I have read a number of post in this forum both recently and in the past where others have been as frustrated as myself in the ridiculous prices charged for quality lumber used in furniture construction due to the lack of a available hardwood trees in the surrounding area. As an example, where we have an abundance of pine trees and not much else, $9-$11 dollars per board foot of cherry is the going rate and that is only if you will purchase 100 bf. Due to the lack of hardwoods, the mini mills are also unavailable. Most of the businesses will not sell retail. They only want to deal with cabinet shops that will use large quantities each month. The only choices I am aware of is the Woodcraft Store which is very customer oriented but expensive, and another company that is run by pirates and the price quote is totally dependant on which direction the wind is blowing the day you visit.
My question is this; Has anyone had experience or ever considered a lumber co-op? Was the experience good or not? What pitfalls may be out there?
My thought is that a group of 5-10 people in relatively close proximity of each other would get together and purchase a larger quantity of lumber at one time. Possibly 500 to 1000 bf (or more) and maybe get a reasonable price. This same idea could also work well in areas with a larger selection of hardwoods available. My experience with the on-line suppliers is the quality can vary substantially and that by the time you pay shipping, you are not saving any money.
Any thoughts on this subject? My profile will tell my area.
Thank you in advance for your input,
Replies
You might try one of the on-line sources such as "http://www.niagaralumber.com/".
I don't use them as I have a good local source (SE Michigan) but a friend has had good luck with them.
Frosty
"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
Frosty,
I looked at the web site you referred me too, The prices are pretty good compared to others I have looked at. I put it in my favorites which will allow me to refer back to it at a later time .
Thank you, Screen
Frosty: Se MI ? Johnson's in Charlotte?? or GR??
James
James,I used to go to Johnson's but haven't for many years: It was a long drive and I found the selection somewhat limited. (I was a real newbie then and perhaps did not see the whole operation. As I remember it, their selection was stored on-end in a long building.)I now use Armstrong Lumber. They are on the south side of M-59 about 4 miles east of US-23. They have a very large selection which is stored in horizontal 'bays' so it is easy to sort through the boards and select what you want. They do custom millwork so they are in a position to surface the rough-sawn if you wish.It is family run and they are a great bunch of guys. I don't think there are any bargains but the quality and selection are good. No credit cards - cash or check only.Frosty"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
screename
I understand your concern. I've solved the problem and you can too.. you've got the solution a wood co-op.
I buy my wood for a fraction of what you pay but if you want hardwood in an area where it isn't common you must ship it (and frieght is getting more and more expensive..)
I have a buddy in San Diego I live in Minnesota.. when I visit him I haul 600 bd.ft. or so of wood and he pays me what I paid for the wood plus my gas round trip..
He couldn't use 600 bd.ft. in 5 years but he has buddies. This trip it's walnut the next trip it's white oak another trip was cherry etc.. The only way this works is a willingness to buy everytime, and to share and trade pieces between each other..
I bring him mill run wood rather than graded wood.. the reason is the price is so much lower and millrun has all the good stuff not sorted out.. Some is FAS or #1or2 there is also burl and fiddleback and all sorts of interesting wood (along with a small percentage of just poor grade stuff) ..
The deal they worked out is they pull numbers out of a hat for the way it comes off the truck. Then when their stack is all seperated they start to trade between each other.. One guy wants wide FAS boards and he may trade some boards with character.. Some one may take lower grade wood if he gets more of it because his projects are all small and he can cut around knots etc..
They are friendly and excited to see what arrived and my buddy who may not need wood for a while could trade off his chances to eliminate his share of the costs. Or take more wood if he wants that type etc..
You'll find a ready amount of reasonably priced wood here in the midwest as well along the whole east coast. Don't forget that you have wood we don't. Sitka Spruce for musical insrruments and light airplanes,, redwood, cedar, etc.. I've heard of guys buying cedar logs and hand splitting their own shingles saving thousands of dollars doing so..
a really heavy duty 1/2 ton Pickup will haul about 600 bd.ft. of wood per trip a heavy duty 3/4 will haul nearly 1000bd.ft. add a good heavy duty trailer and that can be doubled..
