Replies

1. 
   mike4244 | Aug 01, 2003 10:15pm | #1

   Will, put doors at each end of shop, or at least a window in a straight line from door. Since your shop is limited in length another opening helps when sawing longer work. Depending on the work you do I would consider 9'-0" ceilings. You will be able to turn sheet goods without hitting ceiling. Higher is better but you mentioned you need airconditioning, the higher the ceilings the more it will cost. Put more than a couple of windows in, I would put at least two in each wall. Put the airconditioner in a framed hole in the wall , not in a window.My own shop is 20x 30 with 8'-0" ceilings, 10" pitch roof and a loft above for storage. I originally was going to go with 9'-0" ceilngs but local building restrictions have a height limit. I would have to make the pitch of the roof less and lose some loft area or lower ceiling height. I went with incandescent bulbs instead of flurescent, personal choice, cost had nothing to do with it.

   3/4" plywood is fine for floor, Advantage Osb is a better choice. Does not delaminate when wet, regular Osb and plywood will swell up. This is probably more important in the building stage than when closed in.

   Are you going to do the work yourself? You can build this structure for $7000.00 if you do most of the work yourself. You could probably put in a crawl space foundation and make the building 20x 30 for $10000.00 if you are not paying for labor.

   Mike

2. 
   hazakdds | Aug 01, 2003 10:16pm | #2

   Hi Will, I'm going throught kinda the same thing.  I have half of a 2 car garage to make my own, and have gotten many good ideas from the crew here.  Some good books are right here on the host's website.  Multiple books on building a shop, with insulating, wiring, dust collection... etc.  I've spent about $50.00 on books so far in researching this subject.  Money well spent.  Good luck, I'll be watching this string very closely.

   -Marc

3. 
   bill_1010 | Aug 01, 2003 11:21pm | #3

   id do 9' Tall walls.   Id set scissor trusses to allow for a slightly vaulted ceiling.

   Foundation id suggest slab-on-grade with vapor barrier under a rebared slab.  In humid climates youd have moisture problems in a crawl space.   This would speed up the floor and reduce scheduling of a blocklayer.  The slab would include your footings and floor and be done at the same time.  

   Even if you opt to not use a garage door, frame as if you were.  Go in behind and frame up for your doors.  This is in case you must convert to car space latter or at resale.  

   Avoid windows on south side of building to lessen solar gain. The will help reduce conditioning costs.  Id nix the skylights and opt for full spectrum FL Lighting. The skylights will add to solar gain and heat your shop. 

   Wire in plenty of 240v as well as 120v. 

4. 
   bleubassplyr | Aug 01, 2003 11:52pm | #4

   Will,

   I built a 16' x 24' shop almost 2 years ago. It has a monolythic slab floor-concrete with wire mesh and is 8-12" thick on the edges and about 6" thick in the middle. It's designed to float as one large piece rather than crack. I was advised this was the way to go because a wood floor would have to be elevated and I might end up having problems in the winter with animals under my workshop. I do miss the comfort of wood floors. I added rubber mats in the places I work most. I bought these at Home Depot for about $20 each.

   I have plenty of windows which is great for lighting. I have a double door, with windows, at one end and a 36" wide steel door at the other. This is great for ventilation in the summer.

   I built mine with an 8' ceiling which is fine for me. 9' would be great if you can do it. I wouldn't use the scissor trusses because it would take away from making an attic space you can use as storage. I don't know what I'd do without the storage I have above my workshop. I have a pull down stair unit that's great.

   My biggest regret is that I put the outlets about a foot off the floor. Higher would have been better. Have some 220 outlets put in if you can. Motion lights outside, a natural gas heater, and outdoor outlets are other suggestions I'm glad I went with. I used OSB for the interior walls and T111 for the exterior walls. If you don't own a framing nail gun, I would highly recommend buying one. It'll cut the job in half.

   Good luck with your project.

1. 
   jackiechan | Aug 02, 2003 06:25am | #6

   Bleu,

   It would be fairly easy for an electrician to raise your electrical outlets to a more convenient height.  The lower one wouldn't even have to be disconnected - the higher one could tap into the existing wiring.  Outlets are like clamps, you can never have too many.  Just watch that you don't overload the circuit.Dan Kornfeld, Owner/President - Odyssey Wood Design, Inc.

5. 
   jobranch | Aug 02, 2003 03:46am | #5

   Add a dust collection system.

6. 
   WayneL5 | Aug 02, 2003 06:29am | #7

   My first shop had 8' ceilings and I kept whacking the lights when I flipped boards over.  You won't be able to flip a sheet of plywood over easily with 8' ceilings.  In my new shop I have scissor trusses, with 9' at the ends and 12' at the peaks.  I like it much better.

   Acoustic tile for the ceiling is ugly, but will help with noise.

   Consider installing your electrical service as a subpanel from the main at the house.  It makes reworking and adding circuits much easier.  You can hook something up to 220 in the future quite easily.  And you don't have to walk back to the house if you trip a breaker.  Put the lights on a circuit separate from the outlets so you won't be in the dark if you overload a tool.

