Well, I’ve got a little Christmas money, a couple of hunderd dollars. I’m going to buy hand tools, ’cause I’ve been enjoying using them so much. I’m wondering what folks’ favorite hand tools are; what I might ge that I haven’t been thinking of. Which ones are your faves? Which get used the most, or do the handiest things?
How do folk’s feel about a jointer fence to keep me square when hand jointing? I have no shoulder/rabbet plane; how about the Veritas medium, or bullnose? Or, the L-N rabbetting block plane? I also dig cool marking/measuring/layout gear. What do folks like best for a flattening plate? etc, etc.
Charlie
I tell you, we are here to fart around, and don’t let anybody tell you different. –K Vonnegut
Replies
Hi Charlie... It won't put a major dent in your 'couple of hundred dollars' but I depend on a good LARGE set of inside and outside callipers, a good ssolid set of dividers and a set of trammel (sp) points. If you can't lay out your lines accurately, you can't build it accurately. (I LOVE spending other peoples money!)
Have ####Happy Healthy, and Safe Christmas and New Year... SawdustSteve
I have an original Stanley jointer fence, but find it nearly useless. I instead like to rely on my feel an a square or a T bevel to check my progress.
I don't own a rabbeting block plane, but I think the would be a useful tool. I couldn't live without my shoulder plane, so that would be my choice. Buy the larger shoulder plane, because they offer better control, contrary to how it would seem ( I have very large hands so that may influence my thinking).
My favorite tool is a toss up between the LN 4 1/2 with the high angle frog, my c. 1979 Stanley No. 7 and the huge Clark & Williams jointer. If pinned down the nod would go to the LN. I don't get too worked up over tools, but this one does something for me. Not for the way it looks, but for how it works. See attached photo of a shaving in curly maple with a inlay, taken with the LN.
Also, a good bench vise is a wise investment. I have the Wilton with the pivoting jaw, which is a big help when cleaning up tapered legs.
Rob Millard
Edited 12/24/2004 2:48 pm ET by RMillard
Rob,Thanks for the reminder on that jointer fence; you've told me before that you do it by feel. A year later, I'm still struggling to stay square. How long should it take? You've implied that the learning curve ought to go pretty quick. Maybe I just lack some aptitude or other? How about those little edge-trimming planes that LV sells for squaring? Seems like they might ruin all that straightness that you just achieved with your jointer plane 'cause they're so short.I have a L-N #4 with both the high and standard angle frogs and agree that it is a wonder. I also love my #62 low-angle jack. I have an old LakeSide jointer, an old Stanley #6 that I got for $12 i great shape, 220 1000 1200 and 8000 grit set of waterstones, an Eclipse-style honing jig, couple of pull-saws, Veritas marking knife, couple of good squares, and dig calipers just to get started.A bench vise I don't have, at least not worth mentioning. I could use a better bench too, but lack the space, so I'll have to stick with the litte one.And yeah, that's an amazing shaving.CharlieI tell you, we are here to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different. --K Vonnegut
I've not used one of the edge squaring planes, but I've always looked at them as a gimmick tool, and like you, I think they are far too short to be of any real value.As for the learning curve with planing. I find how and where you stand at the vise has a big influence on the outcome and if I deviate too far from what's described below, it gets to be more difficult to obtain good results. In addition to my large hands, I have pretty longs arms ( I can span nearly 6'6" with my arms spread out, and I stand just over 6'-1"), so what I'm saying might only work for me. I stand about 10" to the side and with the leading edge of my waist a couple of inches back from the near end of the board. I find that if I crowd the board, it always ends up with the far end and edge getting more taken off, which results in a tapered, out of square board. The opposite, results if I stand too far away. Along the same line the height of the board in the vise should be at about the belt buckle level. Much higher and you lose control and lower it puts more strain on your back, although lower works better than higher, because you have more leverage. The plane should be held as lightly as possible. This gives you more stamina and more sensitivity. The plane should feel like it's floating over the wood. With a light touch you can build muscle memory which will work to help you keep the edge square. This light touch also helps when the edge isn't square, since you can tilt the plane slightly and still maintain complete control, bringing the edge back to square. Finally the strokes should be fluid and have a sort of rhythm to them, almost like a rocking motion. Look at your foot and body placement and see if that is what is keeping you from quickly getting a square edge. I know that it helped me with my hand sawing, which I at one time had great difficulty with, until I decided to critique my technique ( hey that rhymes).