To check on prices there is a magazine published regularly called hardwood market report. that tells what sawmills recieve for wood of various grades and types.. Oops I see you are in the Florida area I assumed you were in the pacNW.
there are a lot of sawmills in the Appalachiansthat would be much closer than we are their prices are only fractionally higher than ours.. still well below a 1/3 of what you are paying for cherry..
Edited 3/15/2008 11:22 am ET by frenchy
Good idea!Anyone in the Lower Mainland of BC interested in doing something like this? I am in the market for cherry, maple and non Asian mahogany (preferably central american)CheersPeter
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
Frenchy,
Thank you for your reply.
More and more I am thinking that a Co-op may be the way to go. I know there are other WW in this area that are as frustrated as I am with the prices. The Appalachians are not necessarily a day trip but could easily be handled in a couple of days during the week or weekend. If I could find lumber for about 1/3 of the price; then even after the fuel cost, there would be a savings.
Using Woodfinder.com I did find a mini mill within 100 miles of where I live. He preferred to sell wholesale but would have sold me what he called Southern Black Cherry(kiln dried) at $8.00 per bf with a minimum of 250 bf. I don't think he was doing me any favors. However with a co-op I might have gotten a decent price on a 1000 bf whether it was all the same material or not.
Another thing I am considering is to purchase about 500 bf of the most common woods used around these parts, which would be cherry, red oak, maple, and poplar and to sell it to other frustrated WW at a cost to cover my expenses. I recently finished my dream workshop that allows room for storage without interfering with work space. Even with this method a Co-op could still benefit all involved.
When you request the mill run quality, do you know approximately how much savings are involved over the same amount in 1st and 2nd quality? I would think the owners of the sawmills would prefer to sell this way so they do not end up with a bunch of culls and nobody to buy them. Do you get enough of the quality lumber to make it worth while?
Thank you for your help, Screen
screen
No at those prices he wasn't doing you any favor.. my somewhat old price guide shows sawmills are selling 4/4 southern cherry at
$2.35/ FAS, 2.34/1f 1.33/1c .65/2a .40/2c these prices are about 10 to 20% high to todays market prices.
Mill run would be about $1.45 around here they charge 10cents a bd.ft. to grade wood and it used to be 40 cents to kiln dry (I suspect it's up a lot from that, maybe up to $1.00 a bd.ft. Just for information, don't get kiln dried wood.. sticker it up yourself and air dry it..it will take about a year.. if you have indoor storage space maybe less if it's heated and airconditioned.. (airconditoning really dries out wood) You do know the trick of a baggy and a dehumidifier don't you if you pick up loads at differant times of the year?
Roughly calculating 25% of a log will be FAS, 40% will be grade 1, 25% will be grade 2 and the rest is grade three. (burls are grade 3, rotted wood can also be grade three)
When you buy mill run you need to be carefull that is what you get. Some mills will sort out higher grade wood and call the remainder mill run. Some mills will cherry pick out pieces with great character..
Mill run should be just as it's cut off the log.. and the sawyer should saw for grade the same as he does on all orders..
Sawing for grade means that as he approaches the center of the log where knots and other"defects" are he turns it to yield higher grade out of a log rather than flat or thru & thru sawing .
You need to find the overlooked sawmill.. find a sawmill that normally saws for pallets or railroad ties. doesn't kiln dry will sell only by the "lift" (or bundle)
Sawmills that advertize or market will be at near retail prices as you found out ..
In addition don't make it sound like this is going to be a one time purchase..
"Hello, I'm looking for a hardwood supplier, can you tell me what your price is on a lift of say 4/4 mill run cherry? Oak? Popular? It that true mill run or do you sort out?" Slab cut or do you turn for grade? what sort of notice do you require?
(that last sentence is surprisingly helpful).. It means that you intend to do buisness and won't waste a lot of their time.
