Replies

1. 
   PeteBradley | Mar 16, 2007 02:52am | #1

   Can you describe what's happening in more detail? If you've tried all the things the techs recommended it's possible your band has a bad weld, but that's little more than a guess without specifics.

   Pete

1. 
   user-224802 | Mar 16, 2007 05:50pm | #2

   The Band does not apear to have a bad weld you can usually tell if there welded up weird. (have tried two different blades with the same results).

     The band when I first got the saw kept running off the back of the top wheel. Tech support when I called them told me how to adjust the bottom wheel.Going thru there steps I have spent close to 24 hrs moving the wheel thru different planes to try and get the blade to stay on the wheel and not oscilliate front to back. No matter how the lower wheel is positioned will the blade come into a semblance of being Sq with the table. The lower edge of the band leads the top edge by the closets I could get it was 3/32" . The guides for the blade specifacly the rear thrust bearing lines up with the band facing the saw on the extreme right edge of the bearing , both top and bottom. Was able to move the top guide over enough to remedy that problem on the top guides.Bottom guides I was not able to remedy that situation without removing trunnions and slotting holes more.

     After 24 hours of working with the saw triing to get it to track. I finaly got the blade to stay on the wheels but I have not been able to get the front to back oscilation out of the blade.Several hours of on the phone with Rikon Tech support. I have given up on this saw. For the money this saw cost you should be able to get it to run with minor tweaking , when the answers the tech support gave me a lot of them was totaly differant than  everything that I thought I knew about bandsaws and how to tune a saw for optimal performance.

     In my 25 years of working wood I have done a lot and never say never but sometimes you get a lemon and I think this saw is one of them.

        

     

    

    

    

1. 
   forestgirl | Mar 16, 2007 06:02pm | #3

   "...sometimes you get a lemon and I think this saw is one of them. "  Sure sounds like it! and your 25 years of experience should stand you in good stead when you return it.  Is the company you bought it from likely to be cool about the situation?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

2. 
   PeteBradley | Mar 16, 2007 07:01pm | #4

   Weird.  I have zero experience with flat wheel bandsaws so I'm not sure what's going on.  Assuming all adjustments are correct, I wonder if a tire is uneven in some way or a shaft is bent.

    

   Good luck!

    

   Pete

3. 
   ajoe | Mar 16, 2007 07:35pm | #5

   Get someone who "really knows band saws" to help you adjust it properly. From your description, it does not sound like you are doing it properly. I have one and know they can be finicky until you learn how to set them up. The they wonderful!

4. 
   Glaucon | Mar 16, 2007 11:11pm | #8

   I'd be curious what John W of FWW thinks of this problem...Glaucon

   If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...

5. 
   DustyGeorge | Mar 17, 2007 04:14am | #9

   Have you checked that the upper and lower wheels are running in the same plane?  One way to do it:  Pull the table off.  Get a piece of 3/4 plywood with a straight edge long enough enough to reach past the upper and lower wheels.  Cut a notch out of it to clear the upper and lower cabinets then stick it up against the wheels.

   Good luck, GeorgeYou don't stop laughing because you grow old.  You grow old because you stop laughing. - Michael Pritchard<!----><!----><!---->

   <!----><!---->

6. 
   user-224802 | Mar 17, 2007 05:13pm | #10

    Thanks for the responses

      Question for those that own a Rikon 18". On your top wheel pivot point how much play is there in your saws?

     For those of you that questioned my doing it right. I was following a step by step procedure  faxed to me from Rikon Tech support. The best I have been able to get the band to stay on the wheels it is not running over the center of both wheels .Also the bottom guides are way out of wack to the left as you face the saw.I loosened the truinion bolts and tried to slide the assembly over , no movement to the right direction. 

     The bands I used to try and get it to track right we're the two bands that came with the saw from the local (2hr drive away) Woodcraft store. They have a 90 day return policy for all items.

     I did finaly get a band to stay on the wheels , but I never could get the back to forth ocilliation at an acceptable level.  When I straight edged the wheels the measurement on the bottom wheel was 7/16" different from the top of the wheel to the bottom of the wheel. There is when you turn the wheels by hand there is an aduible scraping noise from we're the drive pulley rubs the back case of the frame.

