My neighbors seem to come over when they know I’m working in my shop or even on the yard and ask to borrow tools..chop saw..seems like any tool I have..these cost money and are expensive to replace! Is there a good way to tell them NO without getting them pissed off..
Discussion Forum
Get It All!
UNLIMITED Membership is like taking a master class in woodworking for less than $10 a month.
Start Your Free TrialCategories
Discussion Forum
Digital Plans Library
Member exclusive! – Plans for everyone – from beginners to experts – right at your fingertips.
Highlights
-
Shape Your Skills
when you sign up for our emails
This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply. -
Shop Talk Live Podcast -
Our favorite articles and videos -
E-Learning Courses from Fine Woodworking
-
-
Replies
70445,
You might tell them that you would be happy to help, but your insurance only
covers you. They must hire you to help them.
Just say that you really need it right now. Or tell them that they have not given back the other tool and cant get another one untill they return the first one
"I'd rather be a hammer than a nail"
I am always using my tools, so I usually tell people that if they want to return it that same day, they can use it.
You could tell him or her, or them that they can borrow a tool once. If they need it again, it obviously means that they should have their own.
if what they're working on isn't so big that they can bring the job to your shop, maybe they can work on it in your shop while your there too.
Anyone who bases a friendship, or even a general relationship, on the ability to borrow tools is no friend at all. Losing a "friend" like that is like losing cancer.
My standard reply has always been, "Sorry, but I make my living with my tools."
Jeff
Sure there's a really good explanation you can give your neighbors or anyone for that matter the next time they want to borrow something, Just tell them it's against your shops policies to loan out any and all tools and besides it's also against your 14th and 15th letters of your own personal rules. You know the the ones............... the N and the O............. ha ,ha
P,S if they act to put out just tell them to plunk down the cost of what the replacement of the tool would be if he/she destroys it. not to mention a pre determined cost for rent of the tool. Just tell them if the tool comes back in good working order you'll be happy to give them back the rest of their money,less their rental fee. Watch their reaction when you let them know you want to start charging rent. If they get upset that usually means they really wanted to borrow your stuff so they would not have to put out the money at a rent a center .because lets face it , our neighbors are a bit cheap or they wouldn't want to be borrowing our stuff.
I learned a long time ago no matter who it is, family or other wise to say No.
I look at it like this, if they don't get over the terrible shock of me telling them no. The only one to suffer is them and not my bank account.
Sincerely,
Jim at Clark Customs
I'm glad to make the acquaintance of someone willing to loan tools. If you have a nice set of gouges I'd like to borrow them for a bit. I'm not like your neighbors; I'll return them promptly and in good condition.Sorry--just kidding.My solution to lending tools comes from my gruff, non-social behavior. None of my neighbors know that I have tools other than the rusty screwdriver that I use to attack the lawnmower in the spring. Since you seem to be a friendly guy, you are going to need a different solution. Telling the truth (that people are slow to return tools and don't take care of them) won't solve your problem as each neighbor will be offended if you don't accept their claims that they are the exception to that problem.What you need is a lie. I suggest something along the lines of:"I recently read about a person who lent some tools to a friend. The friend hurt himself so badly with the tools that he had to go to the emergency room. The friend's insurance company tried to collect the hospital expenses from the guy who lent the tools. I've decided that there is simply too much liability for me to loan tools. (Optional addition) I love to shop for tools, I'd be glad to go with you to help you pick out the tools you need."Adapt the above as needed for your situation.--WhitIf you have money buy wood and tools. If you have money left over, buy food and clothing.
Far too long winded and disingenuous fsn. I simply reply to anyone that asks to borrow tools, even a pencil and/or a tape measure, "Sorry. I never lend tools."
They can get as upset as they like. It's their problem, not mine, and in the end it's the asker that doesn't have the tools needed to do the job they want to do, not me. If they're not prepared to get everything required to do the job then why set out to do it in the first place?
The beauty of the flat refusal is that they only ask once, or perhaps twice at the most. Set the boundary up front and then they know not to waste both their time and my time. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
I don't lend tools either. It is worse than lending money. It gets damaged and the story is:
* Borrower feels bad and ends up paying for something and resents it
* Borrower insists that it was "ready to break anyway"
* Borrower doesn't know how to use it and through misuse damages it and believes nothing was wrong or happened.
* Borrower causes damage that doesn't show up for a while (think overheated motors)
* Borrower damages it and tries his best to make a repair, and now you you have a tool that sucks.