When you get there it is proper to ask if they mind if you verify the quality of the wood. bring a pair of snips with you as well as a pair of gloves. a glance at the board should be sufficent to determine defects/grade so don't waste a lot of time, glance and toss it in the truck before you get a third of the way down you should have a decent idea of the quality involved and if it's acceptable go ahead and have him use his lift to finish loading you..
You don't need to be an expert grader to tell if a board is FAS or grade three typically a six foot section of a board free from defects is FAS exact doesn't really matter what the rest of the grades are..if 20 to 30 percent of what you look at is pretty decent chances are you have mill run.. a look around should tell you if he sorts out the great pieces.. It's common that some pieces are displayed sawmills get into the business because they like wood but if there are whole areas of selected wood that'sa warning that the pile has be cherry picked..
Frenchy,
Thank you for the information. You have been very helpful.
Screename56
Frenchy,
I will have to plead ignorance.
I don't know about the baggy and dehumidifier. I am guessing that the baggy would be duct taped to the end of a piece of lumber, then the amount of condensation that appears inside the bag will show how dry the wood is. As for the dehumidifier; if the storage room is closed off and a dehumidifier is running 24/7, this would probably speed up the drying process. Is this a close guess?
I do understand that the lumber will need to be separated with 1x2 which allows air to circulate better and this would help drying also. The 1x2 will need to be on 2 foot centers to adequately support the wood during the drying process.
Since there would not be a huge quantity of lumber, I may be able to figure out a way to build a small inexpensive kiln on my property and dry it myself. For a dollar a board foot , it would be worth it. I think I remember a video that FWW had on kiln drying when they did a series of articles on mini-mills a couple of months ago.
I am a little confused about the air drying and kiln drying. In the past I heard that only kiln dried lumber should be used in furniture construction. Apparently air dried is acceptable if dried properly. Is this correct?
Thank you for your help, Screen
screenname
Absolutely! fine antiques were made with air dried lumber.. all kiln drying does is speed up the process.. and add risks. (oh and in some cases cause the wood to lose brillance and color (black walnut for example) You can't case harden or honeycomb air dried wood for example.
The "baggy" is just poly wrapped and sealed around a stack of properly stickered wood. one end leads to the dehumidifier.. the only time you need to do that is when you want to"kiln dry" your wood or you have a fresh load of wood that you don't want it's moisture to slow up the drying process of wood you've already got..
As for running the dehumidifier 24/7 what will you do with the excess water?.. I mean we can pull gallons out in a 24 hour period at first..
I'll be happy to talk you through the process but there is a lot of stuff available for referance and if you have a need to be exact..I did at first but as I gained experiance I relaxed. One warning, maple is a real bear to dry without damage. Most other wood is a piece of cake once you learn to relax and do it the easy way..
Kiln drying properly needs to be done carefully because you can cause issues. I like to let air drying work it's magic if there is time. If not then I plan on checking the wood frequently and according to a schedule I set up..
Let me give you one warning.. Kiln drying is like a lot of things, it can be done several ways and done successfully.. so if so and so says that you must do it this way because he knows, he's been doing it that way for years and it's never failed. He may be right.. and yet someone else can do it their way and be just as right but done differantly. Opinions can be pretty strong on this subject..
a couple of points. stickers need to be lined up one on top of another. otherwise you will get wavy wood.
second don't let anyone talk you into weighting down the wood.. Strap it down instead.. weights are most often cement blocks and other stuff which leave grit behind and that tears up your blades.
I buy those inexpensive ratching straps and set them directly over the stickers. You will need to tighten up the straps the next day and then a few days later and then about a week later etc.. when several months go by without the need for retightening you are approaching dried.
One final warning.. this is addictive.. I mean crazy nuts kind of addictive.. Hello my name is frenchy and I'm a woodaholic kind of issue..
I'll bet I've bought 15,000 bd.ft. more than I need simply because my sawmill understands my addiction..they manage to make me a deal too great to refuse!
Examples? I have well over 1000 bd.ft. of fiddleback maple. I paid 10 cents a bd.ft. because it had been stickered up for well over a year and they hadn't found a buyer for it.. It turned grey and black and looked like well, trash.. there was even some mushrooms growing on some of it..
