Dear All,
I am considering a moulder and these two fall into my price range. I have heard nothing but raves about the W&H, but it seems pretty pricey for what you get. The Woodmaster seems a bargain by comparison, but I have no experience with either machine. I would appreciate any opinions.
Best,
John
Replies
I don't believe you can make curved mouldings on a Woodmaster.
Jack
Yes you can make curved moulding w/ a Woodmaster. May be a little more work the first time, but jig plans are available. Will try to get some more info from my neighbor who has one.
You can certainly make curved mouldings on a Woodmaster but not as tight a curve. There is a half priced alternative to the W & H, a Shop Fox and Bridgewood as well. Jet, Craftsman also sell a planer moulder. The W & H isn't perfect by any means. I believe the clones are pretty much equal. Then there is the old standard...Foley Belsaw planer moulder. There are a couple of options on the curved fixture as well. One is the Schmidtt version and I can't recall the other one at the moment and you can easily build your own. It's not rocket science but others would like you to believe so.
Edited 1/31/2007 7:45 am ET by RickL
I have a Woodmaster 718 and am well pleased with it. Just got through running 300 feet of custom molding for a local county courthouse restoration project, and am in the process of ordering 2500 bf of cherry for another project that fell in to my lap. I have no doubts it will handle the job with no problem. I have not used the W/H, so I can't compare, but it will cut curves, and the company includes a video concerning it.
The beauty of this machine is the variable speed feed rate. You can really slow it down if you need to, and this allows figured wood to come out really smooth.
Would I buy it again if I had to do it over? Yup.
Dear Creek,
Thanks for weighing in. I must admit, that I like the idea of the Woodmaster, but a "multi-role" anything, makes me suspicious. A couple of questions, if you don't mind, how deep a moulding would you say it can cut? Can it go 1 1/2" How about putting an edge on stock? Thanks Again,Best,John
John, looking in their catalog of knives, I see some picture frame profiles that are 1 and 1/8 inch deep, and they require 3 knives to go that deep in a single pass. I'm not sure how deep they can go, they could tell you. In cutting coves, one knife can do it, but I have over 800 lineal feet to cut in cherry, and I purchased an extra 2 knife head to place on the shaft. This lets me speed up the feed rate, while still getting a smooth cut. This is 5 and 1/2 inch wide crown.
As far as the "multi-role" aspect, I've changed back and forth to the molding operation from the planer several times, and it's no problem. It's a well made piece. The company can direct you to someone in your area, and I believe they would be happy to show you what it can do.
What kind of an edge are you talking about? Straight lining a board? It comes with a gang rip capability, but I haven't used that yet. It won't take the place of a jointer, you'll still have to get one straight edge, and the molding strips need to be ripped to just oversize. But it's done what I've asked of it so far, and from my research, they have many pleased customers out there.
regards,
Jerry
Dear Jerry,
IUn particular, i am looking to profile some shelf edges. I realize That I won't be able to get the entire shelf, on edge through the machine, so I thought that i could put the profile on some stock and then attach to my shelving material. The profile is a nose & cove that is 1 1/2" thick, with the nose becoming bullnose at the top. Pretty standard stuff, I imagine, for a shaper. Is this your primary planer as well?John
John, I'm not sure, but I think the profile you want can be cut on the woodmaster. I have another planer I use for most everything, but I use the woodmaster for highly figured wood on the last couple of passes.
I see where Jeff has had some experience with the woodmaster. So far I haven't had any trouble like his friend has, but I've only had it for about 6 months. I have seen other posts before about how pleased owners have been after many years, even purchasing multiple machines to raise production levels. I''m sure there'll always be exceptions to the norm, in both directions.
Jerry
John
I have a W & H moulder, and there is a good reason why it's more money than the clones. I've got some experience with the Woodmaster, and I've seen the the Jet clone and shop fox clone.