      Thanks, Woodman 

    

1. 
   CarvinChris | Mar 17, 2007 08:26pm | #12

   Yea mine had some play. I measured the 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock positions and found the 3 o'clock was forward by 1/8". I took some shim stock of just under 1/16" and wrapped it around the bushing. There is no longer any play in my upper wheel under tension and my tracking ability improved significantly. The upper wheel is on plane with itself. My blade stays consistantly dead nuts in the center of the wheel.  My blade actually squared up to the table (I was going to square the table to the blade, but now I don't have to). I reported my findings to Rikon tech's and they are presently experimenting with my idea (so they say).

   Pete has some good info that you could follw to help you with your problem. The most important thing is that your wheels are on plane with themselves. If they are and you still have tracking problems, then you should look at moving the lower wheel in or out to more closely match that of the upper wheel measurements.

   If any of you fellow 18" Rikon owners has a problem with your upper guide block not staying square to the blade, take the shaft that holds the block to the post and turn it around (blockend to postend), there is a useless indent in the blockend  which can keep your block from staying put.

   Likon my Rikon, bigtime.

    

   Chris.

2. 
   dtraversi | Mar 17, 2007 10:49pm | #13

   Sorry to hear about the Rikon woes- Mine has been a joy from day one.
   I checked the top wheel for play- with tension released- 1/8' play- with blade tensioned- zero noticable play- maybe thousandths.Dave

   Edited 3/18/2007 1:01 am ET by dtraversi

1. 
   fatboy2 | Mar 18, 2007 06:50pm | #17

   Glad to hear so much good about the Rikon 18. I got one for christmas and like it a lot. Have had no problems, but one uncertainity.
   Does your machine take 10-15 seconds to come up to speed after being turned on. I figure that is because of the heavy iron wheels.
   I have a curious electrical situation, in that my 240V come off a generator which give 240 directly into one wire, not two legs of 120.
   Is that relevant to startup time?
   Stef

2. 
   CarvinChris | Mar 18, 2007 09:31pm | #18

   I'm not the one you wrote to, but to answer your question; you bet it would. You need 120v per wire feeding your motor, if you only have one leg carrying 240v you will eventually burn your motor up.

   Find another way to power your saw as soon as possible.

   Chris.

   P.S. I make my living as an electrician.

3. 
   dtraversi | Mar 18, 2007 10:57pm | #19

   I can't find my stop watch but...One mississippi, two mississippi, three!
   2 and1/2 seconds till full speed.Sounds like the electrician's advice should be followed ...good luckDave

7. 
   PeteBradley | Mar 17, 2007 05:17pm | #11

   I just re-read your post and I see some issues. I also eyeballed the Rikon manual. This is a pretty straightforward design. I'm going to make some suggestions relative to some of your comments:

   > The Band does not apear to have a bad weld...have tried two different blades with the same results).

   If the weld is clean but not straight, it's impossible to tell without a straightedge, but it will cause oscillation. Was at least one a new, high quality band (not what came with the saw)?

   > The band when I first got the saw kept running off the back of the top wheel. Tech support when I called them told me how to adjust the bottom wheel.

   Usually this would be adjusted with the tracking knob (a lever on this saw). Co-planar is nowhere near as important as people think it is.

   > No matter how the lower wheel is positioned will the blade come into a semblance of being Sq with the table

   You don't square the band to the table. You square the table to the band. This is the last adjustment you do after everything else is dialed in.

   >...specify the rear thrust bearing lines up with the band facing the saw on the extreme right edge of the bearing ...Bottom guides I was not able to remedy that situation without removing trunnions and slotting holes more.

   Extreme right is not critical.

   In my 25 years of working wood I have done a lot and never say never but sometimes you get a lemon and I think this saw is one of them.

   I'm betting you're a great woodworker but don't have a lot of experience with machine design and precision. It sounds like you've changed a lot of stuff. Take it slow and in order and you should be able to get it back. Here's an abbreviated list from memory, in order, for putting a bandsaw back together:

   - good new band with straight weld

   - back guides off all the way

   - wheels coplanar to 1/8" or less (esp side to side)

   - mount band. Spin by hand and use track knob to center band on wheel

   - top guide (make sure guides match band at the top and bottom of guide travel. Some machines require you to move top wheel left/right if it doesn't front/back is almost always on the guide bar bracket itself

   - retrack band if necessary

   - bottom guide

   - square table to band by adjusting table.