First pass thru the planer and my heart lept! We're tlaking about fine violin backs that I've seen sell for $450.00 in the Grizzly catalog.. For a dime a bd.ft.
and the mushrooms? Can you say spalted? Spalted fiddle back! 10 cents!
Oh and another deal Mother nature simply doesn't grow her trees to the even inch. there are always pieces of wood that are less than an inch thick which really have no market. so they are shredded into mulch or bundled up and sold as slab wood..
My sawmill seperates them for me and sells me a pickup truck load for $30.00 doesn't matter what kind of wood. Cherry, black walnut, maple, elm, oak, whatever!
$30 for about 600 bd.ft. of wood (and if I don't watch him carefully it gets closer to 800 ft <grin>)
Disgusting isn't it? I mean I sort them into piles.. 3/4& over, 1/2 & over3/8ths and over, fire wood (some would use those as veneer but when you have solid wood why mess around)? The thinner ones dry faster, the thicker ones take longer but I have so little into them It's kind of a sin of gluttony..
I could go on and on about the deal but remember this can become an addiction..
I mean you put this board the sawmill tossed onto the pile through the planer and see all this beautiful character and wild grain jump out at you. Now you have a real problem.. what can you build worthy of that piece of wood,, and that one and those and ahhh! addiction!
"One final warning.. this is addictive.. I mean crazy nuts kind of addictive.. Hello my name is frenchy and I'm a woodaholic kind of issue.."Thanks, that put a smile on my face this morning.
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
Peter
What is zoodles and poutine?
Just curious, Screen
I usually post at Cooks Talk and that is where it came from. It seems that the tag line follows me throughout the Taunton forums.Zoodles are a tinned pasta concoction made by Heinz. Poutine is a Quebec dish that is locally famous.Cheers,Peter
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
Is poutine related to poontang?
Frenchy,
Once again ;Thank you,
You have answered all of my questions at this time. I will leave you alone for now.
Since starting this communication with you , I have researched different areas using Craigs List and found some definite possibilities for hardwood suppliers. Your info has been very helpful as far as pricing, lumber mills, and other aspects of this woodworking addiction that many in Knots can understand. There are worst things in this world to be addicted too.
Hello, my name is Screename56 and I have gone 2 days without working on a piece of lumber (mainly because I have been too busy painting my shop built for WW)
Sincerely, Screen
"Absolutely! fine antiques were made with air dried lumber.. all kiln drying does is speed up the process.. and add risks."
True frenchy, but don't forget that antiques were built at a time when houses were more like intermittenly heated sheds than the relatively well climate controlled and heated buildings we occupy now. Many an antique self destructed as the wood shrank when moved from a draughty old Georgian pile to a more modern house.
"(oh and in some cases cause the wood to lose brillance and color (black walnut for example)"
Also true, but I've generally found it's almost impossible to tell the difference between an air dried piece of walnut and a kiln dried piece twelve months or two years after the wood goes into service. I've mixed air dried and kiln dried English walnut in single pieces of furniture. The different material was indistinguishable one from another once UV rays and oxidation had done their thing to the wood for a while. However, I have to say that ocassionally I do come across an air dried piece of walnut, or some other wood species, that retain those colour differences for quite a number of years, even a decade or more. I'm not sure why that occurs every now and then.
"You can't case harden or honeycomb air dried wood for example."
Of course you can, but perhaps not in the climate you're drying wood in. All you need to do to induce both faults is to dry the wood too fast. A hot desert climate would be an ideal one to cause both faults, but a somewhat less extreme climate will also do it. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
Sgian Dubh
absolutely points well taken.. I'm glad you added them saved me from the work..
I especially agree that some pieces of air dried black walnut retain their brillance and color for a very long time.. However every single piece of black walnut that has been kiln dried (steamed or not) still has that mottled brown look
I suspect UV is the guilty party why it's not so on all walnut..
Frenchy--
I see that you are in Mtka--we're almost neighbors! I live in Bryn Mawr, but my shop is in Annandale. I have questions for you...
