danmart | Mar 07, 2009 02:19am | #5

   Pete

   I just looked thru my ton of pictures and I didn't have any photos of cutting wood with the Mizer. It is not mine but I have reasonable access to it. Its there when I need to use it at a fair market price.

   I will see if I can dig up a little mock up or take a smaller scale photo. Its not complicated, I just need to think of an easy way to get the info to you.

   If you contact me directly by email, I won't bore the other readers with my responses.

   Where are you? Anywhere near southwest NH?

   photos:possibilities

   maple stump cuts from sugar maple(rifle stock)

   walnut log cuts 

   I search for curves for the rifle stocks. As you can see on the rifle stack, the wrist area is thin and the direction of the grain is very important for strength.

   Like making a spindle for a windsor chair, the grain direction makes the strength.

   dan

   
1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 07, 2009 02:57am | #8

   Dan, I'm down near Gillette Stadium in the Mass/RI boarder. My e-mail is: [email protected]

2. 
   flairwoodworks | Mar 07, 2009 08:51pm | #9

   Dan,Keep posting here. I've been reading this thread with interest.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)

    - Success is not the key to happiness.  Happiness is the key to success.  If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer

2. 
   BCFred | Mar 09, 2009 07:44pm | #11

   I cut fairly large (10-16 inch), awkward, short pieces of various fruit woods on an LT40 like you own and it's tough.  The wood was mostly 80 and 90 year old apple and apricot and it was just beautiful.  So it was worth the effort.  The first problem I ran into was the pieces were just too short to catch two stakes.  I flattened one side with a power saw so the pieces would lay flat on the bed, this also allows the dog to catch them securely on the other side, which as you know is important for holding them securely.  Come to think of it, cutting down the center is probably better as has been suggested before.  Then I bolted them to a strong piece of wood long enough to catch two stakes and dogged them securely.  This allowed me to flat saw them into slabs.  With a couple of big pieces I used lag bolts to hold them.  You want to be sure you have the piece held securely.  As I'm sure you know, the blade will lift the piece when you are cutting if you don't.  I got away with 5 or 6 deck 4 inch deck screws through a 2x4 on some of the smaller pieces, but I would use at least 1/4 inch lag screws now.  It's the kind of project that is time consuming and one wants to be careful, of course.  The wood has to be worth it, in other words, and one needs a sense of adventure.  Fred

1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 10, 2009 09:29pm | #12

   Thanks to all who replied.

   This is all good information, however, many of the stumps I have are ones that have been around for a year or more (out of the ground and piled up). I do however have a small apple tree ( about 10 inches in diameter) that will be coming out shortly and that may be a good project to try this out on. That is because it is a small piece to work with.

   I appreciate all information and if anyone has pictures they would like to share, I would appreciate that too.

   Up here in the Northeast, if it isn't snowing and freezing, it's melting and muddy. :( so in a few weeks I should be able to take on this project and I will post some pictures if I can.

   Thanks to all who replied.

   Pete

1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 11, 2009 01:53pm | #13

   Hi Folks,

   I have added a photo of one White Ash stump I have. It seems in the photo you can see ridges as the stump transitions from the tree trunk to the roots. It would be my opinion that this would be an area where I would see some figure in the wood if I can harvest it. Am I correct? Does white Ash really have figure or is this just some weird anomaly. I would assume this is the kind of stuff I would be looking for in harvesting stumps.

   Thanks,

   Pete

   
2. 
   KeithNewton | Mar 12, 2009 04:54am | #18

   Pete, There is indeed some figure in the Ash stump. However, I think I see something which resembles mushrooms growing out of the bottom portion of the stump. This is not a good sign. Mushrooms are the fruiting body of rot. For most white woods, you really need to work them shortly after they are down. I will offer the suggestion again that you go at some of it with your chain-saw. I think you will find a lot of gray wood, and probably even a fair amount of insect infestation by now. You have waited too long for these woods.

3. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 12, 2009 01:15pm | #20

   Thanks Keith,

   You are correct, those are mushrooms on that stump. I think you may be correct on the fact that I have waited far too long on these stumps, but I have learned a lot from all the input everyone has given. These stumps may in fact become bark mulch, however, the next time a tree comes down on this five acre property, the stump will come out with it and I won't wait so long to do something with it.

   Peter

4. 
   KeithNewton | Mar 12, 2009 04:27pm | #21

   Peter, Your profile doesn't give any information such as location, which would be helpful for those who answer many questions. So I have no idea whether you live in a location that might have soft loam soil, or a more rocky location. Even under the best circumstances, I am smirking as I anticipate your coming back to share your experience. Now that you are on the path to harvesting stumps, you should start paying attention to the bark. You can learn to read the bark to anticipate what the figure under it will be.

5. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 12, 2009 10:20pm | #22

   Hi Keith,

   I have updated my profile, new here, and I am in Massachusetts. My area has very rocky tight soils and a lot of ledge as I found out during the construction. :(

   I have been reading bark, leaves and twigs all my life. However, that doesn't mean I fully understand them. :) I have been harvesting trees for firewood all my life. I think I had my first chainsaw at the age of twelve, and the trees began to tremble. :)

   That's one of the reasons I picked up the sawmill, I wanted to know what was inside. I have seen the oddities of the exterior, but wondered what underneath the bark had caused what I could see. Plus, I have always had a love for woodworking, which my ex-wife hated. Notice I said "ex wife" and now you know why I spend more time on this site now. :)

   My big project right now, besides cleaning up the property, is setting up my new wood shop. I planned this new house with a straight basement, no poles, that is 60 feet long by 15 feet wide. Sure beats the 14 x 10 spot I started out in. :)

3. 
   KeithNewton | Mar 07, 2009 02:26am | #6

   I am not so sure that I would even bother with the trees that you describe. While I will agree that you can get some great figure in the stump, I don't necessarily see it in all species. It is a lot of work, and that great figure is proportional to the size of the tree. Large trees have the most figure, while smaller ones don't.

   That being said, the best figure is near the outside of those large trees, and on the tops of those largest roots, which means your cuts need to be along the margins where they come together, which is also where the stones and dirt are captured between the roots as the tree got larger, so count on a lot of dulling.

   Of the trees that you mentioned, the maple would be the only one that I would consider, then only if it was one of the larger ones. You can strike the bark at an angle of about 45º to knock some bark off, if the wood isn't too dry. This will show the grain pattern, which will give you an idea of whether it is worth going after.

   However, if you are not familiar with how it should look, you will be seeing flat-cut figure, while maple is best viewed as rift or QS, so if you like what you see under the bark, you will like it better once sawn.

   Before you commit to taking much of this to your mill, I would suggest that you just take your chain-saw and try cutting out one large root. You can cut in from each side, letting the kerf meet in the back as a V toward the heart. After you have done one, you should have a pretty good idea whether it will be worth your effort.

   Keep in mind, If you are not into making gun stocks. What will you use this wood for once it dries? I hope this helps, and good luck.

4. 
   BruceS | Mar 07, 2009 02:28am | #7

   As for the Maple.  Set them in the woods !   They will grow fine Oyster & Lions Mane mushrooms.  #### too if you inoculate them with culture plugs.  Yum Yum.

   Work Safe,  Count to 10 when your done for the day !!

   Bruce S. 

    

5. 
   WillGeorge | Mar 09, 2009 12:59pm | #10

   I'd say BE SURE to cut up the stumps BEFORE they sit around awhile. They turn into iron in about a few days!

6. 
   WillGeorge | Mar 11, 2009 08:25pm | #14

   It's against the law to bury them or burn them

   And maybe a 'stump stand' for a garden table?

1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 11, 2009 08:59pm | #15

   Kind of strange to say it's against the law to bury something you had to dig up in the first place, huh?

   I thought of leaving them burried and having a wood carver come in to make them into bears or fish or who knows what else, but they were in my way so they had to come out.

   I was going to line them up and backfill against one side to make a retaining wall, that way if one sides open they are not technically burried. :)

   Another thought was to flip them upside down and bury the trunk portion, then make bird baths or bird feeders out of the root ball.

   I have a vivid imagination, and my town hates me for it. :))

   When they wrote the laws, they didn't anticipate me. :)

   Pete

2. 
   Jammersix | Mar 12, 2009 06:47am | #19

   There is a large world out there. It is not against the law everywhere.There are even places where there is no law for it to be against.

7. 
   Quickstep | Mar 11, 2009 10:01pm | #16

   From a slightly Different angle......

   As Brazilian Rosewood started to become rarer and rarer, people began to go back and harvest the stumps for use in guitars. Luthiers also call it "compression" wood because the weight of the tree affects the grain at the base, producing wavy and curly grain. Also, as you noted, there can be some wild grain where the trunk transitions to the roots. Between the compression and the transition, it seems like there could be some wild wood. That said, it is probably fairly unstable as well. As a lover of wild grained wood, I'd love to see what you can get out of it. I have a guitar made of stump wood and it's got some quite wild grain. I love it.

1. 
   ShakerMills | Mar 11, 2009 10:33pm | #17

   Thanks for your comments Quickstep.

   I too am wondering how stable the wood will be. I have dealt with crotch wood before and ended up just cutting it out of the project because it was hard to deal with. I figure there will be unstable areas in the stump to root connection as well.

   But hell, what's life without adventure, right!