Now I will tell people that I will do small tasks for them, but I don't lend tools.
All,
In another shop, a long time ago, I worked with a fellow who had no tools. At all. He'd been hired by the boss, who decided that another pair of hands was needed for the home remodeling business he ran in addition to the furniture repair/ reproduction shop where I stayed. In slow remodeling times, Dan worked in the shop. He started by asking to borrow this or that hand tool from me, and I, being the agreeable chap that I am, was happy to lend them. Eventually, he got to the point where he didn't bother to ask, or to return them when through, but rummaged around in my tool box, and took what he wanted. One day, needing a screwdriver, and not seeing mine in the box, I went looking and found it on the bench where Dan had his head inside a cabinet. Picked it up, and went back to my bench. A few minutes, later, I heard Dan ask, in a very peeved tone, "HEY! Who took my screwdriver??!!"
"Gee, Dan, When did you buy yourself a screwdriver? And don't it pi$$ you off when somebody takes your tools without asking?" Stood and looked at him while his face turned a very bright shade of red. He was a decent sort of guy, just young and thoughtless.
Nowadays, I have a neighbor who has a cabinet shop. He borrows tools from me from time to time, and I borrow from him as well. Got a friend who is a tool collector. I don't hesitate to borrow a molding plane, or other specialty tool if I have need of one, and I either return it in better (usable) condition, if I don't think I'll need it again, or try to buy it if I do.
I guess my point is, you gotta know who it is that is asking to borrow your tools. I have friends who are fellow craftsmen who I would gladly lend my most prized hand tool. I have other friends for whom I'll gladly offer to do the job, but wouldn't want to lend a chisel, for fear they'd hurt themselves.
Ray
Every time a tool lending thread comes up, my blood pressure rises and I need to repost about my BIL, to whom I have lent tools for the sake of family peace. Astonishingly, I am a hobbyist while he is a *GENERAL CONTRACTOR*. Two incidents highlight the problem:After the belt sander I lent did not come back for several weeks, I decided to retrieve it from his basement. As I picked it up, his exact words were "Oh... is that yours?"He also borrowed a hammer drill from the shop (while I was out) to fix something at my MIL's house. It was returned promptly, but with a burnt-out motor. As mentioned above, family peace (and my BIL's financial situation) prevented me from getting compensation. I now keep the burnt-out drill in plain sight, and keep the replacement hidden. He hasn't borrowed anything since.
That comment at the end "If you have money buy wood and tools. If you have money left over, buy food and clothing." is my philosophy too!Chris @ flairwoodworks
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
I keep a few older fairly worn out tools around just for that purpose and an old orbital sander without a plug on it .
Usually they need a drill motor or a belt sander or ask about a chop saw .
No one has ever offered to put a plug on the sander to use it .
The tools I use to make a living with do not get loaned . I always offer to do the cuts they need if not too many .
Some people will borrow a 5" ROS or a belt sander and want to refinish a basketball court by sanding the old finish off .
After borrowing this old Thor 3/8" drill motor and my circa 1977 Sears 4x24 belt sander once ,, they usually don't ask again .
On the occasion that a person who knows how to use the tool and can afford to replace it , I have a few times loaned with no problems .
dusty
This is Gross, BUT! Tell him you never wash your hands after you know what ;-)
Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
Several years ago I was buying tools from Snap-on. They had these bumper stickers:
"Please don't ask to borrow my tools."
I bought a few. One is permanently on my mechanics tool box. Three are framed, one over my desk/workbench another next to the clock, and one over the entrance to my workshop.
Usually just a nod in the direction of one takes care of the problem.
...The unspoken word is capital. We can invest it or we can squander it. -Mark Twain...Be kind to your children....they will choose your nursing home....aim low boys, they're ridin' shetland ponies !!
I tell em that unfortunately, all the people who have not returned the tools they borrowed from me spoiled it for the rest and now I have to say no. I cant afford to buy new and refuse to keep track of who has what, so I need to say no.
BTW. The straw that broke the camels back was when I was in a friends basement and saw my 4" belt sander.
I said, Bob, isnt that the belt sander I loaned you like 2 years ago.
He insisted that it was not my belt sander.
It was orange. How many friggin people have orange 4" belt sanders??
