I have been finishing for 25+ years, spraying aniline dyes and various methods but I had little experience with gels. They are supposed to be foolproof for even beginners. I recently tried using a Minway mahogany gel stain on an oak bench. I brushed it on and wiped with a rag, and found that when doing it in sections, it was almost always possible to see the transition from onesection to another. The stain dried quickly and when I applied the adjacent section the solvent in the gel essentially dissolved the stain in the zone of overlap between adjacent sections and lightened it, allowing some of that stain to be wiped off with the rag. I also found it to be very sensitive to showing the imprint of the cloth weave from the rag if I hesitated for a fraction of a second and had to begin my wipe from the unstained area toward the stained area or you would see the imprint at the poiunt of first contact of the rag. Is there a better technique to use this stuff? Thanks for the advice.
Jay
Replies
I have used Minwax gel stains on red oak with no problem. The oak was sanded ending at 150 grit. The gel stain was put on thickly in the direction of the grain with a paper towel. I then wiped it off (without extreme pressure) with paper towels. My guess is that you are putting it on too thin or in a work area that is far too warm. My task was done at about 70 degrees F. You might be wiping the gel off without leaving a thick enough layer. You have to wipe off by a minute or two after application before the stain becomes real sticky..
Sounds familiar. But I like the stuff, so I rub it on, rub it out and rub it off in one step - same rag. I'd rather apply another coat that fix a line or blotch.
Joe
Jay,
Funny that you would bring up the subject. Last week I tried some Bartley's Gel Stain for the first time. I was able to get a perfectly blotched, uneven surface. Not a product that I will try again.
-Jerry
There are a number of manufacturers of gel stains. They each have different characteristics. I recommend you try another brand that may work better for you. I generally use ZAR or Bartley. Also, I rarely use a gel stain on virgin wood. Most often I apply a wash coat of shellac and then apply the gel stain on top of that. This way, the stain goes on more evenly and does not become unworkable as quickly.
Had the same problem. I was working with cherry. I raised the grain with water, put on a trans tint dye, sealed with shellac. At that point all looked well.
When I started to put on the gel stain as a glaze, I found it to be hard to get even. The only thing I could do was to keep the rag damp with naptha to stop it from drying too quick.
I will try something different next time.
Next time, seal the dye with a wash coat of 1# cut shellac. Then apply the gel stain. The shellac wash coat will prevent the solvents in the gel stain from being rapidly absorbed into the wood giving you much more time to even out the coloring.Howie.........
As stated in my post, I sealed the dye with shellac. The gel stain was setting up on its own quickly. That stuff holds a lot of pigment. Once it starts to set up, it is not easy to even the color out again. Naptha will soften it, but the color gets washed out, and you need to start again.
I have found that when you seal with shellac, pigment stains of all kinds go on more evenly but the color is more washed out, and even with multiple coats it is difficult to achieve the depth of color possible on virgin wood. In this case, I needed a dark color to match a table.
Is there a way to prolong the open time of these gels, analagous to a lacquer retarder? Maptha is so volatile that it generally dries things even faster than they would dry on their own. I'm not sure I followed how naptha would help. Thanks again.
Jay
>> go on more evenly but the color is more washed out,Yes, absolutely true. The shellac impedes the absorption of the stain. That's its intend. You need to apply a second coat of gel stain or use a darker color.Howie.........
The shellac cut also affects the degree of absorption. The last project I tried several different cuts between the recommended wash coat cut to a 2lb cut to get the finish I wanted. The furniture finish wizard website has some great discussions about this.
Brad
Edited 7/7/2008 4:04 pm ET by brad805
How much color change can you get with additional coats? I have tried without much success. I came to the conclusion the pores would not accept much more after the first coat, but then again I am no expert.
Brad
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