I’m very new to woodworking but have a couple projects under my belt. I’m becoming more and more interested in using hand tools in my projects – especially as most of them are rather small. I do not know the correct name for the part I’m talking about in this post so I’ve included a picture showing the part. It’s the inside liner in a box that aligns the lid.
Working with a table saw on these is rather difficult if not dangerous due to their small size, not to mention that the results can be less than acceptable especially if working with figured wood. So I would like to dimension these by hand but I do not know how. Cutting them roughly to say 1/8″ on a bandsaw is easy enough, but how can I go about smoothing them and bringing them down to the right thickness using hand tools. I’ve built a shooting board to bring them to the correct length and do the miters easily, but doing thickness eludes me though it is likely staring me in the face only I don’t see it yet.
Thanks,
Ken
Replies
Well firstly Ken, Your bandsaw result does not have to be that rough, with a good set up the linings should be pretty good. Then it is just a matter of using a well tuned plane at the bench to remove the saw marks. You will soon trust your eye to judge thickness but there is no short cut to practice.
Thanks Mufti ... I ordered some band saw blades directly from Suffolk with the intent purpose of resawing thin stock so there are minimal trace lines. The question though, is how can I hold the small stock so I can use a plane on the width of it? I've thought about this quite a bit but come up with no solution. The stock is only about 1/8" thick so a bench dog it way too small ... maybe a specialty bench hook? But a lip of only perhaps 1/16 isn't very strong and would be prone to tearing off, wouldn't it? Ken
My way has been to use strips of double sided tape (carpet tape). You should be removing fairly fine shavings anyway and this has always worked. To free the stock a cheese cutting wire or blade of a japanese pull saw frees the wood.
Since I switched to using metal cutting blades for wood and removed the bottom guide altogether the band saw has been very good. After all the older saws did not carry lower guides!
Hey that's a great suggestion, Mufti. I hadn't thought of that but you are right .. the shaving ought to be VERY thin so the tape would hold.Thanks,
Ken
With a sharp plane and a relatively fine cut I've found that I can use the pieces of rug mat to keep things in place. See the macy's web site for what I mean.http://www1.macys.com/catalog/product/index.ognc?ID=136183&CategoryID=29368&LinkType=EverGreenI use this stuff for holding all kids of things to work on.Best regards,
Paul
Hi,
To make a long story short:
Flatten one face with a #6 or #7 plane. (I'm suggesting a #6 because you aren't working with long pieces of wood). Then reference off of the flattened face with a marking gauge (like a Titemark) and mark the target thickness. Then plane the other face down to the gauged line.
That's the gist of it. The Rob Cosman video "Rough to Ready" does a nice job of explaining the details, but my guess is that if you give it a shot, with wood in the dimensions for a box like you showed above, you will find that this is really easy.
-Andy
Thanks Andy ... but that leaves me in the same quandry as I wrote to Mufti ... how to secure the wood for planing?Ken
Hi SparrowHawk,I use a Veritas "Bench dog" combined with a "WonderPup" (poor man's end vise):
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=31130&cat=1,41637
Both work with 3/4" holes in your benchtop.For narrow stock, most of the time I don't even use the WonderPup, just a dog that can be set as low as I need it.if your workpiece is thin (it sounds like it is), raise it on the bench on another flattened piece of wood (or plywood). This also provides a flat, stiff surface so that your workpiece doesn't flex as you are trying to flatten it.
-Andy
Edited 2/9/2008 3:55 pm ET by VTAndy_
Make a vacuum jig, a shop vac would hold it for planing.
Thanks Phillip, Andy and rsaunders for your help. I think that perhaps using a spacing piece of wood to raise the 1/8" piece to something a dog can safely hold is probably the best solution without spending money. I rather like using tiger maple for the liners as the figure stands out and adds a lot of interest to the interior.I appreciate all your help and suggestions on this ... so much to learn but the only way to do that is to practice stuff and ask questions. (and make mistakes ... sigh).
