I’m building a hall table and would love to hear your feedback a few design elements for aesthetics and practicality. This will be made of red oak and stained a honey-brown color.
1. Drawer proportions: Visually, are they the right height and size, relative to the case. Would full-face drawer fronts look better than insets (as shown)?
2. Lower shelf: Visually, does it add a necessary balance to the piece?
Would appreciate hearing any other thoughts you have. Thanks!
Replies
Hi,
I think the shelf adds some mass and heaviness and as such I think the design without is preferred.
With respect to to the drawers, they appear to be within a separate box almost as add in. Have you considered a design without the upper and lower sections of the box. Use the cross members for that purpose.
Andy
@Andy, You're right that the drawer box design is like an "add-in", intentionally so. I thought that I'd like some drawers for assorted BS that accumulates on a hall table, but I'm not opposed to removing them it's too awkward looking.
Here's a drawing with no drawers and no lower shelf. Is that the look you were thinking of?
Assuming there is a significant other in your life, the design they choose is the one to build (speaking from experience). Personally, I would go for full-face drawers and lower shelf for utilitarian purposes, as well as appearing more substantial.
I built a hall table similar to your second drawing, from sapele with an inset of smooth, polished Cumbrian slate inset on the top. It gets frequent compliments.
Nice design. I think the taper/angled legs takes umbrage to the rectangular box for the drawer. Drawers with an angle on the face to match the legs and hidden runners or drawers that open from the ends might compliment the taper more. The second stretcher could be the runner for the drawer that way.
The woods you plan to use should be part of the design process. Usually the busier the piece is the more subdued the woods should be. Either let the design speak or the woods, not both.
Whichever design you choose, I would consider moving away from red oak.
Agree with what bluemo said. You have to picture it in use. The hall tables I made have decorative stuff (framed photos, vases, etc.) on them and for that purpose, the lower shelf with stuff on it balances the top. If it is in a hall up against a wall, without the shelf, it can look spindly and top heavy with stuff only on top.
I like the smaller-than-full-width drawer box, inset drawers, and the idea of a shelf. I really like the gaps between the legs and the box. I'd remove the "extra" panels of the drawer box to reduce the number of horizontal lines, move the shelf up to serve as the bottom of the box, and slide the box over to make a small usable shelf from the 2 empty side spaces.
I did a quick chop on the sketch...
Wow. Thanks so much for all the great feedback! You're providing me the critique I really needed, since I don't have any good woodworkers IRL.
Comments about the rectangular box of drawers being inconsistent with the curved legs was really helpful. @mj's comment about creating an upper shelf is interesting and will have to consider that more.
Here's a thought to replicate the curved legs in the drawer design. In this, I'd apply a 3/16" piece of trim made from a contrasting wood, or ebonized R.O., to full-face drawer fronts (drawers shown in yellow, trim shown in orange).
I'm not dead set against the lower shelf. It's definitely more practical, but visually, it makes it heavier...which isn't bad for R.O.
Regarding choice of red oak, I have a bunch from a tree I cut from my yard which I need to use.
I like it but now I want the gaps as MJ suggested on both sides. Maybe 1 larger one.
Grat thread!
I like either of the first two designs. Keep in mind that what ever you put on the top and/or the shelf will effect the overall appearance. Having the bottom shelf will certainly add rigidity to the design. Without the bottom shelf, the design has a lighter "feel". Your design and proportions will support any of the options. As said, go with what your significant other likes best.
Truthfully, all the designs look pretty good to me. A good book I just finished from Lost Art Press is called By Hand and Eye by Tolpin and Walker that came out recently. It’s focused on considerations and how to make good looking furniture. Well worth owning. Lots of use of whole number proportions after you set a must have type dimension. If nothing else, this will make you feel more confident about your design. The one thing they pointed out that stuck with me was what you are trying to do is avoid things that are too extreme in terms of proportions such as legs too thick or skinny, drawer depth below the top too deep, etc. I find keeping that in mind useful. Look forward to seeing your final design update. Another book I’ve started reading by LAP dedicated towards furniture design principles is called Principles of Design. Prior to these two books, I really haven’t seen good sources that teach you how to design good looking furniture irrespective of the period. Tolpin and Walker have touched on it in some of their other books but not as detailed as in this one. I was quite excited when these two LAP books came out.
The last iteration is my prefered one. I would being the drawer flush to the legs, taper ever so slightly the legs going down, have all 4 stretchers at the same level.