I just tell people simply I dont loan my tools out. Once they know that they dont ask anymore
I don't lend tools to people who I don't think can handle them, because I truly don't want them to hurt themselves. Rather than insult the guy, I either do the job for them, or if it is not such a good friend, I make up a story about how the tool is malfunctioning or is such a piece of crap that it is too dangerous to use. I mention that I almost lost a finger last month, or something to that effect, so the tool is definitely not usable. I tell them that I will probably be buying a brand new super duper model in the near future, and will let them know when I get it. No one has ever asked again whether I ever got my new widget.
Sorry friend, but that is just too much to try and keep straight.
Like ol' Nancy Reagan told us to do, "just say no". It is sooo much easier. No b/s, no different story, no ummmmmmmmm, just No!
....unless they have a nice shiney new p/u they'll let me "borrow" to move some gravel and chain link fencing. ;0)...The unspoken word is capital. We can invest it or we can squander it. -Mark Twain...Be kind to your children....they will choose your nursing home....aim low boys, they're ridin' shetland ponies !!
I got a bucket of harbor freight tools that I will only loan out, truely piece of %$#@ tools, they dont ask often.two ways to screw up concrete 1) concrete driver 2) concrete finisher
I only loan tools to select family members and a few friends.
I would loan anything to cousin Wayne. He always brings things back in at least as good of shape as he gets them. He once returned a trim router with new brushes installed, (they were the spare set I had in the box, and he noticed there were sparks on the brushes, so he replaced them).
I loan "extra" tools to my brothers. If they don't return them, they get the empty box the replacement came in for Christmas, complete with the manuals. The younger one borrowed a power planer to work on doors at Mom's house. It didn't come back for two years. Since I bought a new one and sent him the empty box for Christmas neither of the brothers has asked since.
The Brother In-Laws can have anything they ask for. The one is a pro, and will buy me a new tool with out hesitation if he messes it up. He borrowed my drywall sander to do some floors with, and snapped the drive shaft. He sent the one that broke into be repaired and kept it. The other BIL is afraid of tools more complex than a screw driver, but is very willing to buy what ever you tell him he needs, he just needs direction in how to use it once he buys it.
The guys in the shop at work can borrow stuff anytime. They too know how to use tools without abusing them, (they ask for instruction if they aren't sure), and take responsibility for anything they break.
The trick of giving them the box-n-manuals for the tool they 'kept' as a Christmas present is priceless! I love it!
I don't understand the problem. Neither a lender or a borrower be.... Very easy and saves a flap when you have to go and retrieve the thing when you need it-long after the promised return date- and find that it has been abused.
My policy was also "No tool leaves this workshop unless it is in my hands at all times". No neighbour or friend ever got miffed -they still had the option of having me do the job and I had the option of charging, trading or donating. No problem.
Neither a lender or a borrower be
Sage advice that has passed the test of time...------------------------------------
It would indeed be a tragedy if the history of the human race proved to be nothing more than the story of an ape playing with a box of matches on a petrol dump. ~David Ormsby Gore
phillip,
No tool leaves this workshop unless it is in my hands at all times
DITTO! Simple, no brainer. I do the same. Words to that effect are on a sign as you ascend the stairs to my woodshop, on the top riser so all can see when they enter.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Philip -You said..."Neither a borrower or a lender be..."The rest of the quote (Polonius to Laertes in Hamlet)"For loan oft loses both itself and friend, and borrowing dulls the edge of husbandry."How true. Was old Polonius a woodworker perhaps?
I think we have the same neighbors or else people are the same no matter where you are!
Just say no is a good policy and you'll find it gets easier to say the more times your imposed upon to say it!
just think about the heartache you'll save yourself no missing, broken or dull tools and after awhile the friends/neighbors get the point.
I have a neighbor whom even after our friendship broke up (not over tools) continued to bother me to do work for him for free "please I gotta cut down these doors for a job" or " can't you let me borrow this tool mines broken" etc. the guy was persistent and a schmuck but after the first few times I learned to say NO!!! "I gave at the office!"
Good luck! Its hard, but well worth it to learn your lesson now and not after your sorry!
Chaim
Make your own mistakes not someone elses, this is a good way to be original !
Being in remodeling & furniture making full time I just respond, "With these I make my living and w/o them I can not work, therefore I do not loan tools."
Now, if they insist, I just ask a simple question, "Which part of 'NO' do you not understand, the 'N' or the 'O'?"
I usually eliminate further discussion by saying that I never lend out anything with a motor or a blade.