Rob Millard
Rob,
With pointing my best other half in the right direction, for Christmas, I have both the LN #4 and the 62 on the way.
What stone do you use for the final honing on your irons?
By the way, from previous posts and trying some of your advice, I managed to get my cheap little $30 Stanley to work, with some real thin shavings, but in the end all the fiddling and modification was not worth it. Amazing how something that was good, with such a good brand name, over the years can slip away with tolerances and small mass production changes, making it worthless.
Merry Christmas!!
I have exactly that combo of L-N planes (plus a York pitch frog for the #4). You WILL be happy. I had the benefit of watching the L-N demo guy show me exactly how he sharpens and uses these tools. I'd be happy to share what I learned in detail if it's helpful to you.CharlieI tell you, we are here to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different. --K Vonnegut
Charlie,
Thanks will appreciate the information.
So far, I only have two diamond stones, the finest being 750, with which I get good results.
I may go the route Rob suggests, but will appreciate your input.
I have a Stanley #93, but I wish I gotten a larger shoulder plane, mostly for control. The Clifton, the Lie-Nielsen, or the newer Veritas are all appealing. The Stanley has served me well in the tune-up of my tenons and rabbets, so if you do a lot of joinery in that style, a shoulder plane is a good investment.
I also have a fetish for perfectly clean mortises -- square, flat sides and a clean bottom. A swan-neck chisel would be a nice complement to your paring chisels.
How about a couple of good sharpening stones? Large set of quality brad-point and forstner bits? Better chisel-and-bits for the mortising machine? Custom branding iron to sign your work? Quality of life stuff like hearing protection with the built-in radio, new safety glasses, or an air filtration system? Do you ever wish you had TWO of something...like a tenoning jig?
I'm enamored with that Miller Dowel system with the tapered drill bit and stepped dowels. I can think of some simple projects that I could complete quickly -- and make some people very happy -- with that system.
Just a couple of suggestions on my time for your dime!
Merry Christmas and enjoy shopping!
tony b.
I hone the irons on sand paper going up to 2000 grit. Then, I use a little diamond paste squirted on a block of cherry with a few drops of water added, to bring up a mirror like shine. I think the paste is the 3 micron grit size. I'm kind of a fanatic about sharpening.Since you were able to get the standard plane to work, you're in for a great experience with the LN planes. One thing I found on a couple of the LN planes I have, is that they require about 1/32" ground off the cutting edge, before you get back to good metal. I didn't find this to be the case with all them, but more so with the A-2 irons. I think this must be from the flat grinding drawing a little bit of the temper out, but I'm not sure. Either way they are great tools. I can't imagine making furniture without a good set of hand planes.
Rob Millard
Charlie:You might want to check around at local gov't auctions, a few years ago I picked up a Wilton vise at a school auction for about twenty dollars, got half of a library card file for five (spilt it with a friend) -- great for holding small parts and screws. [One drawer holds 1,000 #8 x 2½ inch Robertson screws quite nicely.]Have fun making shavings.Leon Jester, Roanoke VA
Here is another method for getting/keeping and edge square to the side as you joint. Put a very slight crown on the iron, maybe abut .002 or so. Use your left hand and fingers as a fence, to register the plane laterally as you take a stroke. You can then adjust that finger fence, in or out, to force the plane to use a part of the blade that corrects your error. This is harder to describe than to do.Alan
http://www.alanturnerfurnituremaker.com
The edge squaring planes are great, although I bought the Veritas rather than the Lie-Nielsen because it's wider.
The shortness doesn't matter. You use the squaring plane to create a perfectly square edge, then use the jointer to get it straight. It also works in the reverse order.
Charlie
I love all my L-N tools. Every year, that's what I ask for. I'm pretty sure there's a new low angle rabbeting block plane under the tree for me. I also love the beautiful set of Nishiki dovetail chisels my wife got for me last year. They're made from 200 year old boat anchors. I almost passed out when I opened the box!! Also, I really like my Clifton 410 shoulder plane, but want another larger one.
