I am wondering if there is a low moisture glue available for veneering? Have used regular ole titebond in past and had success, but yesterday it curled the veneer so bad all the carefully joined seems split right apart. Managed to get in bag and it came out just fine but the panic is something I would rather avoid.
It has been suggested that I use something like uni-bond 800 as it is more rigid and has longer open time but how about moisture? Any help would be appreciated.
Chris
Replies
I took a class by David Marks last weekend on vacuum press veneering here in Columbus, Ohio at Woodcraft and one of the points was to not put glue on the veneer. The glue is always put on the substrate only. Any time the glue is applied directly to the veneer it will curl quickly. David uses the urea powder glues as the hardness of the cured glue prevents the joint from moving. Tightbond is a wonderful glue for most woodworking but it never gets as hard as the urea glues and it is subject to flexing because of heat. Using urea glues is even more important if you are doing curved laminations to reduce the spring-back on removal from the forms.
I can highly recommend the class by David Marks. He is a very knowledgeable woodworker and teaches with an easy to understand style. Very nice person too.
Bruce
"I can highly recommend the class by David Marks. He is a very knowledgeable woodworker and teaches with an easy to understand style. Very nice person too."
Just don't ask him about finishing. :^(
Rob, running for cover
THERE IS ONLY ONE FINISH!! TUNG OIL!!! HA! HA!
That's what is on the show, but if you look at the can, and on his website FAQ page it is actually a oil/varnish mix by General Finishes. Here is the quote from his FAQ page:
" I have tried various methods of mixing linseed oil and tung oil in the past, but since the mid 80’s I’ve been using a product called Seal-A-Cell and Arm-R-Seal made by the General Finishes Company and available through mail order as well as from Woodcraft."
I really like it too. I started using it before I paid attention to what David was recommending on the recomendation of the owner of a local wood supply store, not Woodcraft. I can understand not recommending a brand on the show if they are not a sponsor, but he does show the back of the can sometimes and it is from General.
Hopefully this will not start a finish war!!
Bruce"A man's got to know his limitations." Dirty Harry Calahan
Rob:
David lives and works in California and Tung oil is one of the very few finishes they let into the state. Everything on earth causes cancer in California so they have many restrictions on finishes. Looking through a recent finishing catalog I was stunned to see what cannot be shipped into the state. Glad I'm in Colorado!!
Madison
I use epoxy for that reason, among others. There is no water or anything that evaporates in it, so I can roll it onto both parts. It has plenty of open time, so there is no panic to get it in the bag, and works like a lubricant when I am doing curved work. When it sets, it has all of the properties you would want in a veneer glue.
The first time I offered to write an article for FWW, was on this back in the late eighties. I sent them a hand written direction. They sent it back telling me that it would have to be typed, along with an outline. I fooled around with that outline for a long time. I probably failed to provide a suitable outline, so didn't make the cut.
If you are interested in giving it a try, let me know, and I will write a bit more.
Chris,
There is a cold press glue available at Joe Woodworker that works well. It is a PVA type and has a high solids content which reduces bleed through. I have used it on a lot of projects with no major problems. I second the comment from another poster about applying glue to the substrate only.
Urea formaldehyde adhesives like Unibond also work well. Keep in mind that they are very temperature sensitive. The temperature must be above 65 F in order to cure. Cure time at 70 F is about 10 to 12 hours. Cure time at 95 F is about 2 hours. Most people heat the sandwich with an electric blanket in order to speed up the process.
Good luck, Tom.
Uni bond is the great for this. I bet you tried to shift the veneer sheet and thats when you joints split? Been there, done that. The kick time of the PVA is so short that you really do not have much time after you roll it out smooth onto the panel. The benefit of uni bond is it does give you time. Its easy to mix and so long as you dont plan to bath in it, I really dont think it is that bad for you. You can roll it out and once the face veneer is down you will still be able to adjust it and not tear out all of those joints you spent hours making. The downside is that you need to leave it in the bag a lot longer (five hours if you go with a medium amount of hardner).
I am assuming you didnt roll the PVA onto the veneer. Thats not a good idea.
Brad
Edited 11/6/2008 6:15 pm ET by brad805
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