In a woodshop that pretty much covers everything but a hammer and . . . ?
Ron came over to borrow a hex wrench, so I gave him my hex wrench set. A couple of weeks later while working on my truck I needed it, so off to Ron's house. He looked puzzled when I asked to use my hex wrench set. We went into his backyard and found it in a water puddle. Just say no as its easier then cleaning rust.
Just say no... It's not worth the hassle. My tools are meant for woodworking, not DIY. I work hard to maintain their accuracy, and sharpness.
Very few people will put the same value on your tools as you do.
I learned my lesson early. A friend of mine who works with my wife asked to borrow a couple of clamps and some glue to re-glue the top of his desk at work. My gut instinct was "that's not my problem," but what could be the harm, right? You can't screw up a clamp and they'd be gone for less than 12 hours.
The next day, my wife calls me and says that someone stole the clamps off the desk. Our friend filed a stolen-items report with security, but they're the only ones with after-hours access to the office... He payed me for the clamps, but we both ended up robbed. My tools were stolen, and he was out $20 for a quick fix. Next time, it won't be my problem.
Josh.
friend of mine who works with my wife asked to borrow a couple of clamps ........
Hmmm. Could be worse. I was afraid the story was going to go a little kinky there.
My solution to lending tools comes from my gruff, non-social behavior.
Me, too. But you must seem like too nice a guy. But just do a "Nancy Reagan" and Just Say NO. If the cheap SOB's get pissed off, so what. If they won't even be bothered to run to the Tool Rental yard when they need a tool they don't have, who needs 'em.
I say "I only lend a tool to a tradesman who has served a full apprenticeship and has spent at least spent 10 years in the trade" and then I ask for the cost of the tool as a deposit, I will refund 60% provided the tool is returned in the same condition as it was in at the time it was lent. the tool must be returned within 1 hour.
I learned my lesson 50 years ago.
Never a Lender or a borrower be!!
Just say NO, guns, women and tools shal no be lent to ANYBODY ! ! ! ! ! ! !
an if he does not like it, so be it.
Years ago when I was working a job down south for months at a time I came home to my parent's house where I had left my tools. Most of them were missing. The main suspect was my brother who was running a gas station. I drove over to his station, backed up to the door, and started repossessing my property. He protested saying he needed that stuff. I told him they sell it at the store. I repoed half a pickup bed of stuff. To this day I say NO to tool borrowers and I don't give a hoot about their feelings.
I was an Aircraft Mechanic, now Inspector. I will only loan tools to people I trust and who would also loan me a tool in return (give and take). And the tools don't leave the general area. They are to be replaced by end of shift or I go give a reminder. Never really had a problem until we had a bunch of new employees. They would see us trading tools every now and then. Then they decided they were invited as well. And helped themselves, and tools started comming up missing.
Thats when all sharing had to stop. Still went on in a limited basis but basically stopped as we had to constatnly tell the others no, but they would see us still borrowing / loaning.
I don't loan cutting tools. I simply state too much liability. I have had people come over to use my saw. And I always do the cuts. They are like I don't want to bother you. Just need the saw. Again I repete, too much liability. Normally I don't mind, as it is useually something quick and simple. I definately will not loan to someone who has the means and need to buy their own tools. I can't even afford the ones I have let alone let someone who can, wear out mine.
Edited 1/27/2008 7:40 am ET by benhasajeep
Is there a good way to tell them NO without getting them pissed off..
My boss likes to reach into my tool bag to borrow tools. His lack of knowledge of cabinet tools has led me to not care a whit if he gets pissed off when I tell him NO. He's used my nicely honed cabinet scrapers as drywall mud tools (leaving them covered with mud and rusting). Last week he needed to pry out something and he grabbed my scraper burnisher. Before he could bust the end off, I retireved it and told him sternly to not take my tools. When he pushed back, I showed him the two deep grooves he added to the bottom of my 60 1/2 block plane when planing over nails. All he could do in return is to show me a dumbstruck look.
Mallett him. On the head.Philip Marcou
Being a pensioner, I tell them I cannot afford to replace the tools I have, but if possible will myself help them with the odd job. Of course my time is not money and I do get back a lot of goodwill. Also we have good neighbours.
You can't control what other people feel so don't spend a lot of time worrying about it. I would rather someone else be pissed off because I would not loan them a tool than me being pissed off because someone damaged or forgot to bring back one of my tools.
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled