Replies

1. 
   RickL | Jun 06, 2006 11:50pm | #1

   Those knives should be an off the shelf item. Places like Freud, Amana, Charles Schmidt, http://www.woodtechtooling.com would be able to set you up. 4,000 to 5,000 rpm of the cutterhead should be about right. I'd look up the specs on comparable machines to verify hp and rpm. There's tons of online calculators to figure appropriate pulley sizes. It shouldn't cost that much. Do you need the gibs that hold the knives in?  Poke around at http://www.owwm.com to find out what you have. Delta techs can id off a casting number often.

   It may not be a Delta. The 4" delta jointers I recall were fairly short bed machines.

2. 
   JohnWW | Jun 07, 2006 12:06am | #2

   Unless the machine has been abused it is probably as good as new, actually quite a bit better.  The Delta 4 inch jointers were miniature industrial weight machines, real jewels. 

   Any blade sharpening service should be able to supply the blades, I've also seen them at some on line sites, and they are in the Grizzly catalog.  The blades on these machines were meant to be resharpened so the blades you have may only need to be reground.  If you don't have the blades, do you have the gibs and screws that lock the blades in place, if they are missing you will have a problem. 

   The motor should be a 1/3 or 1/2 hp and the cutter head should turn at around 4,200 to 4,500 rpm.  Pulley sizes will depend on the motor speed and the pulley on the jointer, which can have an odd shaft diameter.  About the only problem I've seen on these older jointers is that they were run with a loose pulley that damaged the end of the shaft.

   John White, Shop Manager, Fine Woodworking Magazine

1. 
   user-164420 | Jun 07, 2006 09:02pm | #8

   John:
   Showing my ignorance here, and lack of experience, but not sure what a gib is on a joiner. What do they look like? I assume they fit in the same slot the knives fit in? The joiner in question has all of it's screws for the knives. The price is $15.00.Tyler

1. 
   JohnWW | Jun 07, 2006 10:58pm | #9

   A gib is a 5/16" square or 1/4" by 3/8" rectangular bar, 4" long, with four or five small hex head bolts in it, that, when backed out, press the gib against the knife locking it in place.  A few machines had oddball ways of mounting their knives, but 99% of them used gibs like I described. 

   Gibs get lost when someone takes the knives out to be sharpened and then never gets around to reinstalling new knives.  Eventually, usually years later, someone finally decides to sell the machine and the gibs are long lost.  Because gibs are, in fact, not simple square stock, they are very difficult to replace if lost.

   If the machine is cast iron, and basically in good shape, it is worth buying and returning to use.  Generally, it isn't worth investing any time or money in the cast aluminum versions of these small jointers unless it is a high end European or Japanese made machine.  A few low end machines didn't have table height adjusters on the outfeed table and these aren't worth buying either, since they are very difficult to get to cut properly.

   If you could identify the machine's maker and, ideally, a model number I could possibly give you some more specific advice.  If make and model aren't available often times the paint color can be a good clue as to the maker.

   If you decide to pass on this machine I might be interested in buying it.

   John White 

3. 
   mike4244 | Jun 07, 2006 12:16am | #3

   Sounds like the old Rockwell Delta I had 45 years ago. Used a 1/2 hp motor,do not recall the pulley size.Almost any manufacturer of joiner knives will carry them.If I recall they are 5/8" wide,1/8" thick and 4-1/8" long. Call Delta and you may be able to get the manual and specs.This is a good machine,sorry I sold it. Believe it or not I paid $75.00 brand new at JC Penneys.At that time they sold some smaller power tools and were selling off all inventory of power tools. The 1/2 hp motor is more than enough to run this machine, you may be able to run it with a 1/3hp motor.

   My jointer was not a table top,had legs or sheet metal stand, do not recall which.Both tables are ajustable,only adjust the infeed once you set it up. The outfeed table had a tendency to slip down. After aligning the tables if you have to, make sure the outfeed table jib bolts are tight,use locktite on the bolts.

   mike

4. 
   PADDYDAHAT | Jun 07, 2006 12:59am | #4

   JT, if it's a lite blue it may be an old Dunlop (also sold by Sears with both names on it), a light casting with zinc cast mount on the fence end and a zinc pork chop type swing away guard over the cutters and oil caps on top of the bearings. Mine is 4.5" and I love it for small boxes and drawer parts. If you have the gibs the blades should be easy. Enjoy, Pat

5. 
   PeteBradley | Jun 07, 2006 04:10am | #5

   It depends. Is it free? Do you have a motor kicking around that you can use? The old Rockwell/Deltas are fine machines for the kind of work you describe, but total value of a 4" in running condition is in the neighborhood of $75.

   Assume you'll need bearings. The old ones use extended race bearings but you should be able to get a pair for less than $20 from a bearing supplier.

   Pete

1. 
   JohnWW | Jun 07, 2006 03:26pm | #6

   I wouldn't assume that the bearings need replacement.  I have a number of machines from the 1930's, 40's, and 50's that are still running on their original bearings.  In fact I have very rarely replaced bearings on any old machine and I've owned dozens of them.  Unless the bearings are showing clear signs of problems they can be left alone.

   John White, Shop manager, Fine Woodworking Magazine

1. 
   PeteBradley | Jun 07, 2006 07:02pm | #7

   I'm going to have to respectfully disagree on this one. If the bearings are cheap and easy to get to as they are on this jointer, it makes sense to replace them. There's no question that a lot of old bearings will continue running, but a bad bearing can do considerable damage before a problem becomes noticeable. For example, my jointer (1950s Yates-American) came with a Delta motor that had run for some time with a seized bearing. The machine isn't terribly loud, but the bearing noise was not noticable with the belt on. The shaft was worn to the point where the inner race could spin freely. That wound up being a much more complicated repair than a bearing swap (although I wouldn't recommend surgery on many older small Delta motors to a beginner anyway). Worse yet and sometimes fatal is to have the bearing eat into the outer bore.Pete

   Edited 6/7/2006 12:08 pm ET by PeteBradley

6. 
   mudman | Jun 08, 2006 06:55am | #10

   Those old bench top jointer are great machines. They should be perfect for your work. I would recomend getting the smallest (lightest) motor that will do the job, so it will be easy to move from the bench to a shelf for storage.

   Mike

   Pardon my spelling,

   Mike

   Make sure that your next project is beyond your skill and requires tools you don't have. You won't regret it.

1. 
   user-164420 | Jun 11, 2006 06:46am | #11

   Well I got the joiner.
   Your previous posts have been helpful in finding knives and pulley info
   Here are the details.
   Four and quarter wide cutter head
   The cutter head has three knife slots with three allen key set screws in each slot. No gibbs visible.
   22 and a half inch long bed.
   Nice solid cast iron with no name visible, but four different numbers cast into it.
   Bearings seem to be good. There is no play in the cutter head and it is very smooth.
   Cast numbers are as follows.
   Out feed table #10503
   In feed table #10533
   inside base #10501 AL
   on fence #10505 AL
   Any help with getting parts, who made the joiner and all that sort of info would be greatly appreciated.

1. 
   PeteBradley | Jun 11, 2006 05:54pm | #12

   Take a look at the Photo Index section of http://www.owwm.com and you should be able to match it up.Pete

2. 
   cadman2211 | Jun 11, 2006 06:58pm | #13

   I don't think it is a Delta, since the older Delta casting numbers started with FJ, I assume for 4" Jointer, and the newer Delta casting numbers were several digits longer than what you describe.  Possibly a Craftsman/King Seely/Dunlap.  They all made 4" jointers for Sears.

   Good luck with it..

   Greg