Ken
Sparrow,
I saw a trick by a pro at a LN show recently...I think it's what Philip was suggesting. He took a board and put 4-5 holes in one end making a right angle (the holes were about an inch apart). Into the holes he put some dowel, proud of the surface about 1/16" ..the dowel holds your stock place while planing..I might also try a bit of double stick tape too.
Thanks BG .. I think the double stick tape is a great idea ... one I hadn't considered till this thread. Thanks guys.Ken
KenMake yourself a bench hook, and use a thin piece of hardwood for the fence. It doesn't take much to hold it in place, and you'll be able to plane these pieces to the desired thickness. Here's a video by Gary Rogowski demonstrating the bench hook. I made one similar and use it ALL the time. Very useful. Tomhttp://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/subscription/Workshop/WorkshopArticle.aspx?id=24063"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"
Thanks ctsjr82 ... I'm subscriber but not a paid member so I couldn't view the video. However, I do know what a bench hook is and I can imagine the one he is using. I guess I'll just have to try the various suggestions people here have so kindly offered and see what works best for me.Ken
KenThe fence that Rogowski used was ~1" wide and less than 1/8" thick. He makes his hook from MDF and glued and pinned the fence. My fence is white oak, about 3/4" wide and just a smidge under 1/8". I just glued it to the MDF. It's worked well for nearly two years now. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"
Thanks ctjsr82 ... when someone else mentioned a bench hook I figured the fence must have been wide for a larger footprint and better stability but low as in about 1/16 proud of the panel. Next time I do liner panels, I think I'll make one and see how it works for me. Ken
Ken,
I suggest you select a straight grained easy going wood to use as the liner in your boxes, then you will easily be able to plane these by hand down to 1/8 inch, assuming your plane is sharp , properly set up and you take a fine cut. There certainly are ways to rip thin pieces on a table saw, and if you do this using a suitable blade then there will be very little cleaning up to do with a hand plane. I suggest you make up a bench stop board to place the thin strips on for planing: the front end of a piece to be planed bears against the step.Glue the step on-don't pin it.
I have mostly used Cedrella Toona (often found on those cigar boxes), an African Cedar and Jacaranda. I suppose the Cedrella would be known in your part of the world.
I deal with this in almost all of my projects,including a run of 25 small boxes made this (Southern hemisphere) summer (photos soon). I've been making boxes, for fun and profit, for nearly 30 years, and reckon my techniques are close to best practice in some areas.
This won't solve your problem, but I rip thin stock using a Freud glue-line blade and a vacuum fence on my Minimax Euro slider, and don't need more than one swipe with a very sharp plane to clean up. Sometimes I can use the strips as they come from the saw. I can rip down to about 2mm by 750mm. A well set-up band saw will get you close to that as well.
This might help tho: find an off-cut of very thin MDF, hardboard, or similar, or even make a piece from hardwood. cut in two. Double-side tape one piece on top of the other, leaving an off-set equivalent to the length of the piece of wood you want to plane. Clamp one end to bench. Sit piece of wood against the stop created by the top piece. Plane.
What you've made is a sort of bench hook. Because the top piece will be about the same thickness as the stock you're planing, it will act as a guide to thickness. With practice you will get to within a few thousands consistently.
Malcolm
Thanks Malcolm ... sounds like a plan to me. I'll give it a try.Ken
... and if I get the time this week I'll post a photo!There are a number of techniques for holding small pieces of wood near a circular blade:A really good blade, kept as-new sharp, makes a world of difference. A zero-clearance device (if necessary run a piece of MDC into the blade, held firm against the fence, clamp it in place, then do your close-up cuts on top of the MDF - eliminates the gap between blade and table) is also a great benefit. Another option is to lower the blade below the table, clamp your jig or whatever in place, turn on the saw and slowly raise the blade up through the jig. If you need a fence just for one cut, using a set-up like that above, double-sided tape will hold a flat piece of MDF or ply in place.What one should always avoid is getting fingers anywhere near a spinning blade. Sometimes I use tape to fix a supplementary piece of wood to my work piece, to make it big enough to feed through the saw safely. Always ask yourself: if this goes wrong, what's likely to happen. If you don't know the answer, don't do it!http://www.macpherson.co.nz
Would this help?