1. Are you going to be in the Northern Woods show this year?
2. Are you willing to part with some of that fiddleback maple?
ThanksPeter
www.jpswoodworking.com
peter,
I'm sorry all the fiddleback is going to a couple of spots. In fact I'll have to use some regular to cover the shortages.
Probably not going..
From experience I know that you can trun really nice wood into junk, that wants to close in on the blade, in less than two weeks in a Vegas garage.
Kiln dried wood, used to do the pretzel, if you left it with out stickers and weight.
True frenchy, but don't forget that antiques were built at a time when houses were more like intermittenly heated sheds than the relatively well climate controlled and heated buildings we occupy now. Many an antique self destructed as the wood shrank when moved from a draughty old Georgian pile to a more modern house.
DAMN! Your post reminden me of when I went into the Army here in the USA..
I could see the stars through the roof when I lay in bed trying to go to sleep! AND I was INDOORS in a wooden building.. If you want to call it that! LENNONWOOD MO!
SgianDubh,
There is nothing in a kiln that imparts magic into the wood.. it is simply a way of drying.. air drying can be just as effective.
Don't forget that those antiques were in rooms that rapidly went from cold unheated places to roaring fireplaces. Then back again. Rooms weren't heated until occupied.. Those temp swings and worse humidity changes are far less severe than our moden, well enclosed homes. The destruction you speak of may have occured because a desk which had previously endured a relatively moist existance suddenly was dried out to a degree the original builders hadn't built it to..
That does not mean that todays builders familar with the demands cannot make the required allowances..
frenchy, when you said, "The destruction you speak of may have occured because a desk which had previously endured a relatively moist existance suddenly was dried out to a degree the original builders hadn't built it to.." you were essentially agreeing with the point I made, and primarily expanded on the detail. Older houses generally experienced higher ranges of relative humidity than modern houses, or old houses that have been upgraded with better insulation and improved climate control systems.
I find this statement you made interesting, "There is nothing in a kiln that imparts magic into the wood.. it is simply a way of drying.. air drying can be just as effective." What's interesting about it is that people forget, or perhaps don't realise, that air drying and all the different types kiln drying use the same vehicle to dry the wood, ie, air. Nearly every piece of wood that's dried before uses that range from construction grade material to furniture grade material is dried with air.
The essential difference is that kiln drying provides a means of controlling the temperature and relative humidity of the air, how fast and where it moves over and around the wood, and includes a means to remove the water extracted from the wood out of the kiln. A skilled kiln operator is able to produce consistently dried and stress free wood in a known time period, and at a pre-determined price. Wood stickered up outside to air dry is almost wholly dependent upon nature which determines how fast or slow the stack dries-- and in many climates the wood isn't dry enough for furniture grade use at the end of the process. The end user can't be given a definite delivery date or precisely determined moistue content for the end product.
There are limited measures someone air drying wood can do to add control. Without the space to detail all of them, here are a few techniques used to add limited 'control' and 'predictability' to air drying:
sticker size;
horizontal spaces between planks;
stack width-- stack length and height has very limited bearing on drying rate;
spaces between stacks;
a purpose built shed that helps direct air movement and offers protection from rain and direct sun;
forced air drying methods;
accelerated air drying (ie heated air);
low temperature warehouse drying:
climate chambers.
I'm afraid I haven't the time to discuss each of the above bullet points in detail, but they are valid methods of adding some control to the job, many of which commercial driers use prior to kiln drying in a variety of kiln types. Slainte
Richard Jones Furniture
Edited 3/21/2008 1:23 pm by SgianDubh
SgianDubh,
I'm glad that you agree with me that there is no magic in a kiln. The advantages you speak of are advantages of cost.
By spending some on heat etc.. you can more quickly turn green wood into something to build furniture out of. That saves money. Because you don't have to floorplan a whole years worth of wood to have a steady supply.
However every point you made in favor of Kiln drying can be done by a person using the same judgement and control to air dry.
Look at me.. With no prior experiance and simple reading on the subject I've been able to air dry 50,000 bd.ft. of hardwood..
I haven't lost but maybe a 100 bd.ft. to problems or mistakes. in that whole pile.. So I saved around $50,000 which to me is considerable.. Since I bought more wood than I could possibly use at one time the time involved isn't serious..
Now that took some time, but not all that much.. Some work, ditto and some attention, ditto.
I don't know where you live frenchy, apart from somewhere in the middle of the US, but air drying alone here in the UK, anywhere in the UK, won't, straight off the stack, produce wood suitable for making furniture . I've never found wood drier than 15% MC straight off the pile in this country and that was an exception. It's usually wetter at about 18%- 20% MC. That's typically as low is it'll dry to here. Further conditioning of the wood is required. A short kiln run will do it, or the wood can be stacked in a dry building to further reduce MC.
18%- 20% MC is about right for construction grade material, and about 15% MC is about right for sheltered joinery in a house, but furniture grade needs to be closer to 10% MC. 13% MC is a bit on the high side really, although manageable, and I generally reckon that a good MC to make most internal furniture is between 7% and 10%.
You've obviously managed to save a lot of money doing what you've done, but I'm curious about the MC levels you achieve with your air drying. If you get the stuff down to 10% then you obviously live in a dry climate where atmospheric RH hovers somewhere around 45% to 55% for extended periods. Slainte.
Richard Jones Furniture
Edited 3/21/2008 4:21 pm by SgianDubh
SgianDubh,
Minnesota, southern minnesota you-all <grin> what dries out our wood here is winter.. in the house during the middle of the winter it's easy to get below 7% moisture, well below it.. Just ask my dry throat every night..
Any wood left indoors in A/C will also dry out that much.. A/C is really a dehumidier pumping gallons of water outside..
Once dried down to the point where the water originally bound into a cell wood is released should be aclimatized to whatever normal moisture level are.. then wood will, even kiln dried wood stabalize at the moisture enviornment present..
Take a chunk of wood below 7 percent moisture, put it together tightly and as the moisture of 15% or whatever causes it to swell you will have issues.. as you well know..
West of the Great Lakes then and a long way from an ocean. I can only imagine how dry and cold it gets there with all that cold air coming south over the land mass of Canada, especially in the winter.
I thought living in Texas for ten years exposed me to a pretty ropey climate-- actually I reckoned the climate in Houston was probably just about the most miserable one that could have been dreamed up by an evil climatologist. Perhaps Minnesota would come in a close second, ha, ha.
I'm pretty happy to again be living in the UK climate. All us Brits moan pathetically about our weather all the time, but really it's pretty kind without any great extremes of heat, cold or humidity. But it won't generally air dry wood below about 18% MC. Slainte.
Richard Jones Furniture
Edited 3/22/2008 7:41 am by SgianDubh
SgianDubh,
Well you are partially correct.. Minnesota has more than 10,000 lakes and we are on the edge of the great lakes chain.. (Lake Superior defines our Northeast border) The Mississippi starts in Minnesota and average rainfall is just short of a bizillion inches. (that's metric inches not Whitworth inches)
Snow in the winter is measured in feet.. As we speak, 2 nd day of spring we are expecting another 6 to 10 inches of snow, we got 9 inches yesterday.. flakes so big they knocked buses and Semi-trucks off the road.
There are books written about how cold things are around here.. Our Ox have been know to turn blue from the cold and never warm up enough in the summer to turn back.
While that sounds extrodinary if you read the Book about Paul Bunyun you have it confirmed.. look it up.
Yesterday the coldest spot in the nation was in Minnesota.. it's almost always the coldest.. so cold they named it Embaress Minnesota, again you can look that up..
40 below is not an uncommon tempurature here some winters.. and we celibrate any time the weatherman stops owing us tempurature, "it's minus 3 outside going down to 19 below overnight" To give you an idea of how cold it is, Russians who migrate here often leave because they can't endure the cold. On the other hand that cold does allow us to live longer than other states.. things just keep better in the freezer..