   A telephone is nice.

   I put all my outlets about 8" above workbench height all around the room.  If your floor is slab on grade all your outlets will have to be GFCI protected, which is no big problem.  An outdoor light is nice, as well as an outdoor outlet (which must be GFCI).

   If you ever think you will mount heavy wood storage brackets to the walls, make sure the studs run continuously from bottom to top.  In other words, don't frame your gable ends with a rectangular wall topped by a triangular wall.  A load of wood can weigh a thousand pounds or more and it pulls in on the wall quite a bit.

   Some folks finish the walls with 3/4" plywood instead of gypsum wallboard so the can hang almost anything anywhere.

   There have been lots of discussions about workshops in Breaktime.  Check the archives.

7. 
   migraine | Aug 02, 2003 05:48pm | #8

   As wide and big as you can afford(borrow money if you have too)

   Do it right the first time

   100 amp sub panel

   rollup doors both ends

   Run all wires through 3/4" emt conduit -not 1/2"

   Don't cheat on materials 

   2x6 isulated walls with as tall as a wall allowed, even though that requires and engineer. 

   Don't cut corners

   Add dual insulated windows

   Use a masonary/concrete foundation

   Design it so you can add on later for little cost

   Add a bathroom.  My wife has screamed at me for 8 years about getting saw dust every where

   dehumidifier if necessary

   Buy good paint

   Shear panel the inside, makes hanging things easier

   Paint the interior wall pure white - more light reflection

   use semigloss paint on interior - easier to get the dust of the walls

   If you use floressent lights, buy the clear tube covers

   build it right the first time

   get building permits, It will have no resale value if not a permitted structure.  My next door neighbor spent $20,000 on a shop/barn and now he is selling his home the appraiser won't give it any value because it's not permitted

   If you are not sure how to build, hire some one

   Put in a large basin sink out side the door

   etc, etc, etc

8. 
   DennisS | Aug 04, 2003 12:00pm | #9

   Will -

   You really should consider a foundation. I don't really understand what you have in mind but there's no value in trying to build something, even at 19' x 20' without a proper foundation for the walls. Plus what do you plan on resting your wood floor on?

   I'm just getting settled in my new shop that has a concrete floor. Most people here prefer a wood floor for comfort but I, myself, don't have any problems with working on concrete as long as I have a matt of some kind in areas where I tend to stand for long periods of time.

   Nine feet is a good ceiling ht. Any taller in a small shop like you're describing and the space seems a little out of whack. Like working at the bottom of a mine shaft. Lighting becomes an issue with higher ceilings although with your size, if ou finish the sidewalls to get reflectivity, that would help. Don't short change yourself on the lighting budget.

   And yes, lots of outlets all around the space. A 100amp service panel is really the minimum. But if you can afford it, put in a 200amp panel with a 100amp sub feed breaker in your main panel. The 200amp panel will allow you more circuits. In a one person shop you don't really have to worry about having too many tools or stuff running at the same time and it's nice to have the extra capacity that the larger panel provides.

   Plan for your dust/chip collection now while you're "in" the planning stages. I ran a 7" deep utility trench across the width of my shop to route a dust collection duct to the table saw in the middle of the space and the jointer on the other side. I haven't gotten that part procured and installed yet, though.

   In some ways, planning the shop is as much fun as working in it. Give it plenty of thought and whatever you do, do it with the eye on revising it sooner than later. (grin)

   ...........

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

9. 
   Jeff | Aug 04, 2003 02:37pm | #10

   Will

   I don't know if this helps, but here are a few suggestions:

   1) A 9 or 10 ft ceiling is great for overhead clearance.

   2) Wood or concrete floors are ok, as long as they are smooth and

   flat.

   3) Put all tools (and maybe free standing cabinets and benches) on

   wheels.

   4) Have an open area, where you can set up another low assembly table

   or move a piece of equipment into for working with.

   5) Power in the ceiling to drop to whatever location you need it.

   6) I prefer overhead dust collection ducts to allow ease of modification of shop arrangement.

   7) Double or triple the power (100amp min) then you think you need

   now.

   I've built alot of shops over the years, or rebuilt them when they need upgrading.

   With all the tools mobile, I can re-arrange evrything when I feel ####different layout would work better.

   Even my present shop (about 1000sq ft) is never big enough (wish it

   was 2000 sq ft) so flexability is important.

   Good luck

   Jeff

1. 
   WillOBrien | Aug 26, 2003 06:40am | #11

   Thanks guys for all of our comments, they are a big help.  I hope to close on the house this Friday.  There are woods to the side and to the back so I hope to have the shop surrounded with trees.  I will continue to design it for quite a while, as one responder said, it can be as fun designing it as using it.  Right now I plan to have 9' ceilings and lots of power and outlets.  I will continue to go with the wood floor.  The substructure will be much like a deck's substructure, but with the OSB on top of it for the flooring material.  I like the plywood walls idea for easy hanging.

   Thanks again.  I will be watching this string for several months so any additional comments will be appreciated.

   Will