Replies

1. 
   roc | Nov 30, 2011 11:12pm | #1

   Of course pretty comes with a price.

   This web site is not so helpful and does not show what they have to the best advantage.  Their paper catalog is sooo much better so I recommend calling them to send you a catalog.

   If you like pretty then you might like these then

   http://www.japanwoodworker.com/product.asp?s=JapanWoodworker&pf_id=05%2E307%2E06&dept_id=12783

   I have these

   http://www.japanwoodworker.com/product.asp?s=JapanWoodworker&pf_id=05%2E306%2E38&dept_id=12795

   Yah they're NICE.  Kind of a different world price wise huh ?

   I was talking with a doctor of english literature today.  He was saying how four hundred dollars was too much to repair his bicycle.  He had worn the thing down to a stump from riding the hell out of it.  I showed him my bike that I rode to work on and said that's about five thousand worth. Which is literally mid price by the way for a hand made bicycle. He was speechless.

   I am sure he makes more money than I do.  It's all perspective.

   We are taking food out of the mouths of American workers by buying Japanese chisels  and so probably we should be taken out and shot.

    Japanese chisels are hard to beat though.  Maybe make it up by buying one of each of the LN planes.  I am well on my way in that regard so I don't feel too bad about not buying their chisels.  LN does have nice strong chisels though.  Good stuff.  

2. 
   RalphBarker | Dec 01, 2011 12:18pm | #2

   perspectives

   The beauty of a chisel is certainly in the mind of the beholder. Personally, I like the appearance of the LNs, as well as their design and quality of steel (I chose the A-2). I have both their Bevel Edge Socket Chisels and their mortise chisels. But, I also have a set of Japanese bench chisels (not the really expensive ones Roc provided links for), and a set of Japanese bent-neck paring chisels. Then, there's the old set of Lee Valley, and the vintage set (1950 or so) of Marples, and a couple of Millers Falls utility chisels. A fella just can't have too many chisels, nor clamps. ;-)

   The socket design of the LNs does require mindful handling, since the handles can loosen with changes in temperature. But, as you mention, the advantage of the socket-style is that you can easily turn your own handles, out of your material of choice, and as long as you want. Of course, this can be done for tanged chisels, too, but not as easily.

3. 
   Troy | Dec 01, 2011 01:12pm | #3

   I like the Japanese chisels a lot and I don't think there are a lot of off the shelf chisels that work as well for dovetails.  I especially like that they come in a huge number of widths.  The biggest problem with them is that I live about a half mile from the Japan woodworker store soe I have more than I really need.  That being said the Blue spuce chisels look pretty nifty.

4. 
   lwilliams | Dec 01, 2011 07:05pm | #4

   I've been faced with a need for some good chisels for a few years and I've been looking everywhere. The problem is that almost everything on the market today has serious limitations. Japanese chisels a way too thick and clumsy. Some out there are too thin and a uniform thickness along their length. Most, though, are way too thick and/or socketed. I want tanged bevel edge (properly called bevel back) chisels that taper in thickness and down to something less than 1/8". This gives them a resilience and feed-back you won't get from other chisels. I want the handles to be appropriately sized for each size of chisel. I have some old Buck Brothers chisels that are pretty good but they're from when Buck Brothers drew their chisels back a little too far when tempering. As a result, I've sharpened them a lot over the years and they're a little short. The handles on the old Buck Brothers chisels are beat up and need to be replaced. The closest I've seen to proper bench chisels are Ashley Iles MK2 chisels but their bolsters are too heavy and mess up the feel plus the handles don't properly balance the chisel size. I think the Ashley Iles MK2 chisels are probably the best new ones out there but I think I'll just bite the bullet and make what I really want.

1. 
   weedsnager | Dec 01, 2011 08:08pm | #5

   i'm not interested in the japanese. has anyone put the stanley sweethearts thru a good workout?

2. 
   roc | Dec 02, 2011 12:40am | #6

   Could this be the beginning of something great ! ?

   >I'll just bite the bullet and make what I really want.<

   annnnnnd . . . maybe some day . . . add them to your line of, the apex of the art, hand tools ?  That would be very cool.

    

1. 
   roc | Dec 02, 2011 02:55am | #7

   Don't give up so easy

   By the way Usu-Nomi means "thin chisel"

   The second link calls them " light, long, thin chisels"

   Japanese chisels come in more varieties than any other that I have found.  The handles generally are smaller.  (not thicker there either) .  But I know what you mean.  The off the rack stuff that is generally available, often are mortising chisels or thickish "dovetail" shaped , are kind of clunky; makes me want to take them to the grinder to thin the sides.  My better ones are plenty thin.

   Long handle is better balance than long blade.

   http://www.japan-tool.com/nomi/Kiyotada_Usu/Kiyotada_Usu.html

   http://www.fine-tools.com/usu-nomi.html

   and hardness 64 to 66 verses high fifties in the western stuff if one is lucky enough to get one that hard.  The modern Sorbies from Woodcraft are like play dough.  Mortising with them is comical unless you need to get something done then it makes you cry.  Lots of practice sharpening out dings so that is fun.

   Here is a chisel test article.  Kind of old.

   https://www.finewoodworking.com/ToolGuide/ToolGuidePDF.aspx?id=2616

   I have one other chisel test article in the files here but didn't find it.  I think I pulled it to show to some one.

   PS: to dismiss Japanese chisels without actually chiseling with them is to be in danger of being called a cotton headed ninnymuggins.

   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fig956-MuVA

   :    )

5. 
   roc | Dec 03, 2011 01:41am | #8

   You Just Go Right Ahead And Make What You Make Best

    >We won't be selling chisels<

   Heck.

   It would be interesting to see and use some of the old style instruments you speak of.

   I can kind of relate to thin.  My most useful daily use knives, pocket and kitchen are very thin.

   My pocket knife I sharpen nearly along the main taper rather than the steep secondary bevel that it came with from the factory.

   I pulled out this little wimpy pocket knife to cut a fairly big wire tie for a customer.  He said "you won't cut it with that.  I already tried a ninja knife and couldn't cut it ".

   [ what ever a ninja knife is ]

   He says "Just lend me some diagonal cutters ( dikes ) ".  Using my little thin pocket knife I cut right through it with out much effort.  He just stood there with his mouth open.

   So much for "ninja knives".

   Since I have you on the line let me say:  my first plane from you guys that I ordered a couple of months ago is going to be my MAIN Christmas present ( even if it doesn't come until January ) so don't let me down now.  Maybe skipping production of the chisels so you can focus on the planes is the best way to go after all.

   Thanks,