   Pete

1. 
   user-224802 | Mar 18, 2007 04:37pm | #14

   On my saw without any tension on the top wheel it has over 1/4" side to side play at top pivot point on the top wheel. Under trnsion with a straight edge clamped across the front edge of saw frame the top wheel osciliates over 1/8" as you spin it by hand.

       I appreciate all the suggestions from other owners and the other comments.  

     Peter Bradley  Those we're all the things I went thru before calling Rikon.  My posting here was a last resort after doing everything that I knew to do.  It was more to get some feedback specificaly on the top wheel pivot point. From other posts it seems like my saw has a lot more play in this area.

   Woodman

       

    

    

1. 
   PeteBradley | Mar 18, 2007 06:12pm | #15

   1/4" of play is pretty poor, though I notice someone else mentioned their Rikon had a lot of play without tension. The top wheel carrier in mine (an old US-built Delta 20" industrial machine - much different) has some ability to adjust the clearance in the slide, and maybe the Rikon does too. Given the wobbly wheel and the play though, I think it's time to return yours and maybe look for another brand.Pete

2. 
   nikkiwood | Mar 19, 2007 08:41am | #20

   I'm just here for moral support. Given your own efforts, the very good advice on adjustments that have been offered here, and the testimony from other Rikon owners -- I would say you have exercised due diligence, and you are perfectly justified in asking them to replace the saw. Rikon is still trying to get their brand established, and I would be surprised if they gave you a hard time. If they resist, I would not hesitate to tell them you are an active participant in these wwing forums. They should be smart enough to realize the risk of having one dissatisfied customer bad-mouthing their brand across the internet.Good luck.********************************************************
   "It is what we learn after we think we know it all, that counts."

   John Wooden 1910-

3. 
   CarvinChris | Mar 18, 2007 06:22pm | #16

   Wow, the upper wheel moves forward/backward while its spinning? Bummer. My wheel would stay static under tension and I would have to apply a push/pull force to notice the play in my wheel. I just didn't like that fact that the wheel was pulled forward, that's why I shimmed mine.

   For your's it could be a bent shaft or a warped bearing, provided the wheel itself isn't warped. All of these Rikon will replace if it is truly so. The other possibility is the whole upper wheel assembly having too much slop in the frame work.

   In both cases-the upper wheel assembly and the lower guide bearings, compare everything to your parts breakdown in the back of your manual to make sure everything is there that should be there and all the screws are tight. there is a feller who had the same lower guide problem that you do, he wrote a review in FWW in the 18" bandsaw review section.

   If after all your trial and tribulation and you've exhausted all possibilities, take it back to where you got it and get another one. Hopefully you got it at Woodcraft, or some place like it that has at least a 90 day guarranty. Hopeflly too, you haven't made any alterations that might become an issue when you do (at least don't tell them so).

   Unfortunately machines being machines, sometimes you get one perfectly made, some (like mine) you have to fiddle with a bit, and sometimes ya gets a lemmon. I've read reviews from people that have encountered problems in saws costing twice as much as these. It is truly unfortunate you are encountering these problems. The Rikon is a really good saw for the price, it's a bummer that your experience hasn't been as good as the rest of us.

   Always ready to help, if I can,

   Chris.

    

    

2. 
   FredRowe | Mar 16, 2007 09:24pm | #6

   I also just bought the Rikon 10-345, but have only had minor adjustments to get it dialed in. I did, however, have a similar problem, but traced it to a mis-welded Timber Wolf blade. Sounds like you have more experience than I, but might it be the blade? I returned the blade the next day, and all was well. I have nothing but praise for Rikon support, real people with experience, not just "call takers". All that being said, I would ask Rikon at point they'd considered it a lemon, and authorize a return.

   Best of Luck.

3. 
   CarvinChris | Mar 16, 2007 11:02pm | #7

   If I can help you in any way I would need to know:

   1) your measurements of both your upper and lower wheels in the 12,3,6,9 o'clock positions (measure from the steel back of the saw to a flat point where the spoke meets the rim on the wheel).

   2) what kind of tension are you getting on your band. What size and make are your bands. Have you straight edged or placed on a flat surface the saw bands that won't track.

   3) is there a noticable crown on your tires.

   I have an 18" Rikon and it is one kick butt saw. Once you correct the sloppy Chinese craftmanship and make some minor adjustments to the engineering of this saw, you will find you have one awesome wood eating machine.

   Chris