http://www.wkfinetools.com/contrib/dCohen/z_art/prepBoard/prepBoard1.asp
Regards from Perth
Derek
You could, of course, have dusted off the thicknesser and done that in 5 minutes!Malcolmhttp://www.macpherson.co.nz
Malcolm
Where's the fun in that? :)
Regards from Perth
Derek
I like to get to the making asap, Derek!For me the fun in busting something out of a piece of wood is not in the busting, it's in the 'something'. I get to the joinery (which I increasingly regard as engineering = producing precisely-dimensioned pieces of wood) as quickly as I can.In the run of small boxes I'm about 90% through, about 5% of the time has been spent on dimensioning the stock - crotch-figured American black walnut grown in New Zealand. Lovely stuff.Malcolmhttp://www.macpherson.co.nz
Hi Malcolm
I don't have that much power equipment. No power planer to flatten the boards, which takes up most of this preparation time. I do have a thicknesser, but it is fairly new and I have only used it a few times. By the time one is needed, I have done much of the work already. I am used to preparing boards manually. It does not take as much time as you might believe. Plus I get satisfaction from doing it this way. Time is not usually a constraint (althoiugh I am quite quick anyway). Having said that, when time comes (soon) to salvage a roof-full of hardwood trusses, then I shall break out the power.
Here is a WIP of the timber I thicknessed in the article ...
View Image
Regards from Perth
Derek
NiceBoxes are fun, eh!What you should have bought is an under and over planer/thicknesser. You still could, of course. A well-set up quality machine, with sharp cutters, is a joy to use, especially with a dust extractor. Invest in some state of the art ear protection, make enough space, and enjoy.Malcolmps - are you about to cut the lid off of that thing?http://www.macpherson.co.nz
Yep. I'll show you later.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Thanks Paul. I just bought a sander/router pad. Looks like something quite similar ... but it doesn't seem like it will work so well to me. The piece I want to thickness is 1/8 x 2 x 20-24 which is quite small. The plane blade is going to be digging into the wood and pushing so I'm not sure the pad can overcome that pressure and hold the piece solidly. I'm thinking the double sided tape might have more power.Thanks Derek. That was very interesting as I'm just starting out with hand tools. It holds more value though I think, for the sides of my boxes as those are 3/8 -1/2" thick. The piece I'm talking about thicknessing here is 1/8 x 2 x 20-24 - VERY thin to begin with. I guess I'm really talking about smoothing it as the thickness isn't critical though it obviously needs to be even.Thanks Malcolm. I wouldn't be comfortable trying to smooth a 1/8" thick piece of wood on a table saw with the blade at least 2" high. I have decided to make it a rule that I leave the shop with as many finger/thumbs as I entered with ... and that sort of cut leaves me wondering if I might not end up cutting a bit more than the wood. :/ I think hand work at that point is safer.Ken
Thanks, got a bit carried away with table saw techniques. Not suggesting you do that with your small bits of wood.However, I do think you're missing the point about holding your small pieces of wood while you hand plane them. With a bench stop/bench hook as described above, you don't need to hold them. Just sit them on the bed of the 'hook', up against the low stop, and plane away. The downward pressure of the plane holds them down and the stop stops them from shooting across the shop.Trust me, I do this all the time. You'll clean up a face in about 5 swipes, and be onto the next one in the time it takes to pick one up and put down the next.Malcolmhttp://www.macpherson.co.nz
Thanks Malcolm. My bench dogs are about 3/4" above the bench at their lowest which is about 1/2" above the top of the wood to be planed. What I probably should do is take some hickory or hard maple and make my own that will sit as low as 1/16" or a bit less off the benchtop.I'm also being rather frugal here too though ... I hate to waste any wood, but I've been thinking of using all the wood here. If I were to figure on wasting a few inches on either end I could probably use my largish dogs. But then, I'd have a high place on each end and dish out the middle, wouldn't I? To really do this properly to get an even thickness, I should run the plane the entire length of the wood.Might be that the best way to go about this is with a ROS on a sanding pad to remove the tracks of the bandsaw.Ken