RMillard- Which one do you have. I've got sausages for hands also, and I'd like to hear what works well in your hands.
JC
Charlie
You've gotta try the tite mark gauge marketed by Lie Nielsen, just so good....I bought a couple of Adria saws earlier in the year and they're wonderful to work with, Cliftons 3110 plane has proved very useful....Iain
Charlie... if you're really struggling with the square edges, there's 1 tool that's gonna sort em out first time, every time. Long grain, end grain, straight grain, wild grain... no matter... no effort... no tear out... Interested...???
http://www.lie-nielsen.com/tool.html?id=9
Mike Wallace
Stay safe....Have fun
Interested? Sure. Tempted? Not at that price...CharlieI tell you, we are here to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different. --K Vonnegut
Charlie,
I got the L-N 60½ Rabbet Block Plane a couple of weeks ago and I'm lovin it! All the goodness of a block plane plus the ability to cut right to the edge for tuning tenons or ... and of course ready to go right out of the box. Enjoy making your purchase(s)!
Wayne
My favourite is a Stanley #8 with a corrugated sole circa 1910. I picked it up for $35 at a farm auction, bought a Hock blade and started making shavings. I just flattened a countertop made of one board 8 ft x 24 1/2 inches wide x 2 1/2 inches thick and it works like a champ. My next favourite would be a L/N #4 followed by a L/N #140 skew block plane. Just received a Veritas large shoulder plane this morning (I love Santa!). Can't wait to get out to the shop to give it a test drive.
Doug
I try to take care of the two hands I have. They are remarkable tools.
I had a difficult time with all planes until I learned to sharpen. When you have a good sharpening system in place every plane you get will bring you joy. When I started woodworking I was told I would end up with 10 or 12 planes. I now am making planes and scrapers. Once I learned to sharpen all my planes are useful.
The ones I use most are
Stanley #4, 4 1/2 # 6 Jack Large Jointer.
I made a scraper using the krenov approach and it works great.
My sharpening is accomplished by #600 4000 8000 norton stones as well as a norton large diamon plate.
Good Luck
Hi Charlie,
My favorite hand tools are definitely the ones my neighbor bequethed to me in his will. I would not sell them for anything! They are:
Stanley Type 19 #4 Smooth circa 1950
Stanley Type 16 #4C Smooth circa 1940
Stanley Type 7 #4 1/2C Smooth circa 1889
Stanley Type 8 #5 1/2C Jack circa 1900
Stanley Type 9 #5 1/2 Jack circa 1905
Stanley Type 7 #6 Fore circa 1895
Stanley Type 11 #6C Fore circa 1905
Stanley Type 15 #7 Jointer circa 1932
Stanley Type 16 #7C Jointer circa 1940
Stanley Type 16 #8 Jointer circa 1940
Stanley Type 12 #8C Jointer 1920
Stanley #10 Bench Rabbet circa 1898
Stanely #12 Scrapper circa 1875
Stanley #60 Low angle block circa 1898
Stanley Type 6 #45 Combination circa 1895
Somehow I don't think $100 would come close to paying for this collection.
Those daring young men in their flying machines!
Yeah, that's great list. Kinda makes me want to frag a neighbor or two and hope for the best...CharlieI tell you, we are here to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different. --K Vonnegut
Dangit, Charlie. You should have put a spew warning on that one. Now I have to clean coffee off the monitor.Have a happy new year.Leon Jester, Roanoke VA
Hi Charlie,
Yeah, I've got a neighbor in my building I'd love to frag with a passion! Unfortunately he's not a woodworker, so there's nothing in it. Except for peace and quiet!
Those daring young men in their flying machines!
