i am preparing to buy a new table saw and many other tools for that matter. i finally got the space and money for upgrading from bench top/small contratcor styles (Ryobi bt3000). The first thing that came to mind was the saw that started it all…Delta Unisaw with a 50″ Beismeyer fence. I will certainly get the widest fence possible
Is the Unisaw the end all be all for small to medium sized furniture and cabinet shops (one man shop, not commercial production shop)? Also should i drop the extra $250 or so for the 5hp? I will be milling equal parts 3/4″-1″ plywood and 8/4 solid hardwood (oak, mahogany, cherry, walnut etc…)
Are all fences created equal? Unifence vs. Beismeyer vs. Accufence vs. Xacta fence
Replies
Unisaw is very good, and is easy to resell, but there are other good saws out there, like General and Jet (I've seen a lot of good posts about Grizzly too...). I have heard from several people that the Powermatic 66 is even nicer than the unisaw (more rugged and better finish) although I've never used one. 3HP, I would think, is enough for most shops (I'll be waiting for what others have to say about this), and 5HP, I'm pretty sure, takes three phase electricity (which many small or home shops don't have).
Maybe this archive' message will help you in your choice!
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-knots/messages?msg=5077.8
Peter
Don't want to torque anyone off, but I can't figure out why a weekend woodworker needs the horsepower of a high end cabinet saw. Its your $$$ and I always buy the best I can afford, but a Unisaw is a bit of overkill for a saw thats only gonna run for a few hours a week. Also,if you're not used to that kind of horsepower you could get yourself into some quick trouble. Dealing with a kickback on a contractors saw with a horse and a half of power is quite different than a 5 horse cabinet saw. A lower end saw will serve you just a well. Good luck, have fun and be safe.
I'm with EXHIBITOR on this matter but it's not our money so all I can say is "enjoy" and get what you want.
A lower end saw will serve you just a well.
EXHIBITOR and MFG_KING Sorry guys, I've been there, done that, don't want the tee-shirt. You don't hafta be a NASCAR driver to appreciate the pleasure of a Corvette and you don't hafta be full time cabinet maker to enjoy the best tools you can buy.
And when the day is over, he will still have the value of the tools in the shop, unlike the golfer who puts up far bigger bucks for his club membership.
I recently picked up a Powermatic 66 with 5 horsepower 3 phase. It is now hooked to 220 single phase using a variable frequency drive to deliver the required 3 phase. Nothing I have ever used runs as sweetly as this saw useing a VFD. Soft start, nearly instant stop, and power that you CAN NOT slow down. No more oak or cherry burned by the blade because it couldn't be fed fast enough. With this set up, I don't even want a new 5 hp single phase for it.
Just bragging, sorry.
BJGardening, cooking and woodworking in Southern Maryland
Dealing with a kickback on a contractors saw with a horse and a half of power is quite different than a 5 horse cabinet saw.
Exhibitor,
I'll grant you that a board launched by a 5 hp. motor is going to strike with more speed and force than one kicked by 1.5 hp., but either way the results are quite nasty.
Keep those saws guarded and work safely!
Jeff
Jeff,
Does it not make sense that a better quality saw will have less chance of kickback? The key words there are 'less chance'. I have had three instances where kickback has occured in the past two years...they were all on the $99 table top model...cutting 1/4 plywood. The table top model is gone now and I avoid 1/4 ply like the plague.
It seems to me that kickback can be caused by the wood, the equipment or the operator. Having the equipment of higher quality and properly aligned reduces that risk somewhat.
BG,
You're right on all but one point. I think most kick back results from operator error, i.e. pulling a piece back into the blade. Set-up would, it seems, not be a problem as long as everything is properly aligned. And we all have watched in horror as we see a board twisting as it moves through the saw - yikes!
I can't see, however, how the quality of the machine would have much to do with kick back, unless of course the fence were of such poor quality that it wouldn't lock parallel to the blade.
Hope you're enjoying your new saw.
Jeff
I bought a 9" Delta saw - jointer in 1976. It is a 4" jointer and 9' contracters saw. It is no longer made. It came with a 1hp 110V motor.. I have since put on a 40" bies homeshop fence, so I to make a seperate m=stand for the jointer. I use the 1hp for the jointer and bought a 2hp Baldor for the saw. It is plenty for me doing weekend stuff and you know I built a 2100 square foot house with this when it was still 1hp. For the serious hobbyist it is really not about the hp. It is blades techniquw and set up. I still bog and bind with double the hp. It is a really nice set up now tho'. I put a red link belt and a smaller pulley on the blade so it spins a little faster. Maybe I will try the origional pulley because I may have sacrificed speed for torque.
I have dreamed of a unisaw, but I am good now. My shop is 12X
16 pretty good for living 400 miles west of Anchorage!
16, prety good
Eadams,
Congratulations ! Good Luck.
Usually the top three are Unisaw, Powermatic and General...and not necessarily in that order. Powermatic is a bit heavier, perhaps bigger trunnions...Unisaw has not changes models in decades...parts readily/easily available. You'll get a lot of opinions...