My explanations are too brief, sorry. Don't try to use your bench stops (although you could). By making up a bench hook from a couple of thin scraps of MDF or ply, one stuck on top of the other, you can plane pieces down to the thickness of the 'stop'. I often plane finished-length pieces of 50 or 60mm long by 25mm wide, by 2 or 3mm thick. Quickly, easily.I do use a small plane.I need to post a photograph. This technique is very simple, will take you 5 minutes to set up, and will work perfectly.Malcolmhttp://www.macpherson.co.nz
I understand what you are saying, Malcolm. I was a bit concerned that the upper fence/lip of the bench hook might be too weak ... of course I could always dado it in and the width isn't important which would give it much more strength (all my ply is 3/4). A bench hook is about as easy to make as anything can be so I'll give it a try. Thanks.Unfortunately money is still somewhat of a limitation, my friend. I just bought a Grizzly 3HP cabinet saw and haven't much left for now. I didn't even know about over/under planers till I saw one at my local lumberyard ... but they look pretty pricey. And then I generally use highly figured wood for my liners which is why I'm interested in the hand work to avoid tearout as much as possible. So I'll need to set my plane to a minimum shaving and be sure the iron is razor sharp.Thank all of you for your help and suggestions.
Ken
Sparrow,
You've gotten some good suggestions here, and all goes to show that "there is more than one way to skin a cat", as my dad would have put it.
Wood dogs, or a bench stop made of sacrificial material,as Malcolm suggests, are my solution. Mostly the thin material I'm planing is shorter, 12"-18" and wider, 8" plus, for desk interior partitions and the like, which makes it somewhat less whippy and easier to work. With wood stops, you can set the height of the stop near or at the thickness of the stock,and not worry about dinging a blade if you graze it passing over top. The narrowness of the stuff you are wanting to plane, and the difficult grain, make the possibility of it bulging up ahead of the plane, and breaking into pieces, very real. (The double stick tape I've tried leaves a sticky residue that needs to be removed.)Rather than try to plane it full length, I believe I'd rough cut to shorter sections (less likely to bow), maybe long enough for one box's end-plus-side, and make a shooting board with a shallow three-sided trough, 1/8" deep, x 2" wide and 10-12" long, to accept the stuff you are planing. When you get the stock down level with your trough sides, you are done.
Ray
Thanks Ray ... you're right about the risk of bowing with such thin stock. Maybe the easiest and safest way to approach it is simply to use a ROS with fine paper. There have been quite a few suggestions and ideas that I will try and see which one works best for me for this particular application. You can read and hear how other people do things, but in the end, it's really trial and error to find out which method is right for you.Thanks,
Ken
The way I work with real thin stock--I've split wood between growth rings and planed it to about 3/32"--is to use a stop on the end of my bench. I use two hanger bolts with 1/4"-20 wing nuts to hold a piece of oak on the end of my maple work bench. The oak has two slots that allow me to raise and lower the oak stop from zero up to about 3/4" above the bench.
With a sharp edge on the oak I can plane very thin stock without the stock popping over the stop. I also use an L-N No 7 with little short pieces as the length of the sole in front of the iron is long enough to trap the wood between the sole and bench so the wood cannot bow up as the planning force is applied.
Thanks Griz ... I haven't got a #7 but I do have a #5 which has a little front sole. Basically it seems the most people are using what amounts to a bench hook with a low but wide fence/stop. For such small stock I think it's important to use wood for the stop/fence as there is always a chance that I'll run off and strike it with the iron.Ken
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