If you are going to get into hand tools,my advice would be the following. Get a good set of bench chisels{ I like Japanese chisels} but there are many good makers out there to choose from. A good tenoning saw and cross cut saw for making joints{lie-neilsen,adria,japanese saws are nice but take a little practice because they cut on the pull stroke}.As for planes I have several choices for you,the first is a good old Stanley no.4 1/2 or a Bedrock 604 or 604 1/2 they are really good smoothers and the older ones,pre 1940 and older are the best. If money is no problem then Lie-Neilsen are probably the best USA made planes but they will cost you big bucks,but mine are worth every penny I paid for them. If your really going to get into this you'll also want a good no.5 or 7 for jointing the edges of long stock{ here again the old Stanley models are worth getting} You will want a couple of good block planes at least one of which should be a low angle block for end grain and difficult spots. Another choice I really have gotten alot of use out of are scraper planes or at the least a good cabinet scraper blade and maybe a good pattern makers rasp or file for shaping odd shapes in wood. You may have noticed by now that you are going to develope a disease called collecting tools and this can be downright all consuming and lead to many shop problems like can I get more old planes on the shelfs or sould I make more shelfs for more planes,any way in nutshell don't buy cheap tools,you'll end up buying more to replace them,buy the best you can and build up tools as your as your ability grows,and for sure learn how to sharpen or the tools will not be worth anything and most people get hurt from dull tools not sharp ones, have fun in process its a great hobby. Len
CharlieD,
The tools that I reach for the most would have to be my layout tools and a few planes. Of the layout tools my engineers' squares get the most work. I have a set of Brown and Sharpes that range in size from 2-6". These are great because they are very accurate and their size is perfect. I have several marking gages that I have made over the years and from this lot my favorite is copied after the Tite Mark. Easy to adjust and the wheel severs the grain so you end up with a clean line. While layout tools are very useful my favorite tools to use are my planes. There is something very satisfying about picking up a well tuned plane and taking shavings off of a beautiful piece of wood. I have several Lie Nielsens and these planes are very good but since I started making my own planes I tend to use my planes more. The first plane that I made was a small chariot plane. It fits my hand perfectly, takes continuous end grain shavings and doesn't care what type of grain you throw at it. It produces a polished surface every time. The only down fall with this tool is that it is rather ugly when compared to planes made by Sauer and Steiner, Bill Carter, Anderson and Holtey.
Have fun spending your money.
Tom
That is an absolutely beautiful plane. Could you please tell me where I would go to get information on attempting something like that myself?
Peter,
I was inspired to make my first plane when I saw a sampling of Brian Buckner's planes at a class/seminar that Roy Underhill put on at Highland Hardware. He gave Roy a small chariot plane but Brian was holding on tight to the rest of his tools.
http://www.sydnassloot.com/bbuckner/tools.htm
I started by reading Jim Kinshott's book. Unfortunately it is now out of print but I found a copy through the UK Amazon site. It is a helpful book but it is not necessarily a how to book. I would start by reading this book, Googling infill planes and looking at the some of the manufacturers sites like:
http://www.sauerandsteiner.com/
http://www.holteyplanes.com/
http://home.pacifier.com/~davewe/Carter_planes_home.htm
http://www.andersonplanes.com/
There are a fair amount of useful sites out there. I will be glad to answer any specific questions you may have but I am still kind of new to this also. I have only built about 3 planes to date.
Good Luck,
Tom
Do you have pics of the rest?
Peter,
Sorry it has taken me so long to respond. My boss gave me last week off so I have been hanging sheet rock in the new shop. I think that I would rather dig ditches than hang sheet rock for a living. Oh well enough belly aching, I don't have any photos of the others with me at the moment but I do have these in progress shots of a smoother that I am working on currently. It is loosely patterned after a Norris A6 with the iron bedded at 47.5 degrees. So far I am pleased with it, note the "double dovetails".
Thanks to the others who shared compliments
Tom
Edited 1/5/2005 9:05 am ET by TCALISTO
SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO very nice....gimme
I agree, that's a beautiful tool.CharlieI tell you, we are here to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different. --K Vonnegut
Gorgeous work there.Leon Jester
CharlieD,
I believe your question was "what is the handiest tool"...clearly, the first thing I grab for when I've made a mistake is my forehead...likewise, when I don't know what to do I scratch my hamstring....I'd stay away from any tool that had the words 'nose' or 'shoulder' or 'block'....
"I also dig cool marking/measuring/layout gear"
Well, at only $15, this 3" Incra rule might appeal to you.
http://www.hartvilletool.com/product/10841
This is one of my all time favorites for doing layout. I'm constantly grabbing for this little gizmo. I've got some of the bigger Incra rules too, but don't use them anywhere near as often as the little 3" version.
Wow, that DOES look cool...CharlieI tell you, we are here to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different. --K Vonnegut
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