Replies

1. 
   hammer1 | Jan 29, 2008 04:09am | #1

   I found a fix for drum sanders. Disconnect the dust collection hose, move the drum sander out, move in a widebelt oscillating sander, reconnect the dust collection.

   Beat it to fit / Paint it to match

1. 
   user-201400 | Jan 29, 2008 05:35am | #2

   i've found a 25 inch belt with a platen and 7.5hp 220v , powermatic for around 4k . that's where i guess i'm going next.

1. 
   hammer1 | Jan 29, 2008 06:10am | #3

   Drum sanders can be a major pain. There are some things they work well on but there are others that they ruin. Regardless, you still have to do a lot of hand work to get the marks out. I worked in large shops with widebelts. They did such a great job that I started to think I wanted something on a par but on my budget. I bought a large SuperMax. It convinced me there were other ways. The widebelts are timesavers but drums are time wasters for me. The only things you can do are, use top quality paper, have great dust collection, change the paper often and barely kiss the surface, making ten passes to remove .001", changing the paper five times. I'm exaggerating on the last two, a little.Beat it to fit / Paint it to match

1. 
   JBDesigns | Jan 29, 2008 06:22am | #4

   I have had a lot of the same problems with my Delta. That seems to be the gist: light passes, use the cleaner/eraser often, and get the dust out as best as possible. It has definitely messed up a few precious boards. The thing that stings is that it cost a few bucks, and I thought it would solve all my problems. Still, it comes in handy often enough that I don't regret the purchase. Good luck,
   Justin

2. 
   rwahrens | Feb 01, 2008 02:34am | #10

   I found an older Sandingmaster 30" widebelt for $2000.  It is 3 phase, and it needed some work.  I had to rebuild the belt tracking system completely.  It has a platen, but I never use it.  Too much maintenance and hassle.  I use the front rubbler contact drum, and finish up with a random orbit by hand.  With 50 grit paper and a slow feed rate, I can remove close to 1/16" in a pass.

   The problem with burning on a drum sander is caused by heat build up from friction, just like on a saw blade.  You can often decrease saw blade burns by increasing the feed speed if you have the horsepower, but that doesn't work with sandpaper.  Widebelt sanders have a much larger sandpaper area than drums, so there is more time for the belt to cool before contacting the work again.  The longer the belt, the more aggressive the feed rate and depth of cut can be.  The oscillation of the belt helps also.

   Most cabinet shops want at least a 36" machine so they can sand face frames.  If you can get by with less width, there are some bargains to be found in the used market.

   The abrasive planers have a steel contact drum, very coarse abrasive and lots of horsepower.  They don't tend to snipe like a knife planer.

1. 
   user-201400 | Feb 01, 2008 04:53am | #11

   my biggest problem is my shop in downstairs so every machine i buy has to be taken apart so size does matter and 1phase is the only power i can use , i can run a rotophase but only up to 10hp , so i have to stick to a 25" or smaller . over the years 22 to be exact i have put a 18 inch powermatic , 16" fay and egan jointer downstairs . i like no overhead costs for heat and rent.

1. 
   rwahrens | Feb 01, 2008 10:09pm | #13

   It must have been quite a challenge, getting those machines into the basement.  I'm fortunate to have another business that has some extra space, 3 phase power and a forklift.

   The 3 phase converter would give you an opportunity to pick up some bargains in used equipment - older 3 phase stuff goes pretty cheap sometimes.  I've picked up a 36" Cresent bandsaw for $400 and a very nice 16" Dewalt radial arm saw for $600.

2. 
   JeffHeath | Jan 29, 2008 09:54pm | #7

   I found a fix for drum sanders

   lol...........

   You've got that right.  The only thing I use my drum sander for is sanding my shop cut slices for bent laminations.

   I've been in the hunt for a widebelt (that I can justify$$$) for about 2 years.  If my little side business of hardwoods and large slabs takes off like I hope, I will need one for flattening the flitch slabs once they dry. 

   Would a widebelt be a good choice for this, in your learned opinion?

   Jeff

1. 
   hammer1 | Jan 30, 2008 04:56pm | #8

   The widebelts I've used are not abrasive planers. They are limited to very light passes, we would set them up so they just kissed the surface. The difference is in the oscillating platten and the electronic eye control. Many require their own 3 phase sub-panel. Most have a pneumatic belt tension which will require a fair amount of compressed air. You will also need a commercial dust collector. The best ones are used for sanding plywood, the control is very fine. You can not surface rough stock or flatten work pieces with them, they are the last step in milling. They will make your almost perfect stock, perfect. It's a large investment to set up a larger widebelt, more than just the cost of the machine.There are abrasive planers but I've never used one. In one shop, we had an automatic flattening machine with a knife head like a jointer or planer. It had an overhead drive belt that was like a conveyor with long, 6"?, metal fingers. This did not give a finished surface, it's job was just to flatten and it was a wood hog. Generally, it was to prep stock for a four sider, flatten, plane to rough thickness, ripped on a gang saw and put through the four sider. The four sider was used to make moldings, bandings, face frame stock, etc. There have been many plant closings in the last few years. Lots of equipment is up for auction. There can be some great prices compared to new. There are some combination widebelt/planers. On this site, Hooker furniture is auctioning a Timesaver 237-4, current bid is $35,000, a steal!http://www.irsauctions.com/?flash=9Beat it to fit / Paint it to match

1. 
   user-201400 | Jan 31, 2008 05:30am | #9

   i've done some research on the powermatic and it has a 10hp 220v 1phase motor , also it has a air platen and air tracking oscillating belt .  it's 25wide by 60 they say belt between 100 to 180 is best , i use the drumsander right now straight off the planer so micro passes are used , also i use veenier calipers with each pass . the biggest problem is general cut 2 holes in the top and call that dust collection . my partner has a woodmaster and it has a commercial dust collection built-in . his machine was built by aem . don't know if there made that well anymore.  

3. 
   cherryjohn | Feb 02, 2008 03:53pm | #14

   still giving advice huh

    Wicked Decent Woodworks

   (oldest woodworking shop in NH)

   Rochester NH

   " If the women dont find you handsome, they should at least find you handy........yessa!"

1. 
   hammer1 | Feb 02, 2008 04:49pm | #15

   Long time no see, John. Hope all is well. The new business must be keeping you busy.Beat it to fit / Paint it to match

2. 
   mrbird90 | Jan 29, 2008 06:44am | #5

   I just finished sanding 6 hard maple boards 10" wide by 48" long on my Performax 16/32 sander. I planed them to .685" and took .030" off each side on the sander taking three passes per side, no burning, paper looks like new. I used 120 grit Industrial Abrasive paper and used a feed rate of 60%. I found that Klingspor paper just burns. Got rid of all and will not use it any more. The key to using a drum sander is taking .010 to .015" per pass. Use the planer to get to the basic size and then lightly sand to get finished size.

3. 
   frenchy | Jan 29, 2008 09:10pm | #6

   gaydos,

      once the "burn' is on the drum I've not been able to ever sand with that drum without burning again untill I replace the paper..

4. 
   dgreen | Feb 01, 2008 07:52am | #12

   I have a Shop Fox 26 inch double drum and know several other owners of the same machine. We have the best results with hardwoods with a very light cut and the highest possible feed rate.

   I would not recommend a drum sander for a multi-person shop, but for a one man band they are capable of a lot of very good work at a very reasonable investment.

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   It would indeed be a tragedy if the history of the human race proved to be nothing more than the story of an ape playing with a box of matches on a petrol dump. ~David Ormsby Gore