I think, usually you would consider the 5hp if you want a 12" blade. This might be useful for resawing draw sides, etc. There are a lot of opinions about fenses and fense length...
Eadams25,
When I was doing my soul-searching and information searching on the same issue, I found that for the same money as the Delta 3HP 50" unisaw, I could buy the 5HP 12" blade, 50" fence from Grizzly. It runs on single phase, though it resides on a lone 30 amp circuit just for the saw. If you have the electrical supply, why not get the bigger saw? You'll never sit around in the evenings wondering what life would be like if you had just went ahead and got the 5HP saw instead of settling for the 3HP. The latest Tool Crib catalog shows the Delta 3HP 50" Unisaw out the door for $1749.00. The Delta was $1699.00 when I was shopping. The Grizzly 5HP delivered is $1620.00. What would you buy with the extra $129.00? Something to think about.
Don Z.
Dear eadams25:
You have an interesting question and replies. Though I have a smaller shop, I have employed a Powermatic 66 Tablesaw w/ a 50" fence and a 3 HP motor with excellent results. A friend who is a master cabinetmaker also uses the same saw, plus a 12" 3 HP Powermatic saw. He (his shop) purchases over $1 million dollars a year of Formica for various cabinets, desks and display casework. He also uses wood veneers, plywood, several grades of particle board as well as various natural woods. His 10" saw has only needed one professional repair in 20 years. His 12" saw has not yet needed repair of 12 years daily use.
There are several Italian and a German Table Saw makers that are supposed to best the Powermatic, including price, though I've read no reviews to date confirming this. To my knowledge, Powermatic is the top-of the-line American Table Saw. The other saws mentioned in your letters of reply should be tried, so you can find what is best for you. Each are different, and it is what feels best to you.
Regards,
Turbo
Just my opinion here, but I'm also in the crowd that wonders what you get from 5 hp in a 10 inch saw. I have a General 350 I have cut 5 inch hard maple. Blade full height, turned the wood and finished the cut. It never bogged down, and this was hard maple. 5 hp would not have added anything. For this kind of work I think the blade is more important then hp. Don't think I'll ever forget how impressed I was after the first time I forked out the money for a good blade, and they've gotten a lot better in the last 20 years. FWIW, I can remember 40 years ago when my father thought the money for carbide wasn't worth it! Needless to say, he doesn't feel the same anymore.
I'm also curious about the 3 phase motor being run with a convertor intentionally. I had a WS turret lathe in 85 that had a 3 phase motor I ran with a convertor. I ended up buying a single phase motor because I could never get realize the full potential of the motor and the power bills of running 2 high amp machines was outrageous. I have 3 phase power now, and I still don't use it. I know that whatever comes in the future I can run what I have. That's a risk with 3 phase and convertors just aren't as efficeint. I don't know, maybe advances in electronics has changed the reality I dealt with back when we had to walk up hill to school and back. ;-)
Don
Dear Don,
Your letter is appreciated. I agree with you.
I don't have any experience with 5 HP tablesaw motors, or 3-phase machines. I have inquired about them. From what I was told, these type of tablesaws would cut more dense hardwoods rather continously, daily. The 3-phase supplied electricity is a more gentle, continuous energy supply for the tablesaw motors. This may be more important when other machines/wood working equipment are turned on and off in a higher output shop or wood factory setting with multiple woodworkers.
Regards,
Turbo
Don, I'm not running my 3 phase motor on a converter. I'm using a Variable Frequency Drive. Not all VFDs are rated for single phase input but all of the ones that I've checked specs on are rated for 3 phase output. There is no loss of rated horse power if correctly matched.
BJGardening, cooking and woodworking in Southern Maryland
BJ,
Cool! When I had to do converting all that was available to me was static and rotary convertors. At least these were the only two options I was made aware of. Are these VFD's one for one, or can you run multiple machines off of one black box?
Don
VFDs are sized to each specific motor. You can't run multiple tools like a rotary can. VFDs have been around for at least ten years. For more info contact a VFD manufacturer like Baldor and such or your local motor repair shop.
Thanks Rick. I didn't know the answer to Don C's question. My son set up my saw with his Hitachi VFD and now I'm looking for one of my own.
BJGardening, cooking and woodworking in Southern Maryland
Graingers, Baldor, Leeson can help but I recommend going to your motor repair shop for help in recommending one and setting it up. They are especially good on machines where infinitely variable speed is needed like drill presses, shapers, bridgeports. Gives full power compared to static. There's best uses for each type but few people seem to understand this and a lot gets confused. I've dealt with all of them in one way or another over 20 years and use my motor guy as much as possible.
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00126.asp
Here's a bit more on the FWW site but even he leaves a lot out. I suspect he has more theory than practical experience.
The Unisaw 3hp. has pretty good power-its has lots of power when you get it bound up and you get a kick back.Im sure bigger is better but hate to think ever getting it bound up with that 5hp and 12in. blade punching you to the back of the shop.
But I have never use a big saw might just be the thing
Ron
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