Replies

1. 
   ring | Jul 26, 2006 07:41am | #1

   Masrol,

   I know you addressed this to dgreen, but I'll butt in anyway.  I've bought many cordless tools in the US and taken them overseas for use.  You will need either a transformer from 220V to 110V to use with the charger, or if it is available locally you can buy a 220V charger.  I have half a dozen DeWalt tools (18V) running this way without any problems.

   DR

1. 
   Masrol | Jul 26, 2006 09:23am | #2

   Thanks Ring...

   At this very hour, I just can think of dgreen. He  usually works until 2AM.  The rest of KNOT members are having  night rest after long hours  working  in dusty shops. 

   What time now is in Isreal Ring?  If I am not mistaken you're the one who posts the Olive tree pic.  Sorry  if I am wrong. I like  it very much. Without your permission I had it downloaded. Not only you, I my self feel sorry if the tree has to go.

   I hope  you and  that  very nice "zaitun tree"  (olive tree) will be safe.

   Thanks.

   Masrol         

    

    

   Edited 7/26/2006 2:27 am by Masrol

   Edited 7/26/2006 2:31 am by Masrol

1. 
   ring | Jul 26, 2006 10:46am | #3

   Yes, I posted the photo of the "zaitoun" tree near my home.  We are 3 hours east of Greenwich Mean Time, and I'm on the net at unusual hours anyway.  Thanks for your wishes.

   DR

2. 
   tmaxxx | Jul 29, 2006 07:49am | #18

   i have a question re 220v countries.  when you buy a cordless tool how long does it take to charge the batteries. eg.  a dw 18v takes about 1 hour in 110v.  does it do it faster?Tmaxxx

   Urban Workshop Ltd

   Vancouver B.C.

   cheers.  Ill buy.

1. 
   ring | Jul 29, 2006 09:33am | #19

   Good question, and instead of just answering off the top of my head, I'll check it and let you know.  I have lots of DW 18V batteries.

   DR

   OK, after checking this morning - it takes about an hour for a full charge of the DW 18v batteries with my 220V charger.  So it doesn't seem to matter whether the house current is 110 or 220.

   Edited 7/30/2006 3:06 am by ring

2. 
   Masrol | Jul 29, 2006 07:08pm | #21

   Hi Tmaxxx,

   I'm in 220-240V country. I have 12V battery for my cordless drill/driver. The manual says it fully charged within 30 minutes. Yes it does when it is still new. Overtime, it takes longer time.

     

2. 
   John_D | Jul 27, 2006 07:57am | #4

   Check the plate on your charger.  It'll say what power it handles, both in terms of volts and cycles.  If the voltage is a mismatch, you can solve this with a transformer, as long as the cycles are the same.  If the cycles are a mismatch (eg, the charger says 60 Hz and the power is 50 Hz), you'll need a much more sophisticated switching device, as a transformer may damage the unit or batteries.

   I have a number of units that need nothing other than a physical adaptor, as they are suited for 110V to 240V and 50-60 Hz.  I have other units that cannot run in (my example) Australia because they're 60 Hz only.

   My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.
1. 
   ring | Jul 27, 2006 10:01am | #6

   John,

   I need to differ with you about the cycles - I don't think it matters for a charger.  I have a DeWalt charger from the US marked 120V and 60 cycles.  It has been in use for 6 months with a transformer (from 220V to 120V) but of course at 50 cycles which is the local current.  It's hard to argue with the fact that it works fine.

   DR 

1. 
   John_D | Jul 27, 2006 07:55pm | #7

   No need to argue.  Your experience is working out great.

   My point is that some of the modern electronics have pretty sophisticated electronics and can be damaged by running on juice for which they are not designed.  I doubt you'd be looking at any danger (although I'd not run a 120 device on 240 without a transformer), more likely just degraded charger / battery life.  If it were tested and reliable at 50Hz, they'd mark it that way, because they're certainly active in 50 Hz markets.

   Of course, a more sinister interpretation would be that because they sell at a higher price in the European market and therefore INTENTIONALLY mark the US ones as 60 Hz only, and mark exactly the same units destined for Europe as 50 Hz.  Sort of like DVD region encoding, designed to allow the movie companies to charge what the market will bear in different parts of the world, and make it difficult or illegal for the gray market to subvert their dreams of mountains of extra cash.My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

1. 
   ring | Jul 27, 2006 11:44pm | #8

   Hey John,  I wouldn't rule out your "sinister" explanation.  But it might just be innocent as well.  I don't know of anywhere where the current is 120V at 50 cycles.  (Maybe there is)  Could be simply that these chargers are meant for US customers and they write "60 cycles" just 'cause that's what the US runs on.

   I'm no electronics guy, but I don't see what the cycles would matter in a charger of this type.  

   DR 

1. 
   John_D | Jul 28, 2006 12:09am | #9

   In australia it's 240v and 50 Hz, so no simple adaptor/transformer works for things that need 60 Hz.