Summer on the other hand is loud, we have misquitos here bigger than a Texas Long Horn.. mean too.. Why two or three of them have been known to fly off with small children and pets. To conserve ammo though we aren't allowed to shoot at any misquito under 35#. Actaully it's considered bad form to mount a throphy misquito that weighs less than 150#'s. The real throphys though are the rare double billed misquitos who drain two victims at one time. Because we have so many fat Germans and Swedes around here they can sometimes exceed 1000#'s Now those are really rare mounted over someones fireplace. But it's really something when you see one..
Did I mention humidity? Well things get so humid around here during the summer we have to squeeze air out of the clouds to breathe. You see in additon to over 10,000 lakes That's our state slogan. (you can look that up too) we have a lot of wetlands. (Polite word for swamp) as well as less than 5 acre ponds which aren't considered lakes. Warm too, temps above 100 degree happen regularly.
There is so much waterfront here that a home that doesn't have it is considered deficent and not worth nearly as much..
ON the other hand every square inch of land that isn't under water tends to have a couple of trees on it.. mostly hardwoods like Black Walnut, white oak, cherry, etc.. That makes wood really cheap around here.. farmers start to cut down trees to plant some corn and by the time they get all the trees cut down in a field with all that water they've grown back even bigger than before. We have more trees now in Minnesota than ever before.. In 1950 the counted all of the trees with a diameter of greater than 20 inches and there were over 5 million. today that number is over 20 million. (you can look that up too)
So do you think Texas climate is bad huh? When can we expect you?
"When can we expect you?"
Never! Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
Would you mind sharing the name of your supplier or suppliers? I am quite a bit north of screen.. and the last wholesale order (300bdft) of 4/4 FAS cherry cost $7/bdft. I need at least another 1000bdft or so and would go through the hassel ordering from the US, but after watching the woodweb or woodplanet I rarely see 4/4 Cherry much under $5. I have also checked some of the internet stores, and they are worse.
Thanks
brad805,
Gladly I assume you've read all that has been posted if you haven't would you take a few minutes and please read it?
I do Business with Johnson logging in Cannon Falls Minnesota Sorry I don't have the phone number handy, check with information.
Connie is now retired but sometimes works the phones, Dan is running it now and his son Seth is there sometimes as well.
I hadnt, but will. I can find the number.
Thanks
Maybe its time to take a lumber run out of the state.
Ted,
You might be right.
Screen
You think that's bad, go out and buy a dozen eggs.
?
Better life through Zoodles and poutine...
Have you tried Mike Morgan at palumber.com? You can find him on the other woodwork site. He seems to focus on the hobby types and has group buys now and again. The prices on his site will half your previous offer. As I understand he makes group buys to various areas and takes a drive to deliver to various areas.
Brad
Brad,
Thak you for the website for PA Lumber. Their prices seem very good. I have added them to my favorites.
Screen
Watch for his delivery trips on the creek site. I recall he has one to florida in the near future. Seems like a pretty decent person.
Brad
I tried to get a deal on a truck load for a bunch of friends thats 10,000 bf and the Atlanta Hardwood the largest wood seller in the south east gave me some BS prices as I was not a dealer.. I could do to a smaller place on the north side of town and buy 100 bf at about a dollar less a bf.....
Check my home page http://www.rexmill.com for my friends Justin website and ebay store
http://stores.ebay.com/EXOTIC-WOODS-OF-THE-WORLD_W0QQssPageNameZl2QQtZkm
He has the best prices hands down any place I have found he also has a website by the same name with more stock.. Tell him I sent you.. You do have to pay shipping but its still much lower than most places even added in..
Also read the fine print as this is not all FAS unless it says so.. I bough 669 bf of Af. Mahogany for $669 two or three years ago and paif shipping from Tenn. to Atl, GA area as about $200 about a $1.30 a bf
I can't even buy secondary wood for my projects because this stuff was so cheap..
Here is the website link
http://www.exoticwoodsoftheworld.com/
-rarebear-
http://www.rexmill.com My Hand Plane Resource
Edited 3/22/2008 2:49 pm ET by rarebear
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