From experience, the WH will give you cleaner mouldings with less cleanup for a longer period of time. A woodworking competitor who I'm friendly with has the woodmaster, and tells me after 6 years, he has had it with the machine. Constantly repairing it, and the knives don't always line up well, leaving offset margins and alot of extra sanding or scraping afterward. I've seen it with my own eyes, so that is why I'm saying it.
My moulder is 7 years old now. It still operates as new. I disassemble and clean it once a year (takes an hour, and I'm anal), and I've changed the power feed wheels once, $50.00. I sell mouldings to the local builders, and have run thousands (plural) of linear feet through the machine without a hiccup.
You can make mouldings in one pass without a problem. With deeper profiles, like large crown, I take 2, and remove the final 1/8" to leave a very nice finish better than you'll get at the local hardwood supply.
The 220 V motor is very strong. It never, ever bogs down, not even in hickory or rock maple.
Jeff
Dear Jeff,
I suspected as much about the clones, which is why I am trying not to consider them. You make an interesting argument, as I work commercially and have little patience for what doesn't work. I am wondering what sort of problems that your friend has had. I take it that the W&H is pretty straight forward as to lining up the knives and getting consistent results. Would you agree with that?John
My post got lost so I'll Try again.
This is very topical for me. I went through the same search.
It seems the W&H is favored by a lot of professionals for a lot of reasons. Apparently, knife installation and alignment is easier. Also, because of the open sides, you can run panels, etc., which you can't with the combo planer/moulders everybody else sells. I guess if you don't have a planer then the combo machines can make some sense, but you'd probably want a better planer.
I was in contact with a US knife shop who told me he has many customers who have the Shop Fox and are very pleased with it. (by the way - shop around for knives some places charge more for a stock knive than W&H charges for a custome profile!)
As for the clones, Shop Fox has dealers up here, but they don't want to sell Shop Fox, they want to switch you over to King, General, or whatever they've got. King has the non-adjustable feed clone, but they've discontinued it. I have one King dealer who has some of these discontinued machines for about 50% higher than the cost of the same Shop Fox (he doesn't tell you they are discontinued).
Interestingly Canadian W&H dealers charge about 50% (plus shipping) than the unit costs bought directly from the factor, delivered, etc.).
Shop Fox is currently out of stock. Personally, I may end up biting the bullet and buying the W&H. At least its a low risk decision.
I have the Shop Fox clone and have been very happy with it.------------------------------------
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. -- Herbert Spencer (1891)
John
The WH moulder uses cutterknife stock that has holes drilled into it for securing the knives to the machines cutterhead. There is absolutely no slop when installing them. Also, on the cutterhead, there is a ridge that all knives get registered against. Therefore, as long as knives are duplicated properly, then there is no real room for error in the moulding process. As long as you use a competent source for cutting your knives, then you've got nothing to worry about.
The problems that I mentioned an associate having with the woodmaster had more to do with the long lasting quality of the machine than with anything else. He was constantly repairing it (His words, not mine.) That may not be indicative of all of the Woodmaster machines, but he would not be a very good reference. Based on the issue's I saw him having, I bought the W & H instead. He also runs a local sawmill, and before I got my own, I used to have him saw my logs, so I was in contact with him quite frequently. I tried once to get a run of crown moulding in cherry from him, but he was waiting for parts. That is really what prompted me to decide to buy my own machine. As I'm sure you know, if you market it correctly, moulding making can be quite a nice little profit center for your business, and really helps fill in any down time between larger commissions.
Jeff
Edited 1/31/2007 4:32 pm ET by JeffHeath
I also have the Shop Fox moulder. It's a very good machine for the price. It has been living in my custom cabinet shop for the past 2 years. Although we don't use it every day ( just for curved and elliptical mouldings) it has worked well with no problems. Cutters have lined up nicely and give crisp profiles. I think there is a retro fit available that allows for variable speed feed rates. I think this would give you even better results ( I am going to get one ).
Paul
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