   I cannot say with authority that this or that device will or won't be dependable at 50 Hz, which I mention just because it's easy to solve the voltage problem, but the cycles issue is harder.My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

2. 
   Masrol | Jul 28, 2006 05:32am | #10

   Thanks John D

   I did make a search on how  a transformer or voltage inverter  works.  For a step-down one it converts  power supply from 220V-240v  to  110V-120V and  the reversal of that for the step-up transformer.  It just converts the voltage but not the hertz (cycle). A transformer  can be used for most  of electrical devices & motors.  However, it may not be suitable for  electronic devices like  TV, Computer, microwave oven etc.  unless  it is  stated  on the power plate that  it accepts 50hz to 60hz power.

   I have no idea of  "battery charger" falls in which category.  

   Thanks         

       

3. 
   John_D | Jul 28, 2006 07:02am | #12

   The more sophisticated, the more careful you want to be IMHO.  I only kicked into the thread to say that the quickest way to get a good answer is to check the plate. :)My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

4. 
   rcobb | Jul 28, 2006 07:51am | #13

   I'm in Australia and I've a transformer that goes from 240 to 110 and 60 to 50 htz

   I've used it on v28 chargers, worm drive saws etc  without any problems, it's about the size of a brick and seems to have the density of lead.

5. 
   dgreen | Jul 28, 2006 08:02am | #14

   I would be interested in more information on that unit, there must be more than a transformer in it. Granted it's been three decades since I got my electronics degrees but I don't think a transformer can input one frequency and output another.
   Since the house is on fire let us warm ourselves. ~Italian Proverb

6. 
   John_D | Jul 28, 2006 08:40am | #15

   No, you've got it right.  A transformer can change voltage, but not frequency.  I've seen adaptors like what he's got -- you could cobble one together from a DC adaptor an an AC inverter.

   When I go to Australia I only take devices that are cool with 50 Hz, because my own adaptor is only a step-down (240 -> 120) transformer.My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

7. 
   dgreen | Jul 28, 2006 09:07am | #16

   I would think the chargers would probably be ok on a transformer since most of the ones I've had apart had a full wave bridge before the electronics stages, my concern would be over heating of the step down xfmer in the charger due to the increased duty cycle and the tendency of manufactuers to design close to the line for cost reduction purposes. I don't think I would leave one plugged in unattended. In the old days we used to spec parts for a minimum of 50 percent over the load we expected them to see and preferred to spec at 100 percent over. I don't see that philosophy in many of todays products.
   Since the house is on fire let us warm ourselves. ~Italian Proverb

8. 
   John_D | Jul 28, 2006 08:10pm | #17

   If you hear a zooming sound, that's your explanation sailing over my head.  My understanding of electronics is still on a primarily mystical level, though unlike James Thurber's grandma, I do not plug up my outlets to keep electricity from leaking all over the floor. :)

   Still, it all seems to come down to "if you go outside what the spec plate says, exercise caution" and I don't think you disagree that it could possibly shorten the life of the charger and/or battery (heat).My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.

9. 
   skidkid | Jul 29, 2006 03:28pm | #20

   dg,

   I would also be interested in that unit; most phase converters I've heard about are the size of a volkswagen.

   The electricity on Bonaire is 110-127 (it varies) and 50 cycles.

   A dewalt 12V cordless drill 120V/60hz recharges well on Bonaire current; I've been using it for almost 3 years now without a problem.

   Pasa bon dia. 

   Edited 7/29/2006 6:03 pm by skidkid

10. 
    Masrol | Jul 29, 2006 07:40pm | #22

    If you meant transformer or voltage inverter,  the size  for 2000watt is about 7'" X 5" X  8"  (L H W). For on site use  with  2 output sockets, it is slightly bigger but  surely volkswagen can carry...one. 

    Masrol  

11. 
    skidkid | Jul 30, 2006 01:39am | #23

    Masrol,

    50hz to 60hz converter was what I meant.

    Converter the size of a volkswagen may have been an exaggeration but I know it takes 3 men and a boy to move one of these rascals.

    Pasa bon noche.

12. 
    rcobb | Jul 31, 2006 12:17pm | #24

    Maybe I'm wrong, but will get the info for you in a day or two.

    Regards

    Richard

3. 
   dgreen | Jul 27, 2006 08:07am | #5

   Sorry it took so long to get back to you, I was searching to see if I could find a 220 charger sold on the internet. I had no luck.You may have to go with an adapter/transformer. Some of the companys do offer a charger with 12vdc input that you can charge from a vehicle or automotive charger. I'm waiting for a call back from the Metabo rep to see if they have a european version he can get me a part number for.

   Since the house is on fire let us warm ourselves. ~Italian Proverb
1. 
   Masrol | Jul 28, 2006 05:48am | #11

   Hi Dgreen

   Thank you for your effort.

   I'm also trying  to find out internet-retailers in UK carrying 36V battery charger especially for  Dewalt  cordless  power tools.  It seems that 24V  is the latest in the market in UK.  

   Thanks again

   Have a nice sleep !