Gee Leo why did you make those guitars out of ash? "Had some! " So yah, you have oak so you use it. And nothing beats free for cheap! Red oak for some reason has become unpopular in the last few years. I think maybe because of Euro style white oak cabinetry that is featured everywhere. I have lots of red oak in my own house, I like it! "Ugh , its so 1970s!" Eventually things go full swing and it wouldn't surprise me if red oak makes a come back and people will look at white oak(and subway tile) and say " Ugh, that's so 2020's! "
I think for your design consideration it would depend on what it is intended for. With the drawer it becomes a functional utilitarian piece of furniture..a place to throw your keys when you come in the door etc. Without the drawer, to me, it suggests that that side table exists to display something else. Functions as a pedestal for the big vase of flowers or some grand object. Nice if you have more house than you need so you can dedicate space to just decoration.
Red oak does not have to be all noisy random cathedrals. Hopefully the tree was milled thoughtfully, and the parts will be cut with intention.
Considering the curves in your legs, search for info on choosing and orienting riftsawn lumber for legs here on the FW site.
I'm with MJ on the use of red oak. It will take some careful choosing of the pieces to make a light feeling piece of furniture out of red oak. Rift sawn legs will help a lot. You can use the varying look of the grain from one area of the boards to another to your advantage. I would make the top and drawer fronts out of much more flowing grain chosen carefully. The legs and frame pieces out of straight grain, mild looking pieces. Also the breadboard ends.
The bottom shelf and stretchers that support it will add lots of strength to the table, as any force on one leg will be transmitted to all four. I would leave it out only if the aesthetics of your table require it. Again, I would choose the grain of the shelf to compliment the grain of the top and drawer fronts. I would make the two drawer fronts out of one piece of wood with a distinctive grain pattern so that the pattern flows from one drawer to the next.
I notice that the lower and upper stretchers are set back a bit (1/8"?) from the fronts of the legs, and there is a similar lip between the breadboard ends and the top (which I like a lot). I would carry that design feature into the drawer area as well, making the drawer box protrude similarly from the stretcher below it. I would use inset drawers as drawn, and have them set back into the box just slightly, maybe half as much as the box protrudes.
To bring the curve of the legs into the drawer box area, you can either shape the outsides of the drawer boxes to a slight curve, or just choose the "straight" grain box side frame pieces with a slight curve to their grain that mimics the curve of the legs. You can also choose curved grain for the fronts of the upper stretchers that is slightly convex upward, giving a slight lift to the structure that will make it feel a bit lighter.
Another thing to consider would be to make the top as a frame and panel top instead of just with breadboard ends. That would connect it with the design of the drawers and the shelf, which are visually a frame surrounding a panel. As you have drawn for the breadboard ends, I would have the panel of the top slightly recessed from the level of the frame.
I try to carry a "theme" throughout my design, and not have a design element occur just once. Theme and variations is not just for musical compositions!
Good luck with your design!
Oh my! So much good feedback. Thank you all.
Great reminders about wood selection for grain, set back, functionality. @jharveyb those are great details for me to consider!
@joeleonetti, the LAP "By Hand & Eye" caught my eye too. Love their IG posts.
More refining to do...
I like your initial version without the lower shelf. I wouldn't change anything. As for the red oak comments, ignore them. As much as I personally hate red oak from all the overuse in banks and offices in the 80s and 90s, it's not for me to say I don't like your choice of wood for your project.
At some point you need to cut some wood.
All the designs in the world will not reflect what it will look/fell like in the real world.
Wood grain, shadow lines, hardware, finish and so on. These are just a few of the many things that need to be considered, you can only get so far with a line drawing. Don't obsess over it
I would avoid the shelf. It's quite an elegant design (and as such perhaps suited to lighter grain) I think you have gone as far as you can go without making some shavings.
The breadboard ends might be an opportunity to extend the design a little.
Design wise I'd agree, "no shelf" Although I can't be the only one who was told month/years later "I love it but I wish it had a shelf." By the folks that use the pieces. Made a small end table for Mom years ago and my sister loved it and wanted one, "but with a shelf".
And if you have a Hispanic wife the purse is never hitting the ground. The shelf is a good place for the purse.
Hard decision.
If you need to use that red oak, which as you say you have a bunch, why not make two or three of varying design? Keep the one that you like and donate the other(s) to say an Elder Care Facility, or some such.